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The 2025 Formula One Season: A Year of Chaos, Comebacks, and the Crown No One Saw Coming

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The 2025 Formula One season began with a strange tension in the air – the kind that precedes a storm. New regulations loomed on the horizon. Power units were about to be rewritten. Teams were already shifting resources toward 2026. And yet, somehow, this was the most unpredictable, volatile, and emotionally charged season in a decade.

It was a year where rookies rose, veterans unraveled, and the sport’s brightest star nearly pulled off the impossible. A year where McLaren rediscovered its swagger, Ferrari rediscovered its misery, and Red Bull rediscovered that Max Verstappen is still Max Verstappen.

And in the end, the championship was decided not by dominance, but by inches – by a single overtake, a single steward’s ruling, a single moment that will be debated for years.

This is the story of 2025…

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I. The Fall of the King

Lewis Hamilton’s arrival at Ferrari was supposed to be a coronation. Instead, it became a cautionary tale.

The early races revealed a driver out of sync with his machinery – a seven‑time champion wrestling with brakes he didn’t trust, a chassis that refused to rotate, and a transmission geared for a world that didn’t exist. The Ferrari SF‑25 was a paradox: sluggish in a straight line, unpredictable under braking, and allergic to acceleration.

Hamilton’s frustration seeped through the radio. His engineer’s patience thinned. The tifosi’s hope evaporated. By mid‑season, the verdict was clear: Hamilton hadn’t joined Ferrari — he’d been swallowed by it.

Photo created by Microsoft Co-pilot using the information from our episode.

II. The Rise of the Papaya Empire

McLaren, meanwhile, had built a weapon.

Lando Norris and Oscar Piastri opened the season like a two‑headed hydra, trading wins in Melbourne and Shanghai. Their car was light, agile, and devastatingly quick in clean air. For a moment, it looked like the Constructors’ Championship would be wrapped by summer.

But beneath the papaya paint, cracks formed.

Team orders grew murky. Radio messages sharpened. And Norris — brilliant, emotional, combustible – began driving like a man who wanted the crown now, not later.

Piastri, calm and calculating, refused to yield.

McLaren had the fastest car on the grid. They also had the most volatile driver pairing.

It would matter later.

Synopsis

This special episode of The Drive Thru News provides a comprehensive wrap-up of the 2025 Formula One Season with discussions on races, team strategies, and driver performances. The season opened with Lewis Hamilton’s unexpected move to Ferrari and McLaren’s early dominance. Highlights include Max Verstappen’s relentless pursuit of victory, McLaren’s strategic missteps, and unforeseen upsets like Lando Norris claiming the championship. The narrative weaves through various races, controversies, and memorable moments, concluding with reflections on the thrilling climax at Yas Marina and speculation on future seasons.

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00:00 2025 Formula One Season Overview
  • 00:01:28 Hamilton’s Move to Ferrari and Classic Car Debate
  • 00:05:13 Mercedes’ Struggles and Team Dynamics
  • 00:11:09 Bottas’ New Persona and Social Media Highlights
  • 00:13:10 Driver Changes and Team Strategies for 2025
  • 00:17:11 Hamilton’s Ferrari Debut and Race Analysis
  • 00:30:41 Rain Races and Driver Performances
  • 00:35:18 Upcoming Races and Predictions
  • 00:35:58 Debating Hamilton’s Performance
  • 00:36:51 Ferrari’s Pit Strategy Woes
  • 00:38:48 Comparing Teams and Drivers
  • 00:40:36 The Frustration with Modern F1
  • 00:43:23 Driver Age and Performance
  • 00:47:18 Red Bull’s Driver Dynamics
  • 00:48:32 The Return of V10s?
  • 00:50:35 Monaco Predictions and Criticisms
  • 00:56:40 Ferrari’s Transmission Troubles
  • 01:01:12 The Future of F1 and Disney Partnership
  • 01:08:50 Mad Max Racing Ideas for Monaco
  • 01:09:40 Ferrari’s Struggles and Team Orders
  • 01:11:39 The Challenges of Canadian Grand Prix
  • 01:16:19 Movie Theater Experiences and F1 Movie Discussion
  • 01:17:41 Proposed Wing Changes and Ferrari’s Performance
  • 01:18:55 Max Verstappen’s Dominance and Future Prospects
  • 01:21:38 Formula One’s Popularity and Future
  • 01:37:20 Cadillac and Audi’s Entry into Formula One
  • 01:42:05 Porsche’s Three Strike Strategy
  • 01:43:00 Wacky Car Commercials
  • 01:45:18 Franz Herman’s Racing Triumph
  • 01:46:39 US Grand Prix Highlights
  • 01:48:09 Max Verstappen’s Championship Comeback
  • 01:52:51 Formula One 2025 Game Review
  • 01:57:38 Brazilian Grand Prix Drama
  • 02:04:42 Yas Marina Season Finale
  • 02:05:29 Formula One 2025 Season Recap
  • 02:19:49 Future of Formula One Coverage

TRANSCRIPT

Executive Producer Tania: [00:00:00] Welcome to Break Fixes, Drive-Through News, your monthly recap for everything fast, fascinating, and usually four wheeled. We’re serving up a fresh batch of automotive headlines, motorsports madness, and car adjacent curiosities, all with zero wait time and maximum flavor from Formula One, drama to concept car debuts with garage built legends to the quirkiest stories rolling out of the state of Florida.

We’ve got your fix. So grab your coffee, buckle up, and let’s cruise through the latest in the world of wheels with a side of entertainment and just a dash of tire smoke.

Crew Chief Eric: During 2025, formula One was more than a championship. It was a saga of speed, rivalry, and redemption. From Melbourne’s opening roar to Abu Dhabi’s final curtain.

The season unfolded like a high octane drama. McLaren’s resurgence, ver stop in’s, relentless pursuit. Russell’s defiance and Ferrari’s gamble with Hamilton all collided in a year that tested the limits of man and machine. This is the story of the 2025 formula One season told month by month, race by race, and moment by [00:01:00] moment.

ANNOUNCER!: The year began not with the roar of engines, but with whispers in the paddock. Hamilton’s move to Ferrari sent shockwaves through the sport while Bahrain’s winter Sun revealed McLaren’s hidden speed. The stage was set, the players assembled, and the world held its breath.

Crew Chief Eric: Now that Hamilton is over at Ferrari, and we’ll talk about that more.

Especially the photos that came out, him looking like Shum me and stuff that he gave some really profound investment advice over the winter break. He says, hypercar are boring. You should buy a classic car

Crew Chief Brad: and art.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. Okay. Thanks. Rich guy. I mean, what do you say to that? The ocean has water in it and it’s wet.

Moisture is the essence of water.

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, cool. Right? His version of it. So we all can buy a classic car. Yeah, right. Dan’s got a mountain of them [00:02:00]

Crew Chief Brad: now. Now, hold on. Right. There’s a difference between a classic car and whatever’s going on at the mountain. Big difference. Do you call the cars at a junkyard classics?

Executive Producer Tania: Well, it depends on the level of classic because of a certain age

Crew Chief Brad: cars of a certain age.

Executive Producer Tania: You could start calling it a classic and even normal people can buy a classic car. You could have a sixties Mustang. That would be considered a classic. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Crew Chief Brad: A sixties Mustang. Yes. Ford Taurus that nobody wants.

It’s not a classic.

Crew Chief Eric: I had two. Two Mercury Sables.

Crew Chief Brad: Tanya, your point is like what happens on classic rock radio where Nirvana is classic rock now, so everybody listens to classic rock.

Executive Producer Tania: Hamilton’s comment is like, okay, cool, you’re gonna go buy a classic car. You’re not gonna go buy a 20 grand, 1960s Mustang or a Camaro or something from that age.

You’re gonna go [00:03:00] buy some classic car that’s gonna cost $750,000 or $2 million. Some Mercedes, one of a kind gold wing sl, blah, blah, blah.

Crew Chief Brad: Don’t buy a La Ferrari. Buy a two 50 GTO.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. He’s talking about shit that nobody can afford. So cool for you. Yeah. Everybody should buy a classic car, but everybody that can buy a classic car is gonna be buying.

Not those things.

Crew Chief Brad: Buy a classic car, not a shitbox.

Crew Chief Eric: Sound. Buying advice from Lewis Hamilton

Executive Producer Tania: and Art who can afford art. Really? I’m sure I can go buy the, the knockoff reprint.

Crew Chief Eric: Yes. Hold on. All posters.com. Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: Everybody go

Crew Chief Brad: to display and, and, and get your art there.

Crew Chief Eric: Oh boy. That’s definitely not a, what should I buy episode in the making Rich people.

What should I buy? What art goes with my car? People would probably listen to that more than some of the other, what should I buys? We’ve done like 25. What should I buys? And that’s the one people will probably listen to is what Van [00:04:00] Gogh or Renoir goes with my Bugatti like, Ugh, stop.

Executive Producer Tania: See, in the Picasso we go with the cyber truck.

Crew Chief Brad: I feel like you are grossly overestimating the buying capacity of our listeners.

Crew Chief Eric: All three Arbitron rated listeners. We have.

Crew Chief Brad: Yes. I don’t think Mark Hewitt is out there buying a Aron.

Crew Chief Eric: Nope.

Crew Chief Brad: Or Chiron or, or whatever. And then he’s gonna steal and buy the Mona Lisa.

Crew Chief Eric: Well we opened the door and I already mentioned you’ve seen him now in the Ferrari driving suit, pre-practice and all that kind of stuff.

I still think it’s weird to see him at Ferrari. People are, you know, already creating memes about him there. Ferrari headquarters in the big black double trench coat and all that stuff. Looking very much like Schumacher did the same thing, you know, 25 years ago. Okay, sure.

Crew Chief Brad: I think it’s awesome.

Crew Chief Eric: Hamilton’s at Ferrari, he’s going to suck.

Crew Chief Brad: They’ve been actually fairly competitive the last two seasons. They’ve had a good car, team orders and like some poor mistakes made [00:05:00] by the drivers. I actually feel like this is good and I think he’s gonna be better than people are giving him credit for.

Crew Chief Eric: I don’t think so. I think he’s done. I think he’s too old and if he was still good, he’d be good.

And he’s not good.

Executive Producer Tania: No, there’s no way. Like the Mercedes, it got better. They improved it definitely in the last season. The season before even the two seasons before the car was crap. Like it was visible. There’s no amount of anything he could do. When you saw the straight line speed and the disparate difference in that speed, there’s no way he or Russell could have competed in that version of the car.

In those seasons, the car was crap. It was so freaking slow. Absolute garbage. Tappin could have been in it and he wouldn’t have won.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s ’cause I think they were cheating if you compare him to the rest of the cars. He wasn’t doing that great. There either, but the car

Executive Producer Tania: was not good against, it was better than like Haas and like Williams and those cars, but it wasn’t better than Ferrari.

Even in those seasons, they struggled to even be like the top 10. The car was so bad does, and then in the last [00:06:00] season at least they were getting podiums.

Crew Chief Eric: How does Mercedes struggle to build a car? Like that to me, doesn’t make sense.

Crew Chief Brad: They were struggling to build a competitive race car.

Crew Chief Eric: I think that’s bs.

I’m calling Flag on the play. You can’t tell me the Mercedes that has a racing pedigree that’s longer than anybody there. Can’t build a car.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, they didn’t because they went through that whole purposing thing where the car was completely unstable and jumping around. So they did something. But that was happening to everybody though,

Crew Chief Eric: wasn’t it?

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah, but Mercedes took the longest to figure it out and they, they had it more drastic. You know what? I feel like the catalyst was for Mercedes and it’s probably doesn’t make any sense or whatever, but Nikki Lauda when when Lauda passed, he was doing a lot for them still up until then.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. He was team consultant.

Crew Chief Brad: They lost his expertise in years of experience and knowledge and I feel like it seems to have had an effect on them.

Crew Chief Eric: Maybe he was the Mercedes whisper. Yeah. But he was the Ferrari whisperer before that. Basic suspension. Yeah, sure. That’s all the [00:07:00] same. But I think the technology far surpassed. LA’s expertise because he raced in the seventies and the eighties we’re 40 years in the future, the cars aren’t even close to being the same.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. But he was an engineer. He didn’t walk away from Formula One. He stayed in it that whole time. And as an engineer, he probably learned

Crew Chief Brad: exactly. I just because he wasn’t racing doesn’t mean he wasn’t driving the cars.

Crew Chief Eric: He’s not Adrian Newey

Crew Chief Brad: I, he was doing better than Adrian Newey was. When he was alive, the team was winning.

Crew Chief Eric: The point is not one person designs the car. And you can’t tell me that Mercedes doesn’t have talented people that could design a car, that could be competitive, as competitive as everybody else.

Crew Chief Brad: Apparently not. Not as talented as Red Bull and Ferrari and McClaren. It

Executive Producer Tania: was wildly uncompetitive against many other manufacturers for at least two years.

So I know you wanna say Red Bull was cheating if you take Red Bull out of the picture. Their performance with everybody else was hot garbage. So was everybody else cheating as well? And it was just Mercedes.

Crew Chief Brad: They were only faster than the back markers.

Executive Producer Tania: Basically. That’s all that car could do.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s a mid-pack team.

I get it. Point being though, I don’t think you’re [00:08:00] going to see a whole hell of a lot outta Lewis at Ferrari. That’s my prediction. It’s gonna be more of the same.

Crew Chief Brad: I think he’s going to be better than your predicting and that. That’s my prediction.

Crew Chief Eric: Okay.

Executive Producer Tania: I look forward to seeing it. Well, this is funny.

Eric’s very strong about his opinion and he hasn’t watched a Formula One race in like 20 years, but he’s very confident and strong about all of it.

Crew Chief Eric: I secretly keep up with it. I don’t have to watch the races to get the race results and read and understand.

Crew Chief Brad: That’s how I feel about rally.

Crew Chief Eric: Stop it. Stop it.

Crew Chief Brad: Okay. This is us making our picks like for the NFC Championship game coming up. You know Exactly. Mexicans versus the Eagles. Who’s gonna win the the F1 championship this year?

Crew Chief Eric: It’s not gonna be Ferrari.

Crew Chief Brad: Who, who’s gonna be, who’s gonna win the driver’s championship and who’s gonna win the constructors?

They do not have to be the same.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s gonna be stopping again as long as he’s still driving and whatever other, blah, blah, blah. Because everybody, the cash, that’s not who won the Constructors

Executive Producer Tania: championship

Crew Chief Eric: this year? See? Yeah. So McLaren won the Constructors championship. I know that. [00:09:00] The whole Zach Brown thing, it’s like, okay, so it’s McLaren’s year.

Let’s see what happens. But I don’t think Ferrari’s gonna do it. Ferrari doesn’t feel like it’s been competitive for a while.

Executive Producer Tania: Ferrari was very competitive last season. They were a lot more competitive than they have been in the last X number of years.

Crew Chief Brad: I feel like Ferrari made an upgrade in Driver.

Executive Producer Tania: Yes.

With

Crew Chief Eric: dots after

Executive Producer Tania: it.

Crew Chief Brad: So as long as their car is still as competitive as it was in prior years, and if they made an upgrade in driver, then that should tell you that they should perform better, at least as good as they did in prior years or better.

Executive Producer Tania: I think it’ll be interesting to see. I think you could tell with the Mercedes being.

So uncompetitive Hamilton didn’t give a shit. And why should he? What is he gonna bust his ass out there to come in 10th. Okay, he came in 10th, but it’s like, how much more is he gonna bust his ass? He was never gonna come in first. So your drive and your passion gets killed a little bit when you’re like, I gotta drive this fricking turd and there’s nothing I can do.

And it’s like, I know I’m a better [00:10:00] driver than these people, but like I haven’t, I can’t compete like you put me in a Pinto and I’m racing against. GT forties,

Crew Chief Eric: he wants to be Sena. That was his role model. That’s the Sena in the Tolman story where the Tolman was. They were like Haas back then. He ended up almost winning that Monte Carlo race, even though they cheated and took it away from him.

But there’s all these regulations and shit that was used against him. But I don’t know if it’s apples to apples. But the thing is, if you have the determination as a driver, you’re going to try regardless and not just be like complacent and take a paycheck. And that’s the thing is if Hamilton has been resting on his laurels for the last couple of years, it means he’s lost his edge, which means he’s not gonna be fast.

Executive Producer Tania: Here’s the question that I have. Maybe it won’t matter, but Mr. Verstappen, will he lose his edge now that he’s going to be a father?

Crew Chief Eric: I am surprised he didn’t quit at the end of this season and just be like, I’m done. That’s it. Four. That’s all I need.

Executive Producer Tania: He has a contract. He’s not allowed out till like 2028. I mean, I’m sure he can buy himself out, but technically he’s got a contract till then

Crew Chief Eric: or until he [00:11:00] underperforms enough that they really need to get rid of him, of course they’ll kick

Executive Producer Tania: him out.

Crew Chief Eric: But are they gonna do that if he causes enough nuisance? He, I’m sure he will. You know what I mean?

Crew Chief Brad: He’s just got a curse on air a couple times. Let’s move on to another former Mercedes driver that I think is doing great things.

Crew Chief Eric: You talk about BOTAs.

Crew Chief Brad: BOTAs is my spirit animal. He is my new favorite driver in F1.

He is just, he’s awesome. I love Boas.

Crew Chief Eric: Thought he was hilarious. ’cause Tanya goes, that man needs to get a haircut. And I said, I’m glad you mentioned that because there’s an Instagram

Crew Chief Brad: video.

Crew Chief Eric: A buck test, getting

Executive Producer Tania: a haircut. He needs to shave that mustache off. It’s so

Crew Chief Eric: nasty.

Crew Chief Brad: That’s the point.

Crew Chief Eric: I know it is. Have you seen the whole thing now?

The gimmick with his stunt double Who looks nothing like him?

Executive Producer Tania: It’s hilarious. He just, I just saw a thing of him doing, I think I actually coincidentally and also in Australia. ’cause he’s very big into cycling as well. Yeah. Um, and he, and he competes in a lot of different races

Crew Chief Brad: and nude swimming in creeks.

Executive Producer Tania: And he was doing, no, it was a nude bike ride was quote nude, like he was just in his underwear and he was, [00:12:00] and like everybody was just like in their underwear basically doing this bike ride. I was like, oh my god. Also one that sucks ’cause the underwear don’t think was padded. So that’s rough bike ride.

Have fun with that.

Crew Chief Brad: Some guys like that.

Executive Producer Tania: Yes, he was sporting his mustache and living his best life naked on his bike.

Crew Chief Brad: Bicycle, bicycle. Bye. And I think his

Executive Producer Tania: stunt double must, her stunt dude must have been with him. ’cause there was another guy like next to him on a bicycle that like looked a lot like him.

Yes.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s the guy. Yeah. A hundred percent.

Crew Chief Brad: Uh, but this is a good follow on social media. He’s he’s good stuff.

Crew Chief Eric: He is entertaining, that’s for sure. See I keep up with formula when I keep up with the right stuff in for me. Go on. Mm-hmm.

Crew Chief Brad: The stuff that matters. Bois’s haircut. That’s, this is the podcast that we should be having.

This is Bois’s Fashion and haircut. There you go.

Crew Chief Eric: Hey, there are podcasts out there that built themselves around that whole principle, not throwing any

Crew Chief Brad: shit. I know they’ve been former guests and,

Crew Chief Eric: and they are no [00:13:00] longer producing shows. So that’s that.

Crew Chief Brad: Oh, they’re not?

Crew Chief Eric: No, they’re off the air. Did you miss that?

They retired at the end of the season. They’re done.

Crew Chief Brad: So sad.

Crew Chief Eric: So Bottas Perez is out. He doesn’t have a seat. Nope. Okay. He’s out li going into the season. Vin’s teammate is gonna be Lawson. Yep. How’s that gonna work?

Executive Producer Tania: If the guy holds his ego in check. Should work out fine. He’s gotta be a team player by team player.

Max Tappin is number one.

COMMERCIAL: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: And you do everything to protect him and he’ll always be in front of you. So it’s shoo me and Barra all

Crew Chief Eric: over again. I get it. We got Lawson moved to Red Bull, we got Carlos signs, went to. No. Williams. Williams, he went to Williams. Williams. Okay. And then Hamilton went to Ferrari.

And Le Claire is still at Ferrari? Yes. Are any new drivers coming in for this season? Yes, a

SFX: couple.

Crew Chief Eric: There’s a lot of youngins with no experience. Are they driving for Audi Gazoo or Andretti at any point in 2025,

Executive Producer Tania: even though it’s Audi, it’s still Saber for 2025, they’ll officially be Audi in [00:14:00] 2026. And so Audi has brought on Nico Holgenburg, they moved him from Haas and he’s going to be the Audi driver in 2026, but he’s already gonna sit in the Saber next year.

And then they brought in a Brazilian driver, Gabrielle Bto, who’s the other number two chair.

Crew Chief Eric: So speaking of Audi, what is this that they were looking to sell out their investment and get out of Formula One before they even got started? Is that true or is that crap?

Executive Producer Tania: I think it’s crap because if you go on Audi’s website, they have a whole page dedicated, uh, formula One talking about their entrance in 2026 and that they also, I think they got some

Crew Chief Eric: guitar investment money as well.

And there is still rumor on the street, and I brought it up because I wish them the best that Andretti and GM are coming to Formula One at some point.

Executive Producer Tania: So Cadillac’s coming to Formula One, which is General

Crew Chief Eric: Motors,

Executive Producer Tania: that was. I think green lit. If it isn’t, it’s about to be, it might not be completely complete.

It seems like it actually is gonna happen versus the Andretti one, which is [00:15:00] just, that makes no

Crew Chief Eric: sense. That doesn’t mean that Andretti can’t come along with General Motors. I mean, pretty much, and then at some point, general Motors says, have you met Michael? And then passes the baton and then Andrettis in Formula One.

I mean, what is this backdoor nonsense that we’re doing? I don’t know.

Executive Producer Tania: Because there’s also been talks about like, oh, maybe Perez will come back and could race for like Cadillac, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay, we’ll see. What year is that gonna happen? I think they’re trying to do it for 2026. Okay. Yeah, because that’s when the rule, there’s a rule change that’s happening in 2026, so that’s why then think an engine to something.

So that’s when Audi can officially come in.

Crew Chief Brad: Apparently Andretti is scaling back his role in the team and in the organization, which I guess that is making F1 more accepting of having all this happen.

Crew Chief Eric: So you drop back and you punt and then burst down.

Crew Chief Brad: It also says that Cadillac’s motors aren’t gonna be ready until 2028, so it’s gonna be a GM branded car with a different engine supplier.

How funny would be, it was a Ford. [00:16:00]

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. Or it’s a, a Honda with a GM badge. Which is the Porsche thing. Right. Where it was gonna be a Honda engine with a Porsche badge. It’s like, whatever. Yeah. When do they reveal the new cars that look just like the cars from the year before? That’s in think February of the next couple months.

Okay. Yeah.

Crew Chief Brad: It starts like into January. There’s a whole schedule out there of the team reveals and stuff.

Crew Chief Eric: Are we still doing Visa Cash app steak, Chipotle, MoneyGram? Like, is that all like a thing or have all the teams changed again?

Crew Chief Brad: Well, isn’t that Audi now

Crew Chief Eric: they’re Kick Saber

Executive Producer Tania: or whatever.

Crew Chief Brad: MoneyGram was Haas

Executive Producer Tania: Visa Cash app, blah blah, blah is now Racing Bulls Toro rso, but Racing Bulls Alpha Tar.

It was Alpha Tar then it was something, I don’t know. It was Alpha Tar Toso, visa Cash app, something, something, and now it’s Racing Bulls.

Crew Chief Brad: Why do they need to keep changing the name?

Executive Producer Tania: All right. All

Crew Chief Eric: that aside is Ocon back or not? He’s ha, terrible. All right. That’s all I needed to know. I’m rooting for Ocon O Con’s.

Gonna take it this year. He’s gonna take all of ’em. Ocon. [00:17:00] Yeah. Right. That’s my prediction. He,

Crew Chief Brad: he’s gonna take ’em all out. Out is what he He’s gonna take them all out.

Executive Producer Tania: Take got his partner

ANNOUNCER!: preseason Buzz Lewis. Hamilton’s blockbuster move to Ferrari. Shook the grid. February. Testing in Bahrain revealed McLaren’s pace hinting at a season of dominance.

The engines hadn’t yet roared in anger, but the paddock was already a blaze with speculation.

Crew Chief Eric: Formula one season hasn’t started yet. Russell is the senior driver at Mercedes now. Yep. Yeah. Is there anything else to

Executive Producer Tania: say? He thinks it’s gonna launch a new era for himself or a new chapter, whatever, but he has no team support ’cause he is got, forget who now is the dude, but he’s a complete rookie green, green, green in F1.

Oh, that’s antonelli.

Crew Chief Brad: Antonelli.

Executive Producer Tania: So that’s great. But it’s also helpful when you have a teammate that at least is marginally competitive alongside you that can do things like help block or fend off the [00:18:00] approach of everyone else. But I, I see him being mostly alone and he’s probably gonna struggle.

Crew Chief Eric: Antonelli is what? How old is he now? 20,

COMMERCIAL: 25?

Crew Chief Eric: Well, I don’t know. Well he’s 19. I think he’s like the youngest Formula One driver on the grid. I don’t think he’s the youngest to start a Formula One race, but he’s the youngest in Formula One and right now, and it’s just like, apparently Mercedes handpicked him when he was 11, back when he was go-karting and stuff.

And so, I don’t know, they, I guess they’ve invested a lot of money in him and time and resources over the last eight years, so they’re hoping he’s gonna be the next prodigy. Didn’t he have like a big, massive, unnecessary wreck? One of his first races? I believe so, yeah. I don’t see good things for Mercedes this year.

Yeah. But there is rumor that your boy BOTAs.

Executive Producer Tania: He’s a reserve driver again for them. Yeah. Which honestly would mean if Antonelli doesn’t deliver, maybe there’s a chance they kick him out and put BOTAs back in the seat. But then BOTAs would be the senior driver. Would he though? Or is he gotta take team orders

Crew Chief Eric: [00:19:00] from Russell?

I guess it would depend on, uh, what the performance looks like. BOTAs is faster than Russell. We already know that. Right. So what is he gonna do? Just sandbag the whole time.

Crew Chief Brad: And are we just saying senior driver as like as a product of their age? Or do we mean like they’re seniority? The lead driver, like the, yeah, the driver one and driver two.

Executive Producer Tania: By senior we mean the lead for the team.

Crew Chief Brad: Okay.

Executive Producer Tania: Which generally should be dictated by experience.

Crew Chief Brad: Oh, it should be dictated by wins. Whoever’s performing the best,

Executive Producer Tania: which would then be BOTAs.

Crew Chief Eric: I was gonna say, ’cause Russell has none and Antonelli has none.

Executive Producer Tania: No Russell’s one. I don’t know, three,

Crew Chief Brad: four. There’s more that goes into it obviously than wins and, and stuff like that and experience and everything.

But it’s who they’re hanging their future on,

Executive Producer Tania: which probably wouldn’t be BOTAs

Crew Chief Brad: because BOTAs is towards the end of his career. But Russell is still very much in the middle of his career. He’s like reaching his peak or his prime. Antonelli is starting. You know what they’re hoping is a really good career, but.

To talk about something Mercedes adjacent, who [00:20:00] is the quote unquote senior driver now at Ferrari? Is it Hamilton or is Cleric still driver one?

Executive Producer Tania: It’s

Crew Chief Eric: gotta be Hamilton.

Executive Producer Tania: That is something I’ve been wondering because that is a very ugly political drama that they are now in

Crew Chief Brad: because Cleric was driver one when signs was there, right?

Executive Producer Tania: Correct. Supposed to be.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: But how do you bring the seven time World champion onto your team and say you

Crew Chief Eric: are number two? And this goes back to what I said last time about Lewis Hamilton not being able to do Jack of All at Ferrari because if they play Ferrari politics like they always have just like the opportunities when Bar had to win over Humie and they said get outta the way Ruben’s Michael’s coming through.

If Le Claire’s senior driver, Hamilton has to follow team orders ’cause that’s the way it works and he’s not gonna amount to Jack. At the end of the year because he is always gonna be in second place to Le Cla. Unless he’s outperforming Le Claire. Then they’re gonna [00:21:00] tell him, depends on how his contract is written.

If his contract is written that he is the number two driver he’s done,

Executive Producer Tania: there is no way his contract is written that he’s a number two driver. He is going for eighth world champion. There’s so, there’s no way he’s gonna sign something that’s gonna prevent him from being an eight time champion. Then that answers your question.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah, I guess it does. There you

Executive Producer Tania: go. But if he’s not performing, I don’t think they’re just gonna be like Le Claire sandbag and make sure you know, you let Lewis win. Right. But if he actually is a contender, there’s no way they’re gonna tell Le Claire. Yeah,

Crew Chief Brad: that’s true. And to Eric’s point, in previous episodes, they have to actually be in a position to win a race.

Duh. That’s before any of this. Yes. Comes in question Anyway. So they’ve still got a lot of work to do.

Crew Chief Eric: This is all posturing now because we don’t know what’s gonna happen. The only thing we do know is they revealed the new cars, which to me look exactly like the cars from last year. They

Crew Chief Brad: always do. Like a couple years ago I got super excited about all the car reveals and I looked at ’em and like sometimes they release ’em in [00:22:00] like really cool colors or something really unique and then comes race day and it’s like, it’s the exact same cars before.

What did you change? What is this? I don’t care.

Crew Chief Eric: I’ve been saying that and everybody makes fun of me, but whatever. It’s fine. And the Mercedes especially looks the same as it did the W 16, whatever the hell, whatever. Who cares? Same car as last year. With Suckier drivers.

Crew Chief Brad: When does your album come out?

Crew Chief Eric: What

Executive Producer Tania: do we call my album?

Boomers and Bends? If I may digress for a moment. Just tangentially, I finally started watching the Netflix Docudrama Senna. Oh,

Crew Chief Eric: did you?

Executive Producer Tania: I am on the final episode course. I know how it ends. It’s like Titanic. No spoilers. No spoilers. Don’t spoil it for us, unfortunately. I know how it ends. Wow, that’s an interesting, uh,

Crew Chief Eric: yeah, interpretation.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You gotta listen to the podcast episode we did with John Summers and, uh, will Ross

Executive Producer Tania: and I have not, because I’ve wanted to experience the series for myself. [00:23:00] You’ll have to come back and tell us if we were right. Well, I will say, and you don’t have to confirm or deny anything, there’s definitely a sense of.

This is Jesus Christ.

Crew Chief Eric: So the word the motoring historian John Summers likes to use is beatification. That is the official word he uses to summarize that sentiment, that Sena is God.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. Very interesting.

Crew Chief Eric: And pro is Darth Vader, but you know, whatever. It’s all good. Is

Executive Producer Tania: that completely untrue?

Crew Chief Eric: Well, you need to listen to the episode for sure.

’cause we get into all that. So that being said, last little bit of Formula one stuff, your boy Toto, Mr. Mercedes, highest paid player and Formula One. This is why Mercedes can’t win anything. They’re too busy paying Toto salary. He had a response to Hamilton’s iconic recreation of Schumacher’s photograph at Martinello.

What do we think? I don’t actually know what his response was. The article is

Executive Producer Tania: clickbait.

Crew Chief Brad: No, they, they have it down there. It’s a little bit like you divorce amicably and it’s all [00:24:00] good and you see your ex-partner for the first time with a new friend. But I’m

Executive Producer Tania: really happy for him and I told him that those pictures were iconic that he made.

It was so well curated and no surprise with Lewis. So it was all good fun. He’s fine.

Crew Chief Eric: Do people not realize it is literally a copy of something that Schumacher did 30 years ago? Literally everybody realizes that. Yes, it’s nothing new or iconic. It was already done and it was iconic then. It’s weird. Am I wrong?

Crew Chief Brad: Well, he’s trying to tap into his inner Schumacher.

Crew Chief Eric: This is my problem with Hamilton, if you remember him when he was really young and he showed up on top gear and he was like the last one to drive the old piece of junk celebrity card that they had. And he was like super fast and he blew everybody outta the water.

And he was just a young guy. That was the last time I think I saw Hamilton like. Be himself. He turned into this machine of the media kind of thing and and he’s like a little ken doll that they dress up. I feel like he never gets to be who he was then when he [00:25:00] was up and coming in racing and he was fast and he was good, and not saying he isn’t good today, but he’s older, he is more mature now, and I think he’s part of the machine rather than just being himself.

Crew Chief Brad: So that brings up a good point. You think this photo was put together by Ferrari and it wasn’t Hamilton’s idea?

Crew Chief Eric: I do think that, yes. He’s like a little dress up toy. He’s a puppet. See

Crew Chief Brad: that

Crew Chief Eric: Ferrari’s trying to make a statement. You have to remember Ferrari too. You don’t go to Ferrari and give them an idea.

They tell you what needs to be done. That’s what they wanted. And maybe in their eyes they see Hamilton as Schumacher’s replacement. Schumacher never got the eighth. He left after his seventh. Right? He went to Mercedes. Speaking of Mercedes never accomplished anything there. And then obviously the tragedy of the accident and all that kind of stuff.

And now they have Hamilton and they’re like, we can be part of the eighth that we never had with Schumi. So let’s sort of pick up where Schumacher left off. But it’s not just let him be who he’s gonna be. And, and I get, I don’t know. That’s what turns me off about it. [00:26:00] Versus like, I know that Alonzo’s, the elder statesman, I’m not a huge Alonzo fan, but Alonzo’s always been Alonzo.

When he was in wac, when he was in Formula One, we went to IndyCar. It’s like, Hey, you just kind of follow him around. You go, it’s Alonzo, you know? He is who he is. But there’s been, for me, this transformation with Lewis that I, I don’t understand, but I’m glad to see BOTAs back. He’s the fin that’s gonna be in Australian soon, right?

Like that’s, he’s making his own transformation, but in a good way.

Executive Producer Tania: We won’t belabor it. No. But I think he is being who he is and who he is, is a person that evolved from where he was when he was younger. And whether we like what that evolution is, it’s an evolution for him. That’s fair. That’s fair.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, on that depressing bit of food for thought,

ANNOUNCER!: when the lights went out in Melbourne, the waiting was over.

Lando Norris seized victory igniting McLaren’s charge. A week later in Shanghai, Oscar Ptri answered back, proving this would be no one man show. The season had begun [00:27:00] and the papaya orange was impossible to ignore.

Executive Producer Tania: Guess what I subjected him to.

Crew Chief Brad: You made him watch a race.

Executive Producer Tania: I made him listen to it. It was on the laptop in the garage while we were doing some work.

I had the race playing, so he at least was listening to it, possibly sometimes seeing it.

Crew Chief Brad: So I’m just sitting here waiting for Eric to say, I told you so.

Executive Producer Tania: Thank

Crew Chief Eric: you. He said it multiple times. He said it multiple times.

Crew Chief Brad: Thank you.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m gonna be nice.

Crew Chief Brad: Bullshit. When are you ever Nice

Crew Chief Eric: flag on the play. I’m gonna start with Alonzo’s.

He was baffled by his unlucky crash that came out of nowhere because it was the same freaking corner that everybody was trying to cut in the rain through the sand trap. And if it worked for the first guy, it must work for the rest of us. Meanwhile, crash off into the side eating a sandwich. He’s done. I kept saying it.

I was like, every time somebody came through that turn to that chicane, I’m like, guys, you know it’s raining. The curbs are slicker than snot. And you’ve got this [00:28:00] garbage sand on the inside and you saw it happen with Ptri. He coded his tires, he made it to the next corner, and then he was off because he had zero traction After putting it through the sand trap and you’re confused by what happened.

This is like racing 1 0 1, driving in the rain. The rain line is where you have grip.

Crew Chief Brad: Also, don’t touch the curbs.

Crew Chief Eric: No kidding. Like we learned all this crap in HBDE, like we learned it all a million years ago. But again, their Formula One are the best drivers in the world. They need to go back to HBDE. I think he was surprised by the crash.

Meanwhile, there’s all the Instagram videos of Alonzo. I never wanna speak to the media again. I have nothing to say to you people. There is nothing new to talk about. I am a robot. Do not interview me anymore. I’m like, whatever, dude. Isn’t it time freaking retire?

Crew Chief Brad: It was a Sunday. Jesus was busy. He didn’t have time to take the wheel in that case.

Crew Chief Eric: Let’s get to the punchline here. Okay. The juiciest part of the episode is about to [00:29:00] happen. Hamilton first

Executive Producer Tania: race of the season, McLaren wins. Lando Norris P one. Oh, max for staffing P two because of posh three’s. Unfortunate slide in the last few laps of the race, as was just mentioned. Russell. Mercedes P three.

Crew Chief Eric: Give us the rest of the drivers between Russell. Mercedes. The inferior Mercedes. Mercedes can develop a car.

Executive Producer Tania: Mercedes. Rookie driver, Jimmy Antonelli. Fourth place Uhhuh. Alex Alvin Williams. Fifth place Uhhuh. Lance Stroll. Aston Martin. Sixth. Nico Holberg’s. Kick Solver. Seventh place. Oh, okay. Charles Le Claire Ferrari.

Eighth place. Wait, wait, wait, wait. What happened? I heard. Yeah. Oscar Ptri McLaren Ninth Place. Who should have been second? Wait, hold

Crew Chief Eric: on. We’re at ninth place. We’re like almost out of the points at this point. A two position

Executive Producer Tania: drop from his qualifying position of eighth Place.

Crew Chief Eric: Who was

Executive Producer Tania: in 10th place? Who was it again,

Crew Chief Brad: sir?

Lewis Hamilton. [00:30:00]

Executive Producer Tania: Seventh time world champion. Louis Hamilton. Oh, okay. Alright. With his debut Grand Prix with Ferrari.

Crew Chief Brad: Now, I will say a couple things. One, the Williams team really surprised me.

Crew Chief Eric: Science was in P two during practice. I’m sorry, feel bad that he

Executive Producer Tania: wrecked himself out on like Lab three,

Crew Chief Brad: another one where Jesus was busy.

And then the next thing I’ll say,

Crew Chief Eric: not today, not today, not today. Carlos

Crew Chief Brad: Jesus put up a sign and said out to lunch,

Crew Chief Eric: it’s the time difference in Australia. He was like, nah, man. True, true, true.

Crew Chief Brad: He was in another part of the world. I’ll also say it was mostly a rain race the whole time. Pretty much rain races are very unpredictable and a lot of shit happens and a lot of the grid doesn’t turn out like it usually does during a dry race.

So rain races do have a lot of variability.

Crew Chief Eric: Flag on the, I can’t even use the referee whistle anymore. I’m gonna get a vula and be like. Because isn’t Hamilton [00:31:00] touted as like one of the rain gods? Like when the weather gets bad then Hamilton comes to life and all this bs.

Crew Chief Brad: Maybe in the Mercedes he was,

Crew Chief Eric: that’s the Hamilton of 20 years ago.

Because the Hamilton I saw in Australia in 2025. Hang it up, brother. You’re done.

Executive Producer Tania: We’ll give him the benefit of a few more races to see how things turn out. We’re gonna

Crew Chief Eric: make it to the third round and I’m gonna tell you it’s gonna be the same from

Crew Chief Brad: then on. He was also having trouble with the team strategy and like understanding the team strategy and stuff.

It’s, I mean, I’m not saying, I’m not saying you’re wrong.

Executive Producer Tania: Ferrari. Ferrari though.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah. Ferrari did what Ferrari does

Executive Producer Tania: in offense or defense, whatever would be appropriate for here. They did Ferrari themselves because when it did start raining hard at the end of the race. Everybody else pitted and they stayed out too many laps, kept trying to go on the hard tires and when they all finally pitted it f LeClaire, he would’ve been way higher up based on where he was had he pitted with everybody else, but they [00:32:00] kept them out and they did a typical bullshit Ferrari strategy of like two years ago.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, they looked like they were in the drive through line in McDonald’s, like one car behind the other. Like what are we doing here? You know what I mean? This is ridiculous. The thing is that strategy, I don’t know how to understand how you can’t understand it. Like they’re gonna tell you to pit and you come pit, but the strategy behind the wheel, when you’re on track, you’re driving and you’re supposed to be driving to your limits and pushing past your limits and being the the God amongst Gods

Executive Producer Tania: actually not anymore.

See, because they actually tell them not to as the strategy.

Crew Chief Eric: Then what is the point of this anymore?

Executive Producer Tania: What I’ve observed over the last few years of coming back in and watching it is they go really hard, like the first two, three laps, they try to like win at the first corner basically, and then after the first couple laps, everybody just dials it back and they go into cruise mode.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s tire preservation,

Executive Producer Tania: and then they all try to punch it in the last two laps of the race. To win it again, but no, it’s not like 20 years ago where it was like, we’re going hard every lap. 12 tenths the whole [00:33:00] time. No, they go like 11 tenths the first laps, and then they go seven tenths for 40 laps out of the race, and then they start dialing it back in.

Like they literally, like, you can listen to the strategy where they’re like, oh, you know, don’t push, don’t push. Or, or then they’ll be like, okay, it’s time to push now. Can you go faster?

Crew Chief Eric: Are they giving birth? Like what is all this push to,

Crew Chief Brad: you know, Eric, to your point, they don’t make drivers like they used to.

Crew Chief Eric: Can’t all be Sena, can’t we? Oh, oh, I, I’m just saying Hamilton wrecked the Ferrari at the test track. I don’t think it’s gonna get any better for him and I don’t wanna hear about how, oh, new team B. B, you guys told me all this stuff,

Executive Producer Tania: bill, pull that. ’cause I already saw a thing where it showed his first years in any of the three teams he’s driven in.

He did not win. So even when he moved to Mercedes the first time, his first year was crap. He got points, he got some podiums and all that, but he was not one the first time. And the same thing [00:34:00] with like McLaren for the one year that he did it, I guess, or whatever it was. And then so people are gonna say if he has a bad year, they’re still gonna hang it and they’re gonna be like, oh, he did it in with the other teams too, so we’re gonna hold out for, you know, next year.

Uhhuh.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, sure. Just like every football team. But the point is, by that point, he’ll be two years older than when he transitioned over. Oh yeah. So he’s aging out of Formula One, he just needs to stop. You can’t beat father time.

Executive Producer Tania: And it might just be that, you know, reflexes are down the drive to risk your life.

Crew Chief Eric: He’s already proven what he needs to prove. Now the thing is, if he’s still got it in him to say he wants to better Schumacher and not be tied with Schumacher, then he’s gotta do it. But if he can’t, then he can’t. It is what it is. There’s plenty of other champions out there that have settled for, I did what I came to do and I’m done.

And what’s the point of hanging on and collecting a paycheck at this point? Because to come in 10th. 10. Well look at Alonzo. I don’t understand what Aston Martin’s doing. Two time

Executive Producer Tania: World champion

Crew Chief Eric: coming in back marker. [00:35:00] Well, mid pack,

Crew Chief Brad: they’re like Tom Brady.

Crew Chief Eric: It would’ve been hilarious if Alonzo hadn’t wrecked.

He would’ve finished in front of Hamilton. But to have Lance Stroll and all these other guys in front of you that we make fun of all the time, you know, in previous years, you’re like, dude, you’re done. Like you’re not Haas, but you might as well be.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, this weekend is the Chinese Grand Prix, so we’ll see what happens there.

We shall see. I’m coming over we’re, which I saw

Crew Chief Brad: something. They’re having issues with tires, logistics like getting tires, BS with tires. I don’t want hear it.

ANNOUNCER!: Suzuka belonged to Sapan, a reminder of his relentless grip on the crown. But Bahrain and Jeda told a different story. Oscar Pietri, young and Fearless, claimed back-to-back wins.

April was no longer about defending titles, it was about rewriting them.

Crew Chief Eric: Again, I’ve devoted 2025 to watching every race to the formula one. See you guys. I didn’t know you called me out. You said, what do I know? I’m not a fan. [00:36:00] I don’t watch blah, blah, blah, yada yada. Hamilton’s gonna be the best. You’re gonna see Ferrari, blah blah, blah.

The Mercedes is inferior. I

Executive Producer Tania: don’t think we went that far. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I think we’ve just said we couldn’t count him out yet.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah, we said he’s not gonna be a back marker. Like Eric said he was going to be.

Crew Chief Eric: Oh really? Oh really? And I told you, and I’ll put money on this, that by the third race, he would cement exactly how he was gonna do for the rest of the season.

And we’re at what race? Five now? Yes. We’ve had

Executive Producer Tania: five races, I would say. I don’t know yet. He, he’s not gonna win a championship this year, that’s for sure. Not gonna win one next year either. He’s so far been in the top 10 for the five races. Ninth is in the top 10. Yeah, you’re right. No, he’s currently sixth in points.

He’s not ninth. His best finish was fifth. Technically, his best finish was first in the sprint race.

Crew Chief Eric: It doesn’t count.

Executive Producer Tania: But nonetheless, Bahrain in the middle of that race, both he and La Claire. There was like a light switch moment where they were like [00:37:00] flying around the track. I don’t know what turbo mushroom they got when they went into pit, when they came back out.

I mean, there was like night and day and they were like flying around the track. They were gaining time. And then it’s like, I think they went back for like another pit stop and suddenly like the mushroom wore off or something. So that was disappointing.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s like, remember Mario Kart 64 where you got the gold mushroom?

And you kept hitting the button as fast as you could. Yes. Because you wanted to go, you know, the super boost and then when it ran out you were like, oh no, that was the middle of that

Executive Producer Tania: race. It was like, holy shit. Like the Ferrari suddenly like work software upgrade. Yeah.

Crew Chief Brad: They didn’t pay their subscription fees.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. What it was they, they only did a temporary subscription. First 30 minutes free,

Crew Chief Brad: wasn’t it? That there wasn’t there a yellow and they had put mediums on and everybody else put sauce or something like that. Their pit strategy is garbage.

Executive Producer Tania: Yes. It was something with the tires, like they were doing really well on the tires they had and then they switched off of them and then suddenly it was like garbage.

And it was like, why did you switch to these? ’cause you already knew from another team that these were garbage and yet you chose them. Winning strategy. Great job. [00:38:00] Well, Ferrari’s

Crew Chief Eric: gonna Ferrari.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. And they do. It’s so dumb. Unfortunately, if you’d watch the last like three, four seasons, they literally make the most bonehead decisions.

Whether it’s timing of pitting their people, the order of pitting, them, team orders in general, the value of their pit stops, the value of their tire choices. They usually make the most astine choices and then they suffer and they lose position. So yes, Ferrari’s gonna, Ferrari has become a thing because of the way they’ve managed themselves over the last several seasons.

Crew Chief Eric: As a Tizi, I’m gonna die of a very old age. Like I’m gonna live to be 200 waiting for Ferrari to win a championship again. Like this is unreal. The keystone cop garbage that I’ve been watching, like this is why I stopped watching Formula One. And every race is painful because it’s like, what are you clowns doing?

And then last year, if you go back even to the Formula One special and all that kind of stuff, and I talked about you wanna tell me that Mercedes can’t build a car, you guys are, oh, what’s inferior? And Adrian knew it. Over a [00:39:00] Red Bull. It was. It was. And it’s all bullshit. It’s all

Executive Producer Tania: bullshit.

Crew Chief Eric: No. Adrian Newey goes to Aston Martin and nothing changes.

He’s

Executive Producer Tania: not doing anything yet. That’s why. Well, yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: because apparently they’re making cars with scribes and ads and stuff from the Egyptian period.

Executive Producer Tania: I don’t know what the deal is with this magician, Adrian Newey. Okay. That apparently anytime he’s been on the team that they’ve won the Constructors for like the last 30 years or something like that.

I don’t, I have any idea. I really could give a shit. But if you watch the other races, the straight line speed and the out of cornering speed of the Red Bull was incomparable with anybody else.

Crew Chief Eric: They were cheating.

Executive Producer Tania: It passed the Mercedes and shit like it was parked in the paddock.

Crew Chief Eric: But the Mercedes this year,

Executive Producer Tania: because they do upgrades every year at the end of the season, the car is different and they change something.

Does

Crew Chief Eric: Ferrari do downgrades every year? Yes.

Executive Producer Tania: Yes they do. Downgrades? Yes, a hundred percent. Just like Mercedes did a big downgrade last year. ’cause their car was garbage compared to the year before.

Crew Chief Eric: Apparently they can’t get their electronics right as we saw [00:40:00] with Russell. Which race was it? Bahrain?

Executive Producer Tania: I don’t remember.

But yeah, he’s. Timing system basically shut the whole everything

Crew Chief Eric: down on the track. And he still survived without it. It was amazing. Well, he

Executive Producer Tania: barely made it because on like the last lap, it was like his whole car. Remember I joked, it was like, I was like, dude is like gonna have total electrical failure and he is gonna not make it to the end of the race.

It was like the last lap. He is like, uh, guys, uh, my steering wheel’s not working anymore. Like something wasn’t working and it was like the car was shutting down.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: I don’t think he had any more lap in it.

Crew Chief Eric: Outside of all that. I mean, Mercedes is doing great. Red Bull’s doing Red Bull, Ferraris, whatever.

China was, meh. Suzuka was a complete snooze fest. So boring for such a legacy track with so much character and so much history. And you watch the old races of, you know, Sena at Suzuka, the track hasn’t changed other than the repaid. The

Executive Producer Tania: cars have changed. The cars are twice as long as Senna’s days. Yeah, I mean it’s an exaggeration, but they’re so much bigger.

The rules are different. The parody is [00:41:00] different. So boring. Basically watching it to finally one day be there to see something happen. Because honestly, after the first couple opening laps where you’re checking to see if they don’t wreck and turn one or wreck anywhere in the first lap, it basically becomes

Crew Chief Eric: an HPD where

Executive Producer Tania: they’re just

Crew Chief Eric: going around awful.

And then Bahrain was the most exciting race so far. Hands down. That was really good. And then Saudi is like a go-kart track. There is no space. There’s zero space for error, as we saw with Sonota in the second turn of the first lap. What the heck are you guys doing? And then. Max cutting off turn two because there was no room and that whole debate and debacle.

But that track was boring. Like once they set their pace, it wasn’t any better than Monaco where there’s, there’s no room to pass because the cars are too big. So the whole excitement of Formula one in the old days was then cutting it up and dicing it up and why can’t we go back to the smaller wheel based card?

Because then they’d be slower and then they can’t be slower. Do they really have to do 200 miles an hour? I mean that’s what the endurance cars do, [00:42:00] right? Or more than 200 to do like two 30, but they’ve got the space to do it.

Executive Producer Tania: I think they should go back to manual gear boxes also to make it more interesting.

Yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: the whole tire thing is dumb and the pit stop strategies are weird and well,

Executive Producer Tania: there’s no more refueling. So you took that variable out of it. Like you didn’t have the guy running outta fuel in the last lap, you know, had the minimum fuel load. So it was lightweight and going faster and miscalculated.

Crew Chief Eric: I noticed this year they got rid of the whole energy thing where they have the virtual refueling that’s gone. Right. I haven’t seen that again, they don’t really highlight it too much.

Crew Chief Brad: That wasn’t F1 that was in emsa. That was uh Lama.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh, maybe you’re right. There is a thing where they gotta do something but they don’t usually publicize.

Well

Crew Chief Eric: anyway, Hamilton is not doing so great.

Executive Producer Tania: He’s not impressing. There’s lots of excuses, if you will. That’s the right word for it. And I know if you wanna say excuses, but explanations that he gives, like the latest one he was talking about was how different the brakes on the Ferrari are from what he is used to.

He said, we made a point of saying that he is never engine braked. Ever. And that’s [00:43:00] something that you do in the Ferraris. And so he is not used to it. Which if that’s true, I mean, you could lose a lot of time if your break points aren’t correct.

Crew Chief Eric: But if they’re using engine braking, then that means they can go deeper into the corners and use the engine to help slow the car down.

It’s not like the braking zones became longer as a result of it. ’cause Le Claire isn’t complaining about those problems. Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: But Le Claire’s been driving the car for like five seasons or something, so he’s gotten used to it.

Crew Chief Eric: Million time world champion. Louis Hamilton doesn’t know how to drive a Formula one car.

Is that what you’re telling me?

Executive Producer Tania: I’ve never driven a Formula One car. I don’t know how easy it is to go from one to the other.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s like spec me. They’re all the same, right? I mean,

Executive Producer Tania: come on. I mean, in theory the, it’s all the same, but how do you eke out your 12 tenths. Yeah, you eek

Crew Chief Eric: it out when you’re 18 years old and not 40 or 65 like Alonzo.

Executive Producer Tania: And that might be true, although Alonzo had like, I forget how many, like a hundred points last season. Like he actually podiums once, no, in the first like 10 races. I think he was on the podium every time. And then the car like totally would became [00:44:00] like an ass. I don’t know what they did.

Crew Chief Eric: They upgraded

Crew Chief Brad: it.

Executive Producer Tania: They downgraded it.

Crew Chief Brad: Eric, you’re just an ageist.

Crew Chief Eric: No, I, okay. Look at the rest of the field. The median age of the drivers. I mean, come on. They’re all in their early twenties.

Executive Producer Tania: It’s funny how he like rooting against, ’cause in fact, like I’d love to see somebody who’s 40 years old go out and kick the ass of all the 18-year-old new rookie drivers.

Yeah, I, I

Crew Chief Brad: think he’s just being contrarian because people like Lewis probably like, oh fuck, Lewis Hamilton,

Executive Producer Tania: he never liked Lewis. So that’s part of it too.

Crew Chief Eric: This is just like when Lada spent one too many seasons behind the wheel and he should have retired earlier than he did.

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, that’s probably true, but they’ve all done it.

Schumacher

Crew Chief Eric: should

Executive Producer Tania: have

Crew Chief Eric: stopped those two seasons with Mercedes were crap. He should have never done that. Like a hundred percent. I don’t disagree with, and he was in his forties as well. And no, I’m not saying that, you know, somebody in their forties or 65 like Alonzo couldn’t win. A race or win a championship.

But the point is he’s not showing any enthusiasm, like even the background shots of Hamilton, like he’s disconnected. [00:45:00] They keep saying he doesn’t get along with his race engineer. There’s all these excuses, blah, blah, blah. Then why did you leave Mercedes? Because obviously the Mercedes suddenly got better overnight or did it get better because you weren’t there sucking in the driver’s seat?

So which is it? I am throwing shade, but I’m not trying to be any sort of way to be like, look, if you can’t do it, then hang it up. There’s a lot of young drivers in F two that wanna move up and other people that want an opportunity, and both him and Alonzo are sucking up a seat as the second chair collecting a paycheck.

Go do something else. Go race at Lama. Go do touring car. I don’t care what you do. But in Formula One, I think he’s done. I don’t think even if Hamilton runs another couple of years and say he goes to 43 or 44 like Alonzo is, that’s his real age folks. That’s another four years. I don’t think he’s got a championship in the next four years.

I just don’t see it. I don’t see it with Ferrari. So who does he go to? Is he gonna go Red Bull? Is he gonna pull a Sena and go to like he did with going to Williams in his last year? And then Well that, we know how that ended. But the point [00:46:00] is all that shuffling around, I think the younger guys, they just have the advantage and I’ve been impressed ’cause we make fun.

Haas with Toyota has been doing really great this season and Williams has been shockingly good. Bottom of the barrel teams, unfortunately Albers just there.

Executive Producer Tania: Williams was middle pack last year also. So where they are right now is really no different than they’re not suddenly a magic that they’ve never been before.

Alban was doing pretty decently last year and then they’ve got the benefit of Carlos in the other car. Which he was a higher position person when he was in Ferrari. So there’s obviously a difference between two cars ’cause he’s not in the top five at any point.

Crew Chief Eric: Again, they’re putting the cars together with chisels and spoons or something.

I don’t know. But they’re

Executive Producer Tania: all the same. It’s, it’s mi aup. Right? That’s what I’m saying. You should be able to take pole and being first again,

Crew Chief Eric: Aston Martin should have come out the gate with Adrian Newey on the payroll and won the championship. Fernando Alonzo Champion 2025.

Executive Producer Tania: He’s not. And you even [00:47:00] read the article that said that Newey has gone in there and said you all are sitting here with the most antiquated bullshit.

Yes. 20-year-old stuff. What is he gonna work with? It’s gonna take him, God knows how many races in months before he gets things. Probably how he wants it.

Crew Chief Brad: And then he is gonna get somewhere else. Pretty much.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. Not as long as Daddy stroll’s paying.

Crew Chief Brad: Daddy wore once a dollar.

Executive Producer Tania: The

Crew Chief Eric: Sonota Liam Lawson thing is.

Hilarious. It’s not

Executive Producer Tania: surprising at all to anyone who’s, who knows how the Red Bull people operate. This was a zero shock and should have been seen coming

Crew Chief Eric: a mile away. It’s amazing how they could just switch. But then it’s not amazing because it’s all the same team. They have four cars. One’s a junior team and one’s a senior team, and they can move drivers around all day long.

It’s not like they fired him.

Executive Producer Tania: They would’ve fired his ass anyway. ’cause they did that with the junior team last year. They got rid of a driver completely.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: If they didn’t like suno enough to move him up, they probably would’ve gotten somebody from anywhere else and brought him in. They don’t give a

Crew Chief Eric: shit.

Do you think he’s gonna make it to the end of the year?

Executive Producer Tania: I don’t know. Because if they’re gonna, I don’t know. When he didn’t crash out, he [00:48:00] was okay. He was better than Liam at least. So they probably gonna give him a little bit more of a chance. But if he starts wrecking every race or finishing in the bottom, I don’t know if there’s like a driver swap limit in a season,

Crew Chief Eric: they’ll bring Botox in.

That’s what they’ll do. Oh, no wait, he is a Mercedes as a backup driver. Nevermind.

Crew Chief Brad: They’ll bring back Checko

Crew Chief Eric: a check. Checko or Daniel Ricardo. They’re like, yeah, we’ll settle for Ricardo. It’s fine. We’ll just bring him back. It’ll be okay. It’s gotta be better than this. So there’s other controversy going on, allegedly, supposedly, maybe.

This is again, hokey pokey. And I read this on the Audi Club news that v tens could be returning, but Audi’s not happy about that because that goes against their whole EV thing. So they’re taking a stand and they might pull out, but they might stay in. But I don’t know what’s going on. But I’m excited. V tens returning to Formula One.

Hallelujah. That’s awesome.

Executive Producer Tania: The latest says they’re not gonna do the V tens, but

Crew Chief Eric: who knows again, the hokey pokey. But in some Formula one Florida man, you mentioned Carlos, you had me cracking up about [00:49:00] this the other day. Phyllis in

Executive Producer Tania: feel bad for the guy ’cause he got a 10,000 euro fine that he had to pay for being five seconds late to the Japanese anthem as it was playing at the very beginning of the festivities.

So with tariffs, that’s like $50,000

Crew Chief Brad: if you do the math. I mean, he’s set to make $10 million this year.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh, it’s nothing.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s the, yeah, it’s the equip. It’s 10 basis points. It’s point. It’s not that he can’t afford it, it’s nothing. Yeah, it’s It’s the point.

Executive Producer Tania: It’s nothing like really, it’s like I was late ’cause I was having a bathroom emergency.

Crew Chief Brad: He’s making a big stink about it.

Executive Producer Tania: He literally flushed money down the toilet.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah, yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: And they had very strict protocols and rules in F1 about being where you need to be and all that stuff. And he actually received a 50% penalty ’cause they took pity on him. And the reason he was late was because he literally had to go to the bathroom.

Number two. He even has a medical doctor saying that he was having stomach issues and that like legitimately, yeah. Like he had to go to the bathroom and [00:50:00] they, they were like, no, we’re still gonna give you a 10,000 Euro penalty. So basically stand there and crap. Your pants is the better answer than being a human and having like a gastro

Crew Chief Eric: issue.

He should get sponsored by Pepto. That’s what he should do.

ANNOUNCER!: Miami’s heat, Mila’s heritage, Monaco’s, glittering streets. Each stage brought its own drama. Ptri struck in America, Besta and fought back in Italy, and Norris claimed the jewel of Monte Carlo. May was a month of glamor, but beneath the champagne, the battle lines were drawn.

Crew Chief Brad: Predictions for Monaco.

Crew Chief Eric: It is a

Executive Producer Tania: snooze fest.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, it’s a procession.

Executive Producer Tania: Sounds like it might rain during qualifying. There’s a slight chance, but looks like there’s sun during the race, so there you have it.

Crew Chief Eric: No. Yeah, wherever they qualify is where they finish, unless somebody wrecks and that’s pretty much it.

Or Ocon tries to take ’em all out again. One or the other.

Crew Chief Brad: I’m gonna predict Lance Stroll is not gonna win.

Crew Chief Eric: I was [00:51:00] gonna say,

hold on. I’m gonna do the Great Carac for a minute. And Louis Hamilton eighth place?

Crew Chief Brad: No, I think Louis Hamilton’s gonna get sixth place, please. I think Alonzo’s gonna win.

Crew Chief Eric: No Alonzo’s too busy just being a jerk. Like does he want everybody to hate him? I read these articles about Alonzo and he’s just like, I don’t get it.

Like if you’re done with Formula One, retire,

Crew Chief Brad: he’s not done. He’s not done with this.

Crew Chief Eric: Oh, is that what it is? Yeah. It’s not done with the money. The Benjamins. No,

Crew Chief Brad: of course not. Okay.

Crew Chief Eric: Okay. God. He drives me nuts though. He’s got such a chip on his shoulder and I was hopeful there because the Mila race last weekend was one of the most exciting races we’ve seen so far, at least to a point.

And it was like, oh look, Alonzo, he’s up near the front and then it was like boom, garbage back of the pack. I realized he is there to tow Lance stroll around. He is paid to be in front of [00:52:00] Lance and just do lead follow while a race is happening. It’s like a de, it’s ridiculous. That’s

Executive Producer Tania: not a bad gig I guess.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah dude, I would be so pissed.

Executive Producer Tania: Depends how much money he is getting.

Crew Chief Eric: Go do something else. Go race WEC or

Crew Chief Brad: But what else? What else does he have to prove? He’s won Lama, hasn’t he won an F1 championship? Yeah, a couple of them. So what else does he have to prove? Who gives a shit? Will you think? Fine. Did

Crew Chief Eric: he win Indy as well?

Crew Chief Brad: No, his car broke down.

Crew Chief Eric: Ah, okay. So he doesn’t have the triple crown. He was in the

Crew Chief Brad: Hondas. That kept breaking down I think.

Crew Chief Eric: Well then he should go do like the Berg ring 24 or something different. I think

Crew Chief Brad: he’s gonna go do whatever the hell he wants and he doesn’t care what any of us think. He’s got his money, he’s got his championships in two different motor sports.

He’s fine. Go run to car, go Valentino Rossi and go to motorcycles. Go the other way.

Executive Producer Tania: I’m not sure that transition works as well.

Crew Chief Brad: Uh, it it, it does not. It is a very different discipline. That’s

Crew Chief Eric: when, uh, like Hockman went to go do rally and he is apparently the only finished person without rally jeans in his [00:53:00] DNA and he was absolutely terrible at it.

Crew Chief Brad: Does he have NASCAR jeans and stuff?

Crew Chief Eric: Oh, like you kidding me? Yeah. No, no, no, no. Alright, so continuing the saga of the Tizi and Ferrari and Lewis and all this happy horse hockey Miami. Is a terrible track.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s a terrible event. Yeah, boy, it’s a waste of time.

Crew Chief Eric: Terrible track. It sucks. But there was a moment of just absolute radio glory.

It was the funniest thing. So Tanya, do you remember it was like after all the rain debacle and weather, it was gonna rain, whether it was gonna rain, there was all that stuff at the beginning. So it was a little bit exciting. And then once there was no more call for rain, it got super boring and everybody just kind of fell into place.

Much like with some of the other tracks. There was that moment though, where Lewis is fighting with Le Claire over the radio because one is arguing that the other one is holding them up and the team orders and the team wasn’t giving in the, giving the point by let him through, right? Yes. So Brad, did you see this race?

Crew Chief Brad: No, but I think I [00:54:00] saw blips of what you’re talking about.

Crew Chief Eric: So LeClaire at some point is like, all right, give me back the position, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So he is gotta let Le Claire through. And Hamilton didn’t really want to. Although he made a big stink about having better tires and he really didn’t gain anything by being in front of Le Claire.

It’s like, because the Ferrari’s are like, I don’t know, they’re just dog shit. They must be four cylinders while everybody else is six because they can’t get out of their own way. To that end, he lets Le Claire through and then his engineers like on the radio and he is like signs, 1.6 signs, one point whatever signs.

Science is behind him and then Lewis is like, do you want me to let him through too? And I just died. That is the funniest thing I’ve heard in Formula One in like forever Apparently it like went over like a lead balloon, right? As it should. But I was like, I was not expecting that from Hamilton for him to like sort of bite back and be like, Hey, why don’t we let me let signs pass too?

He’s very frustrated.

Crew Chief Brad: Was this the same race where he said that it like, [00:55:00] just go have a tea or something like that?

Crew Chief Eric: Yes. Yeah. That was later because he is like, the strategy was complete bunk and he’s like, these guys don’t know what they’re doing. And it is just, it’s a absolute mess. And obviously he’s comparing them to many years of being with Mercedes.

That race in Miami was, it was boring. The second half was whatever. Other than that it was, yeah, it was boring.

Crew Chief Brad: It seems like over the last couple years, Ferrari has just not been able to figure out a strategy that works.

Crew Chief Eric: So why did he go to Ferrari? It was stupid. Oh, it’s about that. It’s about that again.

It’s about the tariffs. I got it again. How

Crew Chief Brad: many championships does he have? What does he actually have to prove? I don’t hear what he says in public facing.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, but

Crew Chief Brad: what does he actually have to prove? Absolutely not a God thing. Collective

Crew Chief Eric: paycheck.

Crew Chief Brad: Yes, exactly.

Crew Chief Eric: Like I’ve been saying. So Emila the uh, Emelia Romania Grand Prix.

That was a good race. That was exciting. Lots of interesting stuff’s happening. Suddenly the Red Bull is fast again. The McLaren’s, you know, they want to take each other out. I think Lando is kind of playing dirty. I don’t just let [00:56:00] Piore do his thing. He’s faster than you get out of the way. It’s all these games there too.

But I think LeClaire, you really got to see some of his true colors come through at that race. He got angry and he was driving in anger and I think it was hilarious. And there was that moment there on the radio too where he’s like, is this what racing has become? Right? Where it’s all BS team politics and they can’t just race anymore because we have to go to Plan Delta.

We have to go to plan this and that, and blah, blah blah, and all this shit. It’s like, just let ’em drive. Just let them drive. Stop screwing around with tires and pit stop nonsense. Build a better mouse trap. Go out and race the hell out of ’em. And let’s see who wins. But Tanya, you kept talking about turbo mushrooms during that race.

The Ferrari cars have a problem

Executive Producer Tania: and it’ll be interesting. Whatever that problem is, is ever unearthed because they are incredibly slow and sluggish. They barely can pass each other. They can’t keep up with the fricking Williams, with [00:57:00] DRS wide open. They can’t make a pass. Everything is super slow. But then there’s moments where it’s like he got the turbo mushroom in Mario Kart, and suddenly like he’s raking people in and like the lap times are coming down and it’s like, holy crap, here we go.

Let’s go. And then suddenly it’s like, do. And the mushroom ran out and is back to being turd. They can’t get it out its own way and accelerate. Like what is wrong?

Crew Chief Eric: That, or the geral wore off one or the other.

Executive Producer Tania: Even LA Clare’s car is the

Crew Chief Eric: same thing. Yeah. Personally, watching some of that video of the Incar when they’re running for top speed, even with DRS open, they’re like an eighth gear foot to the floor and the thing just hangs there at like 6,000 RPM in the wrong part of the rev range and it just, it won’t pull.

And I turned to Tanya as we were watching, I said, I think the Ferrari needs to redesign their transmission. I think the gearing is wrong. And that’s keeping those cars behind. If they could shorten up their gear pack a little bit, six, seven, and eighth [00:58:00] gear, maybe they could get back some of the speed that they’re missing.

But if you’re sitting there in eighth gear at 6,000 RPM doing 190 miles an hour and it won’t pull, what is it geared for? 300? Like, it doesn’t make any sense. Those stupid engines turn like 14,000 rrp. M you’re barely in the power zone at that point. You might as well just leave it in seventh. You know? So I, I think their gearing is maybe what’s killing them.

And then we’re gonna hear excuses about the floor design and this and that. And the wing here. And the wing there. I think it’s the transmission. I think that’s the Achilles heel of the Ferrari.

Executive Producer Tania: And we heard Hamilton, I think it was even in the last. Keeps complaining about the brakes. The brakes are very different.

The design is different than what he is used to from Mercedes. He mentioned before that he’s never had to engine brake one of the cars before, and he’s having to learn how to do that here and it’s okay. So maybe one to chalk it up to he’s sing the violin, singing a song, complaining. But at this last race.

LeClaire through qualifying in like [00:59:00] practice was bemoaning the brakes. Like, my God, my God, my God. Apparently they were like behaving. So I don’t know what their technology or their brakes is, but it would, they, they’re

Crew Chief Eric: electric.

Executive Producer Tania: They would behave one way in a certain time and then suddenly they were behaving differently at another time.

And it’s like, if you brakes don’t work. If they’re not carrying the right speed or decreasing the speed in the zones and, and having the right power to come out, and if they have a sluggish motor, the transmission’s not geared correctly. I mean, they’re losing time everywhere.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: They can’t get outta their own way.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s horrible.

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, LA Clara’s not a bad driver. He’s fighting. And we could say the Louis Hamilton’s not a bad driver either, right? And he’s doing crap. But then you see that them when they’re side by side with the other cars and it’s like the disparity is kind of evident. They are not competitive against the Red Bull or the McLaren.

We’ll see how it changes. What

Crew Chief Eric: race number is this? Like 10? Uh, I don’t know that there’s been that many, but my prediction has held true by the third race. He wasn’t gonna do any better than where he is at.

Executive Producer Tania: But [01:00:00] if the car is a problem, then it’s not fair either,

Crew Chief Brad: because where are the Mercedes?

Crew Chief Eric: They’re at the front doing better.

Antonelli started like second at Amala. It was insane. You guys told the Mercedes is inferior. They don’t know how to build a car, blah, blah, blah, and now they’re like kicking butt. I don’t

Crew Chief Brad: think anybody said that

Executive Producer Tania: the Mercedes as last year’s season. So Mercedes fell off and they were wildly uncompetitive.

You talk about how, yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Ferrari can’t accelerate and get out of its own way. It was pathetic. The Mercedes as the season last year, wound down their improvements. You could see they were doing better, the Mercedes was becoming more competitive. So whatever they’ve done coming into this year, yes, they have a more competitive car.

So maybe had he stayed with Mercedes, it’d be a whole other story right now.

Crew Chief Eric: Russell’s doing great. Antonelli’s doing great. Guess we’ll see. Too bad. Super disappointed in Ferrari this year, but I’m gonna tough it out. I promise you guys we’re gonna, we’re gonna ride to the end. That

Executive Producer Tania: would’ve been the last five years as well.

[01:01:00] So, I mean,

Crew Chief Eric: and you wonder why I don’t watch. I’m telling you guys spend a year following IMSA and WEC and you will see much better racing than the garbage that Formula One is putting out. And now we’re gonna bring Mickey Mouse into the equation now. Now there’s partnerships with Disney. Once I read that, I was like, thank God this is the only year I can go back to watching real racing and not this trash.

He acts like somebody put a gun to his head doing it for you guys. You called me out. You said, I didn’t know we told you to watch Drive to Survive.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah. You’re not a real fan unless you watch Drive to Survive.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, let’s correct that. Emmy Award-winning drive to Survive. Let me puke a little bit.

Executive Producer Tania: Netflix’s Emmy Award-winning.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s like giving yourself your own. Yeah. It’s such garbage. Whatever. No, thank you. There is no reason to watch Drive to Survive if you watch the races. I mean, I’m just gonna flat out say that,

Crew Chief Brad: but you don’t get all the drama.

Crew Chief Eric: Ah, you know what’s gonna have a bunch of drama in it, this Brad Pitt movie.

Are we gonna go see it? I mean, eventually I will see it when it’s at the bargain bin. [01:02:00] Free 99 on your streaming service.

Executive Producer Tania: Preferably, but I, I guess I could spend money on it. I think I have a gift card.

Crew Chief Eric: Wow. I’ll use someone else’s money to watch this terrible movie. Third one of the night, Brad Pitt movie, or completely unrelated, but car adjacent the Paul Walker story.

Which would you watch?

Crew Chief Brad: I need more. Is it any Brad Pitt movie or

Crew Chief Eric: the Brad Pitt Formula one movie is what I’m referring to.

Crew Chief Brad: So driven two or the Paul Walker story?

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. Yeah.

Crew Chief Brad: Um, I would rather sit there and watch Sesame Street with my kids for two hours.

Crew Chief Eric: Again, you’re gonna be able to watch Disney with F1 soon enough.

So that’s the future.

Crew Chief Brad: That’s the future. That means ESPN owned by Disney too, so yeah. Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Wait, is that what the partnership is that like you’ll be able to stream Formula One

Crew Chief Eric: on Disney. All I saw were pictures of Mickey Mouse with a Formula One car and I was just like, I’m done. I’m out.

Executive Producer Tania: No, I’m not out.

’cause if you’re regular streaming Disney Plus, if you’ve got a subscription to it, now you can watch Formula One without paying. Another [01:03:00] subscription to the F1 channel.

Crew Chief Brad: Can we rename the F1 drivers with cars characters? Oh man, that’d be

Crew Chief Eric: so funny.

Crew Chief Brad: The winner of this year’s championship becomes Lightning McQueen.

Crew Chief Eric: Mm.

Crew Chief Brad: And then we’ve got the other guys, I don’t remember their names.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh, is there gonna be a Pixar Cars? But F1.

Crew Chief Brad: There was an F1 car. He was Italian in cars too.

Crew Chief Eric: Yes. I just don’t see F1 TV giving up the goat to Disney giving them the rights. No, I don’t think

Executive Producer Tania: that’s what this is. They’re trying to appeal to the very younger crowd by like partnering to have the mascots.

But then I would question, do young kids even watch Mickey Mouse? Henry likes it.

Crew Chief Eric: They’re still on. Okay. Maybe it’s the other way. Formula One is trying to bring Disney up to its level, not the other way around.

Crew Chief Brad: They gonna move the Miami race to Orlando.

Crew Chief Eric: It’ll be on an oval and it’ll be run by Indy cars.

Crew Chief Brad: Oh wait, wait.

They already do that. Go 45 minutes east and just run it a Daytona.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, I guess we’ll have to report on the developments of this as they come to [01:04:00] light in the upcoming months.

ANNOUNCER!: Yes. Spain fell to Ptri, but Canada belonged to George Russell. A defiant reminder that Mercedes had not faded. Austria returned Norris to the top step.

June was a carousel of champions. Each victory reshaping the narrative of the year.

Crew Chief Eric: All right. Ferrari, three pizzas at lama. How come Ferrari Formula One can’t build a car? That’s worth a damn. I’m just gonna lay it out there.

William Ross: F1 is getting very, very boring. You don’t say especially watching Monaco. That’s just a joke.

Charles LeClair, however you wanna pronounce his name, Charles, whatever, you’ll never be anything other than angry. Yes, angry. Angry, little Frenchman. I’m sorry, manganese, or however we pronounce that

Crew Chief Brad: Mangas.

William Ross: I think Louis Hamilton’s passed his prime new regulations come in next year and it’s either hit or miss.

’cause then you’re always chasing it. But it’s whoever can nail it right outta the thing is gonna win. I mean, look what Mercedes did. And all of a sudden, now it’s Red Bull came into it. Now all of a sudden it’s [01:05:00] McClaren. McClaren just got it, refined it and nailed down the little things to it. But now all of a sudden, next year, it’s completely new regulations.

You know, I always look at both sides and say, well, you know, if you look at qualifying that it’s either no more than second or second half between lap times and everyone’s always in 10 tense, this and that. But then you watch the race and everything spreads out and just why they can’t get their shit together.

And I just can’t believe that they would get rid of Asur that quickly. Yeah. And put it all on him. Come on, whoever nicked the idea of bringing Newie and not just, oh, here, here’s the checkbook, Adrian, how much you want. Whatever you need, get it. Why they didn’t sign him. I don’t know. Someone’s ego got in the way.

They didn’t wanna have him there, and I don’t know if it was au, whoever it was, but that was a huge F up on their part for not getting Adrian Newey huge. Especially next year, Aston Martin comes out and starts just crushing it. Heads will roll because they’ll just prove the point. I mean, as we all know, Adrian knew he is just, you know, he’s the man that’s that.

And they’ll have Honda engines, so they’ll have the power, how they can still call themselves as to, Martin is beyond me. I mean, [01:06:00]

Crew Chief Eric: so Tonya, you have this meme here. Well,

Executive Producer Tania: it’s not a meme, it’s a quote. Who’s saying this? Fred Ser, apparently.

Crew Chief Eric: And who is he referring to himself? I don’t know who

Executive Producer Tania: the one thing is.

Crew Chief Eric: Is it the car at this point? The motor. Why don’t you read it for our audience? ’cause they’re not looking at this.

Executive Producer Tania: Fred Vaser is quoted as saying we must ask ourselves the right questions. If Ferrari hasn’t won for years. We’ve changed the team principle, the drivers, we’ve changed everything. Except one thing

Crew Chief Eric: is that his resignation.

What is that?

Executive Producer Tania: Well, he’s the principal that’s changed, so they’ve already done that. I don’t know. Is it higher ups in Ferrari?

William Ross: I think he’s talking about their mentality, I would think. But I mean, obviously there’s more than that that needs to change. But the problem with Ferrari is they’re so bureaucratic in regards to how they run everything internally.

It’s. Horrendous.

Crew Chief Eric: How is the LAMA team? How are the 4, 9, 9 P guys getting away with it? They built a killer car three years in a row.

Crew Chief Brad: You said it already. They’re not a factory team. They’re a private tier.

William Ross: Mm. And if they [01:07:00] poach the guy that’s running that now and put him in charge, get rid of Aser and put him in, then okay.

Then there goes your Lamas team. They’re done. Yeah. If they’re trying to say that’s the case, then they both suck. Yeah. Then they’re both bad.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s why I said Ferrari has to leave Lamont after this year. They need to stop and go out on a high, three in a row. You know? Wait another 52 years to come back

Crew Chief Brad: and just call it a day.

I feel like that’s cowardly lying. They can’t do that. Ford’s coming in next year. They’ve gotta go against Ford. They have to.

Executive Producer Tania: We need a new movie. Ford V. Ferrari part two.

Crew Chief Brad: Part two. It’ll be like hot shots. Part part two. Yeah, part part two. Hot shots, part

Crew Chief Eric: two.

Crew Chief Brad: That’s awesome. The second one,

Crew Chief Eric: as long as it doesn’t end up like Highlander Part two and nevermind.

Like the naked gun, two and a half or whatever it was. Oh, there

Executive Producer Tania: is a new naked gun coming out. Let’s not go there.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, right. Oh, sweet. Don’t search for that on the internet kids. So let’s talk about Monaco just a little bit longer. Although it doesn’t need any more airtime than it’s already gotten.

Executive Producer Tania: The drivers hate the race.

Crew Chief Eric: The fans hate the [01:08:00] race.

Executive Producer Tania: Why are they still racing there? Other than that quote? It’s Monaco. And who gives a crap? What’s that Musical Tradition. Tradition. Bitler on the roof. Yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: there you go.

Crew Chief Brad: I don’t even think it’s got anything to do with tradition. I think it’s money.

William Ross: Oh yeah. Now moving the date too.

They’re changed all up. Not gonna be on Memorial Weekend anymore. Yeah, just a cash grab. Yeah. I mean, that’s what it boils down to, you know, using that excuse. Oh, it’s traditional. Oh, there’s, yeah, Tanya said Everyone hates it there. Drivers hate it. Teams hate it. The cars are too big, there’s no passing, there’s nothing.

Executive Producer Tania: And they tried to make it more interesting by forcing additional pit stops and it did nothing. Yeah, it did absolutely nothing. It did not change the order of anything.

Crew Chief Eric: That should have been a no pit stop race. Just get it done. And there

Executive Producer Tania: should have been blue flag, black flags for people that were just worse than parade lapping and holding people up.

Like get outta the way.

Crew Chief Brad: I think for Monaco, I think they should. Yeah. Like Eric said, note pit stops and then remove all FIA regulations. Just let ’em go. [01:09:00] Just the the, the Mad Max race.

William Ross: That would be awesome.

Crew Chief Brad: Thunderdome

William Ross: and every 10 laughs. They gotta switch cars with their teammate. They gotta jump in each other’s car.

That would make it way better be like Formula E. In the old days, they gotta switch cars.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah. And they, they should start a reverse grid. There we go. Ooh. And then maybe every 20 laps the drivers get out and fight. They get out into a fist fight.

Crew Chief Eric: If they did reverse grid, that might be the only opportunity.

Lance Scroll will ever win a race.

Crew Chief Brad: Lance scroll. Lance scroll.

Executive Producer Tania: If they would’ve reversed Grided, Monaco, Antonelli would’ve been first. Ah, that’s

Crew Chief Eric: true. Haas could get a win. If they reversed grid. It’d be amazing. They still wouldn’t get a win. I’m impressed with Haas this year. I have to say like they’re kind of middle of the pack.

There’s no reason to really make fun of him anymore. And there’s other teams where you’re like, all right, Sal’s just there waiting for Audi to take over. And Aston Martin’s pathetic. And Williams is sort of, again, fighting in the middle, so I can’t really say too much. But the ones I poke the most fun at is Ferrari.

[01:10:00] And it’s heartbreaking. Every race. Is pathetic. I don’t understand. Their dog shit’s slow. That’s all I can say. I don’t unders like DRS wide open drafting somebody and you still can’t get around them. Oh, which

Executive Producer Tania: race was it? Catalonia? I don’t remember, but I know you didn’t believe me for the longest time when I said the Ferraris are slow.

There is a problem with them. And then you saw it when it was like Hamilton verse LeClaire and the DRS Open couldn’t pass him. LeClaire couldn’t pass Hamilton with the DRS open. What are you talking about? Yeah. And then you see like whoever the hell else has with their DRS open and they’re like, shoot by somebody.

It’s like, what is that? It’s an air break instead of like a speed up.

William Ross: It was team orders. Yeah. They get on the radio, let him by. Why? Made this sense. You know why?

Crew Chief Eric: Because you end up like Lando in Canada. That’s why. Oh, what a knucklehead. What was he thinking?

Executive Producer Tania: That guy is his own worst enemy and he chokes.

He chokes. What a knucklehead. Yeah. Where do you think you were going?

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, [01:11:00] that was a eye racing move. Like he was suddenly gonna have traction and space on an island that is the size of Brad’s shoe.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, he, he must have thought Pire was just gonna move over for him. ’cause Pire held his line. He didn’t move to the left, he didn’t pinch him off.

He was in a position and he held that position and then he thought he was just gonna fit. In half the size of a Formula one car.

William Ross: Maybe he thought he was gonna pull that. Uh, what that guy did, the NASCAR movie where he just pinned it against the wall and just pinned it and went around. He figured you just slammed the wall and go

Crew Chief Eric: No, no.

Like the cars movie where he bounces up and then he flips over and lands on the other side. Yeah, that would’ve been great. Yeah. There we go. Fantastic. Some James Bond stuff. Ugh. Canada was boring. Just like Monaco because it’s too small. It’s too tight. It’s just one car width wide. I mean it’s just, Ugh.

That’s another one that, it’s tradition. They run Canada ’cause they, they have to have a Grand Prix in Canada I guess.

William Ross: Well I thought they were getting away from that track. I thought they were supposed to go um, where to Mosport? I thought they were moving away from the island for that [01:12:00] reason. ’cause one going racing, two accessibility.

’cause it’s a nightmare in regards to Yes. There’s only those two ways or one way to get on and off that island. And you gotta get bused on. Yeah, you can’t

Crew Chief Eric: park there. There’s no grandstand.

Executive Producer Tania: Well there are grandstands stops saying that you saw them

Crew Chief Eric: compared to Kona. There’s like no grandstands. There’s like nothing.

There might as well be three chairs and 10 people like playing, you know, musical chairs.

William Ross: Yeah. I always thought they were moving it to downtown or something. Like they were gonna do actually. Oh, that’d be

Crew Chief Eric: even worse. We went to Montreal a couple years ago. The streets downtown.

William Ross: Oh yeah. Horrendous.

Crew Chief Eric: It might as well be Jeep Wranglers racing, not formula cars.

Executive Producer Tania: Not even that, but Montreal is a very grid laid out. Plus city courses are all terrible.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, they’re all awful. Look at Monaco.

Crew Chief Brad: They should move it to Toronto and drive around the skydome parking lot.

Crew Chief Eric: Oh, that’s like what they’re trying to do for indie car. Right. And down in Texas or whatever. Down in Dallas, around the stadium.

But then that ends up like Miami. Right. And then you’re like, that’s horrible. Sucks too. Now I will say I have a newfound appreciation for [01:13:00] Catalonia. That was actually a decent race. The Spanish Grand Prix was pretty good. The outcome was nothing short of to be expected. So I was like, all right, whatever.

But again, Ferrari can’t get outta their own way.

Executive Producer Tania: Hey, that’s the first race they podium

Crew Chief Eric: by luck.

Crew Chief Brad: How many cars were Uh, yeah, dnf. Yeah. Disqualified. Exactly. Three. What were there? Were there 18 cars? Dnf.

William Ross: And nothing’s gonna change now for Ian season because no one’s doing anything more with their cars this year.

And it’s all going to 2026. There might be one or two changes here and they’re very minimal, but, so nothing’s really gonna change in the order. Pastor’s gonna be world champion.

Executive Producer Tania: The Spanish GP was exciting because we hadn’t seen him for a while. We got to see Tappin’s true colors once again.

William Ross: Oh, that was so good.

Oh

Crew Chief Eric: man, that was good.

William Ross: God. I wanted him to get somehow some ways, so he got that last point on his license so he could get banned for the next race. Get suspended. That’d been awesome.

Executive Producer Tania: It’s astonishing that at the very least he wasn’t DQ from that race.

William Ross: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Collusion. I mean, he pretty much was on the radio saying, I’ll show him.

And then purposely [01:14:00] tried to punt him off the track.

Crew Chief Eric: I have said it before, you can take the racer out of the cart, but you can’t take the cart racer out of the boy. He drives like a cart racer.

Executive Producer Tania: No, that was not a cart racing move at all. That was a an aggressive vindictive move. High

Crew Chief Eric: racing move,

Executive Producer Tania: premeditated because he had all the space in the world not to do that.

Crew Chief Eric: I agree with all

Executive Producer Tania: of those things and that sends a bad message to people that are watching.

William Ross: So you think Red Bull will pay him a hundred million dollars next season to stay? That only thing that would keep him there cash. Rumor is he wants to leave. Saw that too. But I,

Executive Producer Tania: I don’t know. Then there’s rumors. He is gonna go to Aston or he is gonna go to Mercedes.

He is gonna go here. He is gonna go there. Really? I don’t know. Is he gonna go to Aston? ’cause Adrian’s there.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s the only reason. Is he gonna be the second driver to Lance who?

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. Who do you get rid of? Let’s play this game. Who do you get rid of? Stroll or Alonzo?

Crew Chief Eric: Who does Daddy Warbuck’s fire? Well, Alonzo’s 62 years old, so he needs to retire.

But [01:15:00] he’s

William Ross: a better driver than Stroll. Well, but Lance can’t go do tennis now ’cause of his wrist. So he is stuck in F1. Yeah.

Crew Chief Brad: Oh, poor baby.

Crew Chief Eric: And the, and the worst part is, and I’ve said this by watching the race Alonzo, they like give him a little taste of like being like at the front again and the excitement of the old days.

And then it’s like Fernando get back in line and start towing Lance around because that’s what he’s paid to do. He has Lance on his ass the whole time cutting through traffic and just toes lance around. That’s what he’s paid to do. I wouldn’t want that job. And if I was for stopping, I wouldn’t want that job either.

Regardless of Adrian Newey. No. ’cause that’s what you’re signing up to do is tow that guy around.

Crew Chief Brad: If I was making the money that they’re making, I would tow Lance Stroll wherever the fuck you wanted to go for his entire life. I don’t even care. You want to tow to McDonald’s? Let’s go. Yeah. You wanna tow the Starbucks?

You want me to tow you through the Starbucks drive through? Let’s do it. No, no, no. Do you wanna

Executive Producer Tania: toe to Timmy’s Tim Hortons?

Crew Chief Brad: Oh yeah. You, you wanna tow [01:16:00] to the Horton?

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, let’s get it right. Let’s get it right. Official sponsor of the F1 movie is KFC. You’re gonna tow him to get some Kentucky Fried chicken.

Crew Chief Brad: Oh hell yeah. Can tow you the KFC.

Crew Chief Eric: You seen those commercials? They’re so he stupid. I thought it was Taco Bell. Is it? No, it’s KFC. Well it’s the same company anyway. KFC, taco Bell, McDonald’s, whatever.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s all,

Crew Chief Eric: it’s all Pepsi. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

William Ross: Well, so speaking of the movie, is anyone here going to pay to go see it in the theater?

They’re gonna wait until it comes out on Apple.

Crew Chief Brad: I have small children. I will not be paying to go see anything.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh, coming out on Apple. Oh, that’s right.

William Ross: Don Apple don’t have Applet. You it. Yeah. So four weeks after it’s released, it’ll come on Apple. It should be. Or six weeks. I’ll get it on Voodoo.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah. I just canceled my Apple tv, so Yeah, I won’t be watching it for another year.

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, I think I have a gift card to a MC.

Crew Chief Eric: God. God. Well, you’re gonna do an episode about it if, if you go see it, I know you’re gonna go see it, William, come on.

William Ross: Yeah, I’m gonna go see it. We got this great new theater that opened up that’s got the reclining seats and everything. That, and tickets are only like $11 dirt cheap instead of like the 20 something.

Yeah, it’s, it’s awesome. It’s Phoenix [01:17:00] Theaters new first one in this area, I guess, or something. Or they’re starting, I don’t know. But yes, $10 and 79 cents or something like that. That’s not just Matt and Nate that’s like that anytime. Wow. At night you can go. It’s like me and my wife and daughter went the other night, saw movies.

All three of us tickets were only 32 bucks for all three of us. Do you have to make your own popcorn in the back? Well, I mean, I was smuggling my own candy, of course. And my diet. Mountain Dews.

Crew Chief Brad: Do you gotta

William Ross: stand there and run the reel? Yeah. Well it’s good exercise.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s why one arm’s bigger than the other.

William Ross: Yeah. All you have to do is clean up and vacuum after the movie. That’s, oh, there you go. Put on a vest and just clean up.

Crew Chief Brad: You gotta sell concessions to the next movie, the, the next time slot too. Exactly.

William Ross: It’s all give and take.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: So Tanya, you mentioned to me the other day that there are proposed wing changes.

That means that the Ferrari’s are gonna be even slower. Is that right?

Crew Chief Brad: They’re just gonna remove four bolts.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah, there you go.

That was a headline that was floating out there, but I think in the end it does all have to do with the [01:18:00] crackdown on the front wing deflection. Ah, okay. But I think they ended up changing more of the front wing design as a result of that. And so I think it went into effect ahead of Canada. So I don’t know that it necessarily negatively impacted ’em.

’cause they were as slow as normals.

Crew Chief Brad: They didn’t get any slower. That’s a plus,

Executive Producer Tania: but that’s a slow

Crew Chief Eric: track

Executive Producer Tania: too.

William Ross: But Claren didn’t change anything from my understanding. They didn’t change nothing. Everyone else had to change or they changed it. So then that’s why they’re trying to file protests or something like that and said No, it’s within line.

I mean, I know who the biggest culprit was of that flexi wing, Adrian Dewey. I’d love to see his, you know, his office and just seeing him go to town on the big drafting table, still using the mechanical pencil and everything. That’d be unbelievable to see.

Crew Chief Eric: No,

William Ross: it’s like that

Crew Chief Eric: episode of the office where he walks in and he shuts the door and he closes the blinds and he sits down and he starts crying at his desk.

That’s what Adrian is doing at Aston right now. What’d I do? What’d I do? That’s what he is doing.

ANNOUNCER!: Silverstone erupted as Norris triumphed before his home crowd. Belgium [01:19:00] swung back to Ptri Hungary, tilted again to Norris and in Zor. Ptri silenced for Staffan on Dutch soil. The summer sun burned hot, but the title fight burned hotter.

Still

Crew Chief Eric: since you’re here, William, but I’ve gotta ask because we joked we made fun of your $10 movie theater. Did you go see the F1 movie?

William Ross: Hell yes. It’s awesome. Is it, I think it’s a, I think it was a fantastic movie. I thought it was really good. And again, though I can asking, I said this like with Ford verse, fire up.

This is for entertainment. It’s not trying to nail it down, but they did a hell of a job capturing like the speed, the sound, everything. I mean, some of the shots that they got were ly. ’cause I mean you saw when they were filming how immersed they were with the actual F1 after races and everything like that.

Obviously you can clearly tell lots of CGI stuff this and that. Like, oh, that’ll never happen. So there’s a lot of stuff you go like, uh, but you gotta take with a grain of salt. It’s pure entertainment purposes.

Executive Producer Tania: Most of the racing footage was. Literally real racing footage that they went and CGI didn’t [01:20:00] change the colors of the car, so there wasn’t, you know, an Alpine or a Red Bull and stuff like that.

William Ross: Well, the one cool thing is they go back to, in the eighties when he like got into it, they used Martin Donnelly’s actual crash video and footage of him crashing, lying in the middle of the track, the whole nine yards. Wow. So it’s like that, it’s the actual video of it. So they used some real stuff in it.

They kind of cji to make, you know, so it was him in the car driving that lotus, but they used a lot of old footage back then, kind of having flashbacks and kinda how like he was supposed to be the next big thing just, and it’s kind of based Martin do never got back into an F1 car. No spoilers.

Crew Chief Eric: All right, so let me ask this.

Yeah, lemme ask again. Brad Pitt, blah, blah, blah. It’s like Tom Cruise and the rest of ’em. And you talk about the CGI and all this cool stuff in my mind, I think that the storyline, the plot, the acting, the, oh, it’s crap. Okay, so it’s like Grand Smo then, right?

William Ross: Yeah. I mean, come on, you go look at the thing. Oh, this would never happen.

It’s a complete joke. Oh, come on this guy. You’re trying to do the math in your head. Okay. If he was. Even [01:21:00] 18 or 19 when they’re saying he would have to be in the eighties when he break, and then what the years now would be, he’d be in his sixties. I

Crew Chief Eric: would never, ever freaking happen. It’s Alonzo. It’s just the story of Alonzo.

That’s, it’s

William Ross: Brad Pitts. All right. He’s made some good movies, but I mean, every movie he is in, he, he is the same demeanor, same. It’s just plug and play and doing it how he acts. But I enjoyed it. I think it’s definitely worth it to go see it. We didn’t stay for it, but we actually went to the drive-in the other night and it was the second movie.

We went and saw Superman and it was supposed to be the second one, but I was like, yeah, I don’t feel like staying. I, that’s when I’ll wait till it comes back out on Apple TV and I’ll watch it, you know, on my TV again. But I thought it was good.

Crew Chief Eric: Speaking of Apple tv, I heard that Apple is bidding for Formula One coverage for next year.

I

William Ross: think they got it.

Crew Chief Eric: Did they really? No, I thought Disney did. What is the deal with Disney and Formula One?

William Ross: Everyone’s trying to get on the bandwagon and depending on how long they buy the rice for to do it, if they buy it for any more than five years, they’re gonna be effed because I guarantee in five years the.

Popularity [01:22:00] here in the stage is gonna start waning big time. It’s gonna do that NASCAR thing where NASCAR was boom, boom, boom. Yeah. You know, same thing’s gonna happen here with that. What? Because everyone’s gonna just like, nah, it’s the same to your point, weekend to

Crew Chief Eric: your point, we heard a lot of that when we were at Lamont Classic and we were talking to other people about other racing disciplines and you know, people were surprised.

200,000 people showing for a vintage event is just ridiculous numbers. But you heard the same thing from a lot of people. I’m really tired of Formula One. The racing’s really boring, the drama is really fake, blah blah, you know, the same thing. And it, and I know I’ve been saying this, hearing it from other people, unsolicited, you’re sort of like, well, I guess I’m not alone on Survivor Island.

Okay. First of all, formula one TV has always been boring. I mean, it just doesn’t matter what era you pick. Kind of like you’ve always said, you watch the beginning, you snooze in the middle, you watch the end and it’s over. But now it’s to me more spec racing than it’s ever been, at least during the C days.

And Schumacher, the cars were sort of different, you know, especially during the Senate days, you had the flat 12 Ferraris and the [01:23:00] V eight Judds and you know, the turbo this and the that. Yeah. So it was a mixed bag of stuff. And then the V 10 era was obviously amazing, but now, I don’t know, it’s just hard.

And I think the whole COVID o’s over for a long time now. People have gone back to, let’s say, quote unquote normal, and Formula One doesn’t have the same draw because we’re not also. Stuck at home with nothing else to watch.

William Ross: I agree. I mean that’s why I say, you know, the shine will come off of that diamond or everyone I call it, it’ll

Crew Chief Eric: be Shinola when it’s done.

William Ross: Yeah. I especially like the Vegas race of Miamis. I’ll be amazed at that Miami Rays last another three or four seasons because it’s just crap. You know, Austin’s always gonna be there ’cause you’re gonna have that one Austin, you know, great tracker like that. But, and in Vegas too, I think it’s just,

Crew Chief Eric: I’d rather watch the WEC race at Austin than the Formula One race at Austin.

William Ross: I, I agree with you on that. A thousand percent. So, yeah, I mean, and the obscene amount of money that either Disney or Apple, whoever ends with is gonna have to pay. I mean, Liberty Media is just cash cashing and it would not surprise me within the next five years, Liberty Media ends up selling up to the oil rich nations of Saudi Arabia.

Yeah. One of those UAE funds, whatever. And just walks away [01:24:00] making their billions and billions of dollars. ’cause it’s at that point, saturation 24 races. I mean, that’s just too many. I mean that’s, and it’s total cash grab

Crew Chief Eric: to close out this thought on Formula One as we sort of wrap out this impromptu bitter sports news.

I gotta give props to Hulk burg. It’s taking him like 25 years to podium.

Executive Producer Tania: You know, I’m sad to miss that race ’cause that actually looked like it was a really good race at Silverstone. I watched the highlights,

William Ross: you know, that’s why they always wish for rain at every race because it’s evens things out. I make everything interesting when it’s rained.

I’ll watch the whole race. I’m be like, okay, this will be interesting. Yeah, for sure. I’ll watch the thing if it rains.

ANNOUNCER!: Mona’s Temple of Speed bowed to vest happen. Baku Streets echoed his dominance once more. September was Red Bull’s resurgence a reminder. That the reigning champion would not surrender easily.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, we don’t often have motorcycle news, but we do have motorcycle news and I think this one would shock you guys. We’re probably not [01:25:00] sad to see him leave Formula One, but all I’m gonna say is that it’s gonna make Moto GP super interesting. Now, the Gunther Steiner is a team principle. Is he of what? Yes.

Yes. And he owns a Moto GP team now or whatever.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s gonna make Ride to Survive season one. Really interesting.

Crew Chief Eric: I didn’t know Gene Haas bought a motorcycle team. God fucking Gene

Executive Producer Tania: Haas. Can

Crew Chief Eric: you imagine? I mean, maybe it’s the right place for Gunther. I don’t know. Good luck to him. Going into next year, he is gonna be at the head of Tech three Racing Moto GP team, full ownership.

Crew Chief Brad: It’ll be back marker team. So in order for him to get the job as team principal, he had to buy the team.

Crew Chief Eric: I mean, if you ate first, your last. Right. Well, on that note, ’cause I know this is big news for you. I wanted the biggest things for you and I thought this is just so important. Here it is. Get ready. Get your Kleenex out. Daniel. Ricardo confirms [01:26:00] retirement for motor racing. This is why I put this first and foremost, retirement for motor racing.

Period. Full stop. There are no disciplines. Just no more. Are you sad? Are you heartbroken?

Crew Chief Brad: I don’t care what

Crew Chief Eric: you’ve always cared about

Crew Chief Brad: Ricardo. I mean, it’s not like he died or anything. He’s just not gonna be racing anymore. He’s still got his brand on

Crew Chief Eric: Chante. What’s that translate too? I’ll pass.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah, I signed up for the newsletter and I kept getting like product information and stuff and it’s all not my style.

Crew Chief Eric: What do you think that says about him? What do you think it says about Alonzo that should be making the same statement?

Crew Chief Brad: And according to you, Hamilton too,

Crew Chief Eric: there’s truth in that statement as well.

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, Daniel’s getting up there in age.

Crew Chief Brad: I don’t think age has anything to do with it though. I think he just lost his passion for it.

Executive Producer Tania: So he lost his passion for all racing then? Yeah. Yes.

Crew Chief Brad: I can relate. I feel like I’ve kinda lost my passion for track driving. Like the last couple times I went and did it. I didn’t really have any fun. I broke the [01:27:00] car, you know, I didn’t really get to go out on track much. I mean, when I say that the pumpkin spice lattes probably not gonna see the track.

It’s probably a fair statement.

Crew Chief Eric: No, it’s gonna see it when you pull up and you park.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s gonna see it when I go to an IMSA race or professional race or something, but it probably won’t touch a track. Maybe parade lapse.

Executive Producer Tania: Before we move on, we need to discuss endurance racing a little bit more. Oh, okay.

Because Franz Herman, AKA Max Tappin, he participated recently in a Berg four hour endurance race in order to qualify for his GT three. License so that he can this weekend participate in a norlife endurance race. And let’s just talk about how he did in that permit race. He was in a Cayman seven 18 GT four car is what he drove.

However, they de-tuned him because of his quote, rookie standing. They de-tuned him 130 horsepower, holy cow. And added weight. He finished in his class seventh, he [01:28:00] finished overall of, I think 114 cars. 27th. Wow. That’s seemingly impressive.

Crew Chief Eric: So if they, they hadn’t basically neutered the car, he would’ve came in first and probably higher up

Executive Producer Tania: the gym.

I’m wondering. So it’ll be very interesting to see how he does. This weekend in a non detuned car, which he’ll be driving a Ferrari this weekend. All the cars that are available in I I racing. I get it.

Crew Chief Brad: That’s a pre, that’s a premonition.

Executive Producer Tania: Which funnily enough, his co-driver is someone who’s coming up through sim racing.

He’s got like a his own league academy thing that he is doing. So his co-driver is gonna be some sim racer dude. So that’ll be interesting to see how that goes. We’ll put a pin in that

Crew Chief Eric: for a minute ‘

Executive Producer Tania: cause

Crew Chief Eric: we’re gonna come back and talk about Max. I don’t wanna talk about every race that’s happened over the last two months ’cause it’s just too much.

I don’t even remember. Right. So I just wanna say Belgium was a nightmare. The race was delayed for over an hour. It was just WW the whole thing was want want. And that was just an annoying race to sit through. [01:29:00] Budapest. What an amazing race between two people. The McLaren’s. Watching their team strategy is mind-boggling.

I don’t understand what’s going on over there. Can we just let Oscar score point so that Max doesn’t, what is this BS between Lando and Oscar? Like it just needs to stop. They’re already gonna win the manufacturer’s championship for crying out loud, like Red Bull doesn’t stand a chance there. At least bunch of other blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Races in between. So let’s fast forward to Azure Bajan Max Power, right? We are going full bore, and I’m reading stuff about how people are saying that Max is now stacking the end part of the season to try to win the remaining races and take the championship away from the McLaren drivers. Full stop. It’s been done before.

And apparently if he wins every race from here on out, the math works out. Do we think it’s gonna happen? What’s the over under on this?

Executive Producer Tania: They’ve sorted that car out, then yes, it’s probably possible.

Crew Chief Brad: I don’t have any [01:30:00] love for any of the F1 teams really. Go Cadillac.

Crew Chief Eric: We’re gonna get to that go Audi. We’ll get to that too.

You know, I’m not a ti fso. My heart breaks for Ferrari and kind of secretly I want McLaren to win. But then I don’t want McLaren to win ’cause I don’t like the BS that they do amongst their own team. I’m kind of like rooting for Mercedes to kind of like come through as the underdog and just take all of it home.

But that’s not gonna happen either. So I can’t put my focus on any one team ’cause they kind all suck. You know what I mean? Stake. Yeah, stake. Yeah. Yeah. Holgenburg is gonna take it all home. Uh, any rate Max for stopping Champion this year? Do you think it’s gonna happen?

Executive Producer Tania: He won every single race but won last year.

He had a 14 second lead, I think 14, 15 seconds He ended at Azure. Bajan? Yeah. And he started slowing down because that gap was bigger and I think he just wasn’t pushing anymore. ’cause there’s no reason George Russell wasn’t catching up

Crew Chief Eric: even after the pit stop. Let’s be real.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah, let’s be real for a second.

And he just, [01:31:00] they told him, you know what, save the motor, save the car. Cruise the last couple laps.

Crew Chief Eric: I mean, you could tell from the videos when they showed you, he is like short shifting and just cruising around and you’re like, wow. And you still can’t catch him.

Executive Producer Tania: So if they’ve sorted out that car and it’s back to levels that it was at last year,

Crew Chief Eric: it’s over for McLarney.

It’s over. Yeah,

Executive Producer Tania: it’s over.

Crew Chief Eric: So this is what’s gonna make the rest of this formula one season exciting because so far it’s been a bit of a dud, but now it’s getting interesting to see how this is gonna play out. And maybe it, it just comes down. I will argue there’s what seven races left. I think we said Tanya, it’s, it’s too many 24 races in the year.

It’s insane. It’s like every two weeks basically, right? I mean it’s just, it’s bonkers, but we’ll see. I think it’s gonna be interesting. But on a side note, speaking of listeners checking in with us, I got a call from Alabama, Jeff, one of our listeners, and he says to me, he goes, obviously you guys know more about this stuff than I do in his southern draw.

He goes, I just got into F1 recently like everyone else. But he goes, wouldn’t [01:32:00] you say stopping is just one of the best drivers hands down. And so I wanted to open that up to go back to what we were talking about with endurance, with this whole math game, him coming out and potentially winning the championship if everything goes in his favor.

Do we think stopping is in a class? Like a Schumacher or a Sena or somebody like that. Is he that level of driver?

Crew Chief Brad: I think it’s hard to answer that question. Is he a great driver? Is he an amazing driver? Yes. The reality is, I think some of it’s the car,

Crew Chief Eric: but you gotta be able to pilot that car and it,

Crew Chief Brad: you gotta be able to pilot the car.

Yes. But because they’re not all driving, it’s hard to make these comparisons ’cause they’re not all driving the exact same car.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, in Red Bull’s case, the rumor on the street is Son’s car is basically specked identical to ver stop’s car as almost like a backup to Ver stop’s car. And it’s reportedly undrivable.

People used to say the same thing about Sena, where Senna’s car was like, I don’t know how the hell he drives this thing. You know what I mean? Is he at that level or is it just he’s got a particular driving style? What [01:33:00] is it? I

COMMERCIAL: mean, it could be,

Executive Producer Tania: I am changing my opinion of him and I think it’ll be very telling what he does in GT three.

Because if he’s dominating there, then he is definitely

Crew Chief Eric: one of the best

Executive Producer Tania: probably. I think he’s matured a lot from the arrogant asshole he was when he first started out in Formula One.

Crew Chief Brad: And he’s a father now, right?

Executive Producer Tania: Technically now he’s a father, yes. But he started maturing even before then. But maybe that’s ’cause he kind of had a step kid in Kelly’s first daughter, Kelly pk.

So maybe he was already changing there. He’s very consistent. He’s a very consistent driver hitting the mark, laugh after lap, after lap, after lap.

Crew Chief Eric: So that I racing

Executive Producer Tania: and maybe it is, I mean, someone else who tends to be that consistent also is Ptri. So I’d really like to see him if it comes down between him and Norris, I’d like to see him win the World Championship for sure, because I think he is probably the stronger driver.

But I mean Vertin, he’s definitely something. [01:34:00] So it’ll be interesting to see

Crew Chief Eric: if he wins this year. And to your point, if he does something in sports car and endurance racing, you know, let’s say he gets a couple other championships of different disciplines under his belt. I think when we jump forward 10 years and look back, we’re gonna go over stop.

And he might not have eight world titles in Formula One like Lewis was trying to get to, or like Schumacher had seven and you know, all that. But I think we’re gonna regard him in the similar level as like a Jimmy Clark or a Sena or some of those, some of the greats where we didn’t recognize it at the time, but now when we look back, we’re gonna be like, holy heck,

Executive Producer Tania: his contract I think goes till 2028.

So if he wins this and he wins the next. Three seasons, he would have eight world championships.

Crew Chief Eric: He would, but he also, to me, he needs to win Lama because a lot of those old time Formula One champions, not Sena, but a lot of, you know, the Andrettis, the whatevers, they went off and did other big races.

Executive Producer Tania: He’s gonna go do other things he wants to do.

He’s all this GT three stuff he’s doing is ’cause he wants to do the 24 hours of the nerve burger ring.

Crew Chief Eric: [01:35:00] Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Once you do that, I’m sure Lamont’s probably isn’t that far behind. Why wouldn’t he?

Crew Chief Eric: 24 hours of Lamont carries more weight, you know, on your resume than 24 hours of the ring does. No offense to the ring.

’cause it’s an awesome thing. Mm-hmm. But in the stratosphere, it’s like the Indy 500 Monaco and Lama or the big three. Right. They’re the triple crown.

Executive Producer Tania: Which is funny because Lamont gets all the attention, but the Nors life is. 10,000 times more difficult. It is, and it’s also 10,000 more times difficult to

Crew Chief Eric: televise.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, and that’s why it doesn’t get the hype it gets, but it’s more impressive. Like if he won first time going to the basically nerve burging Yeah. Kind of deal. And then he like, were to win the 24 hours. Oh my God.

Crew Chief Eric: He wants to go there because the ring is available in I racing and Lama is not. So that’s, that’s why, that’s what it’s all about.

Executive Producer Tania: The other thing about him that I’m liking more is kind of like paying a little bit more attention and learning more about him. Like he really does seem to enjoy all the racing and all the different kinds. Like I watched that one video where he made the negative comment about front wheel drive cars, but like [01:36:00] he was going out test driving the Mustang or all this stuff and he, he got on track in his Mustang for like the first time and, and it starts like raining and I mean, he’s got complete control of this.

Monster, whatever, r blah, blah, blah. Huge beast Mustang thing that he was driving and it’s like he seems like he can maybe get into any car and learn it quickly.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. Like Sena would do. Yeah. The same kind of thing. I don’t know. I’m, I’m hopeful. I, I too am changing my opinion, although secretly like you, I’m sort of rooting for Oscar and then sadly I’m crying into my Cheerios because of Ferrari.

I mean, what a pathetic.

Executive Producer Tania: Ours are terrible.

Crew Chief Eric: They’re so bad. Everybody else is doing two 15 with the DRS open and Ferrari’s like 2 0 4. 2 0 4 maybe. Eh. And then it’s like the DRS opens and then they go backwards 180 miles an hour and it’s like, it’s like it’s awful. What a mess. God. Ferrari. I think they can know how to build a formula car.

We mentioned Audi. We still don’t [01:37:00] know. Well we do know, but I’m like, I’m really disappointed with the driver choice. Like without, that’s gonna be a wash next year.

Executive Producer Tania: Did they say who? The, I don’t remember. Who’s the second driver?

Crew Chief Eric: Holgenburg and I don’t know. Weren’t they gonna bring back Schumacher?

Executive Producer Tania: I don’t think they’d announced the second driver yet.

All we know is it’s Holgenburg. I

Crew Chief Eric: thought they did. And it was some other German or something like that, or whatever. Anyway, it doesn’t matter. My point is we’re gonna go full mullet with Cadillac. We’re bringing back BOTAs. That’s gonna be awesome. BOTAs with the bow tie. Come on. And then Perez, we’re gonna bring back Perez to run with ca.

What do we think about this team up?

Executive Producer Tania: Some people would say like, oh, they should be putting the rookies in, you know, blah blah blah. But like honestly, you have a brand new team. The quickest way to get up to speed is two veteran drivers. And who, other than, I guess Alonzo didn’t wanna move, so

Crew Chief Eric: Strolls paying him too much.

Executive Producer Tania: So he’s, he’s holding on for that Newie, he’s waiting Uhhuh for that car from Newie. Yeah. So he is sticking there. People [01:38:00] poo pooh him BOTAs, but like he did well in Mercedes and maybe you could argue maybe it was the car. I don’t know. He has a decent record and I mean Perez was fine when he was in the Red Bull for the most part.

So there are two veteran seasoned drivers that know what’s going on and they can help bring the Cadillac team to who are all gonna be rookies. They can help build that team out and then eventually they’ll get replaced. But we’ll see how it goes.

Crew Chief Brad: To Tanya’s point, like both of those drivers, even though they didn’t win the championships, they came from championship winning teams.

Yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: yeah, right. Bottas was no slouch when he was at Al Alpha Romeo either. I mean, salur, whatever it was. Right. So just to make sure I got my facts straight, Cadillac powered by Ferrari.

Executive Producer Tania: I think so. At least until they switch

Crew Chief Eric: motors right Beginning. Yeah. Man, how weird is that gonna be?

Crew Chief Brad: They might wanna rethink that.

Crew Chief Eric: Can they bolt a carburetor on it

Executive Producer Tania: so

Crew Chief Brad: it’s it’s gonna be a tester.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, so here’s the thing. A lot of the problems with the Ferrari, [01:39:00] I don’t know if they’re the motor because a lot of things that you can read, they blame. Maybe this sounds silly. Also, it’s not because if they really have a bunch of problems with the braking system, if you’re wasting time early braking and not going in with good entry and then exit speed, you’re never gonna hit the same top.

You just neutered yourself every time you come out of a corner. And then if you’re fighting the car, which allegedly is happening with Hamilton, because these, I don’t know, his style of braking is not compatible with whatever the hell is going on with the Ferrari’s, if this is all true, okay, allegedly then he’s wasting so much time.

He’s constantly trying to counters steer the car because it’s twitchy af through every corner. And it’s like, well how can you be competitive then? You’re inherently always slow. So maybe Cadillac stands a chance if Cadillac’s doing Arrow Cadillac’s doing suspension, break all this stuff, and then they just have the power plant.

Maybe the power plant’s decent and the rest of the car is trash.

Crew Chief Eric: I feel as though Cadillac stands the same chance in its first year. That host does.

Executive Producer Tania: If they’re on the [01:40:00] podium, go on guard. Yeah. Right. Mean, okay, that’s gonna be impressive. Then it’s really gonna be like Ferrari, what the, are you people doing?

Right. ’cause clearly the motor’s fine.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, we’ll just have to wait and see, but I’m excited for the rest of the season. I’m also excited for it to be over.

ANNOUNCER!: Singapore’s night belonged to Russell, America’s wide open planes to vest, apen and Mexico’s altitude to Norris. Three continents, three victors. The pendulum swung wildly and the championship remained unsettled.

Crew Chief Eric: See, I think it’s all about reducing their loss leaders. See, it’s all about the bean counters because they gotta pay for Formula One. I just keep bringing this up. Volkswagen has to figure out how to pay for Audi to go to Formula One next year. So anywhere they can cut the fat, they’re gonna cut it.

Crew Chief Brad: So Volkswagen obviously hasn’t heard the saying, how do you make a small fortune in racing?

Start with a large fortune. They haven’t heard that before because now they’ve got a small fortune and they’re going [01:41:00] racing

Crew Chief Eric: at Dieselgate too, right? So we talked last month about how Volkswagen pulled the plug on the Lambo program in Hypercar, right? For WEC and for Imso. You said yourself, Brad, you were like, I didn’t even know they had a Lambo running in the upper classes in endurance racing.

Fine, fine. Well, we pulled the plug on that. Well, guess what? Surprise, but maybe not a surprise. ’cause I said it from the beginning and people are like, no, you’ll see. It’s gonna be the greatest comeback since the 9 62 and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. This is Porsche’s new halo car and yada yada. The 9 63. The 9 63, the 9 63 is gonna win Lama four years later.

It still hasn’t won anything. Yes. Okay. It got constructor championship or whatever it is in fine. Great. But it didn’t win Lama. It didn’t win anything of significance. So the factory, again, because I think they need to put their money to Formula One is pulling the plug on the Porsche 9 63 hypercar. It is done as of Petite Lama.

That’s [01:42:00] it. That was its final race. Do you think they would’ve continued on with it had it been more successful? I think Porsche’s got this three strike strategy. They either win three times and stop, or they lose three times and stop. I think that’s what it is. But the 9 63 was kind of a loser from the beginning, right?

I mean, you could argue, oh, well balance of power is in the favor of Ferrari, blah, blah, but Ferrari doesn’t compete stateside. They compete at Lama and then they go home, or they do some other big race. They go back to Ello and they ignore everybody for another year. The 9 63 comes over here and competes against Cadillac in Acura or Aston in the Valkyrie or whatever it is, and gets his butt handed to it.

It’s just been hit or miss. And granted, yeah, you got the power of Penske and all these other independent privateers and all this kinda stuff. It hasn’t come together for this car. And so I said after the first year, I’ll be amazed if the 9 63 makes it three years. And here we are at the end of the third year going into the fourth season and they said, no, that’s it.

It’s done. Sad but not sad. I don’t care [01:43:00] about that car. So I think we’re gonna try to start something new here. And it’s Tanya’s goal as a result of last month’s mental gymnastics, trying to figure out Jonathan Price and the Infinity commercials and whoever this British guy is that eats the apple that we still don’t.

It’s like the sin bad movie. We tried, oh, you should have gone through the exercise with us. We were asking like chat GPT and we asked Steve, Izzy, and all these other people, do you know about the British guy eating the apple and the white suit and the commercial, blah blah. I

Executive Producer Tania: know he was somewhere, there’s some sitcom where he’s gonna show up one day, some old TV show where he was in an episode.

Also, one day this mystery will be solved probably on Fraser. Oh. It was he.

Crew Chief Eric: I gotta go back and watch Frazier. I’m just giving her an excuse to watch Frazier at this point. I don’t think you need

Crew Chief Brad: to give her an excuse to watch Frazier. Yeah,

Executive Producer Tania: I mean it’s been like five minutes since I’ve watched the whole thing, so I gotta start again.

Crew Chief Eric: So

Executive Producer Tania: this little

Crew Chief Eric: gem that Tanya found, I think we’re gonna try to do this every month. It’s [01:44:00] fine. Wacky car commercials that maybe have like celebrities in there. Brad, have you seen this one yet?

Crew Chief Brad: I think I saw it when, when Tanya posted it. Yes.

Executive Producer Tania: I would also just like to say that this gem is in the vein of the mystery British guy biting the apple at the end commercial.

And what is this commercial for? God knows

Crew Chief Eric: Canon Pixel jet printers starring Don’t Ansel. It’s like a Japanese commercial only aired in Japan.

COMMERCIAL: Good.

Crew Chief Eric: But the ending is what gets me,

Executive Producer Tania: what is with the strawberry, what I don’t know in his creepy face, what is happening. Yummy.

Crew Chief Brad: That’s a very Japanese thing to do, I think.

Crew Chief Eric: Yes. Did you also notice that his eyebrows are his bushy as his mustache?

Crew Chief Brad: Wonder what else is,

Crew Chief Eric: I mean, I could just watch those last five seconds on repeat where he’s like, Hmm.

Good. Yeah, and eating [01:45:00] the summit, it’s, it’s very creepy, but very satisfying at the same time, like, I have a whole new respect for Nagel mantle as a result of this commercial. This is amazing stuff. Amazing stuff. Hmm. Good.

COMMERCIAL: Right.

Crew Chief Eric: You know, petite’s not the important bit of news. We need to catch up and find out about Franz Herman and how he did at the Berg ring.

He did fantastic.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh yeah. He has a racing team for staffing.com racing and so his co-driver is a stem racer and first Daman did a first and, and he was so far ahead of everybody else. The gap was ridiculous. And when his co-driver came in for his stint, that gap closed down so much that he’s lucky that Max was his teammate or he wouldn’t have, uh, finished in anything.

So Max is gonna Max and he debuts on a norlife and dominates

Crew Chief Eric: because he’s one of the best apparently. So Franz Herman we’re, we’re gonna [01:46:00] watch out for more Franz Herman action. Didn’t he also exit stage? Right? Like he did his stint and then he pieced out. So he left his teammate there to like sort of finish the race and he didn’t care how it ended.

Executive Producer Tania: So it looked like that, but in the end, no. He actually was, I think on the podium with him, but it definitely looked like he might have, he was gonna just leave. That’s awesome. Which is also Max maxing.

Crew Chief Eric: We have what, five, six more races to go? It seems like it’s unending. I mean, we still have Mexico and we’ve got Las Vegas and we got this and we got that.

We got so many races to watch before the end of the season that comes to its crescendo at Yas Marina in Abu Dhabi, which I’m super looking forward to that race ’cause I really do enjoy that track on the Sims. So let’s just talk about Coda,

Executive Producer Tania: shall we?

Crew Chief Eric: The US Grand Prix.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh

Crew Chief Eric: one of three. ’cause we got Miami, we’ve got Texas, and we’ve got Las Vegas.

But Coda’s the most interesting of the three. I don’t know about you, Tanya, but I think the sprint race was more exciting than the actual race.

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, the sprint race was Forza [01:47:00] turn one chaos. Absolute

Crew Chief Eric: chaos. I love the whole Zach Brown blames Huen Berg and then he retracts it and then everybody’s blaming Hulking Berg.

But it’s not Hu Berg’s fault. Is it really Land’s fault or is it Oscar’s fault? Nobody knew whose fault it was, but all I know there was a pile of rubble in that turn. And it was exciting. Which soulful. It’s always strolls. No, no. Stroll had his own moment, which was absolutely hilarious. Who did he wipe out?

Ocon. Yeah. Yeah. And he, he did a hit and run. He tried to drive off. His front wheel is like bouncing, barely connected. And he’s driving as he goes around Ocon, he waves at him like, oh, so sorry. And he tries to drive away. Like, what? Dude, I was dying. It was the funniest thing I’d seen in Formula One all year.

I was like, stroll, what is going on, bro? Wow. Unreal. No, the sprint race was absolutely amazing, but it was good for stopping, right? He took [01:48:00] an extra eight points home, which leans into his first place win. So it’s 25 points for the win. Yep. So now he’s got 31 extra points towards the championship. And I, I turned to Tanya and I said, is he going to make the ultimate comeback in Formula one?

’cause nobody’s ever done this before. Even in the, the modern times and the old times. The Senate days Schumacher before. Nobody’s done over a hundred point swing to come back and win the championship, but I think he can pull it off. He can’t do it alone, though.

Executive Producer Tania: There is a chance mathematically he can do this as long as the Oscar screws up

Crew Chief Eric: and he wins everything, including the sprint

Executive Producer Tania: races, it Max wins everything.

So just running some simple scenarios. If he wins the last two remaining sprint races and the last five races, Oscar can come in second every time except one time. And Max will win. But if Oscar comes in second every time in the races and the sprint races and Max comes in first, [01:49:00] there’s a three point difference.

Crew Chief Eric: You know what I’m gonna tell you that’s gonna make sure that Oscar doesn’t achieve that. Okay. It’s two things. Roll. The first one is Lando and the second one is Norris. Okay? Lando is not gonna let it happen, right? He’s either gonna take him out or he is gonna call up Big Papa Papaya, Zach Brown. He is gonna say, team orders.

You need to put Oscar behind me because I’m the primary driver this week. Remember, that’s what’s gonna happen.

Executive Producer Tania: Mathematically. Max wins the next five races and the next two Sprint races. Even if Lando comes in second, in all those races, he cannot beat Max.

Crew Chief Eric: Oscar can’t beat Max.

Executive Producer Tania: Lando can’t beat Max. That’s

Crew Chief Eric: what I’m saying.

Burins got it in the bag because McLaren’s gonna take themselves out

Executive Producer Tania: if that happens. If they are not podium or they take each other out completely. And if Max can win, every is done. He’s, he is a five time champion

Crew Chief Eric: telling you it’s gonna happen. The crystal ball, it’s gonna happen. It’s gonna happen.

We’re not gonna see the stupidity [01:50:00] that we saw earlier this year where Max is taking people out and coming in like 13th and like whatever he was doing in the middle of the year. Well, he

Crew Chief Brad: was doing that for Christian Horner.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, yeah. Yeah. Right. But I’m also wondering if some of that was like, to get to this point, right?

Like, all right Max, you gotta throw these races away

Executive Producer Tania: because then No, no, no. Max max. In the little that he lets you know about himself. ’cause he is a very private person and although he is having his own documentary coming out, I forget on what service

Crew Chief Eric: would be as exciting as that Scott Dixon thing

Executive Producer Tania: we

Crew Chief Eric: reviewed.

Executive Producer Tania: Yes. Because he’s that kind of person. But to my point, he is not the kind of person he would give a big middle finger to you. If someone came to him and said throw a race. He is never going to do that. He is always going to want to win. Just like how can he race at Nors life in the middle of his F1 season?

How can he go do GT three racing and all this other stuff? Has any other driver ever gone and done another series? Usually it’s like, oh my god, you can’t even go fart in the corner. ’cause God forbid you get injured and [01:51:00] you can’t race. Right. And yet he’s out here doing whatever the f he wants because he can and he will and he doesn’t care.

So there’s, I no way. I believe that he was throwing anything, his car was crap and he dealt with it the best way he could.

Crew Chief Brad: Eric just wrote the next script for Drive to Survive that he’s not gonna watch.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m never gonna

Crew Chief Brad: watch. I think also like Max didn’t start racing in in GT three, you know, sport car racing until Christian Horner left.

Am I correct in saying that

Crew Chief Eric: it all happened last time? I don’t know. I thought

Crew Chief Brad: he was doing a ton of sim racing, but he never actually competed in a real world. I thought he did

Crew Chief Eric: that test with the Acura like last year and some other stuff. Well, was it an actual official race? The Franz Herman is new for this year.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, even the sim racing, he’s been told not to do it, and he’s basically said. F you because he’ll do sim racing where he is racing all through the night, right. Especially like these endurance sim racings. And then the next day, you know, he is getting a couple hours of sleep next day getting the Formula one car to race.

And basically his answer was, I just won the race. What’s the problem? Yeah.

Crew Chief Brad: And, and I think that is a [01:52:00] valid answer,

Executive Producer Tania: touche, like yeah,

Crew Chief Brad: where’s my number two?

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah. I stayed up all night playing my sim racing, but I just came out here qualified on pole and then won the race. So

Crew Chief Eric: because he downs like a six pack of Red Bull, I mean, come on, it’s gotta be in his veins.

He’s racing with rich energy. Oh man. That’s the secret formula right there. I didn’t realize until I was going through all this stuff with the clubhouse and going through the vault and the pictures. When we went to Coda in 2018, spend a minute pre COVID, max was already running at Red Bull. I mean he’s been in Formula One for quite a long time.

To, to your point, Tanya, he doesn’t care anymore. He was

Executive Producer Tania: basically one of the youngest people. He was like 17 or something. He was like controversial too of him getting his license. Like at the age that he did.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m telling you he’s gonna be up there. People are gonna be talking about him like Schumacher and Fangio and Senna.

He’s gonna be the next one. Crystal Ball says so. Well, since you brought up sim racing this weekend, EA Sports gave F1 2025 a way for free through [01:53:00] Steam from Friday night through Monday afternoon and we got our hands on it. What do we think? What do we think about the Formula One simulator? It was a lot better than I was expecting it

Executive Producer Tania: to be ’cause I still remember, I haven’t played a Formula One race game since, I don’t know, formula one, 2002 or something.

I don’t know, like 1998,

Crew Chief Brad: the last time it was free

Executive Producer Tania: and it was horrible. They were like unplayable as soon as you’d try to accelerate, you know, spin like a top. And it’s like every time you try to accelerate out of a corner, they’re sideways and spinning and they were unbearable, but I was expecting something similar to this and instead it was not at all like that.

And it felt very smooth. And I mean you could tell it was different than like a Forza or you know, some other, if you wanna call it sim, some other racing game, if you will. But I was pleased with it,

Crew Chief Eric: man. You played a lot newer Formula One game than I did. The last Formula One game I played was the Nigel Mantle World Championship on Super Nintendo.

That’s like a step above pole position.

Executive Producer Tania: No, I’m sorry. It was the, the last [01:54:00] formula one game I played was the Tiger Handheld. Oh man, you’re going way back.

SFX: And that was the

Crew Chief Eric: only sound effect. Yeah, no, to your point, I tried it out too, and I liked it. Now the question is, do I wanna spend the 80 or a hundred dollars or whatever it costs? Yeah, that’s the problem, the buy in. And the problem is here we are at the tail end of the formula one season and EAs like, oh, we’ll give it to you for free because 2026 is coming out.

And unlike EAs, other products where like WRC, they just keep adding to it. All you had to do was buy it in 2023, and they’ve continued to just add on to it and add onto it. And add onto it. Formula One is like Madden, it was like, oh, Madden 22 and 23, and 24 and 25. So they’re following that model and that’s what sucks.

It’s like, well. I’m gonna pay full price or maybe the discounted price because of this promotional weekend, but it’s like the new ones around the corner again, do you wait for 2026 to come out, [01:55:00] but you’re gonna pay a hundred bucks or do you buy 2025 and look at Dohan, you know, and other drivers that aren’t in the field anymore, you know, on the 2025 roster.

I don’t know.

Crew Chief Brad: My problem with those games is like how much improvement is actually made other than the roster changes, how much do they improve the game itself, the gameplay, the graphics and everything year over year? Like

Crew Chief Eric: you probably played Madden or NBA back in the day, so you know, a lot of the times it was like re-skinning new boxing.

Crew Chief Brad: It never really felt any different

Crew Chief Eric: and every so many years they would change the mechanics or they would change the ui or technology would advance and it would force them to change and they couldn’t just kind of lather, rinse, repeat. And I think the same is a Formula One. It’s like, okay, well we use the ego engine and it’s tuned for Formula One and blah, blah, blah.

And so none of that stuff really changes because if you think about it, the way the cars are shaped don’t mean a hill of beans in the digital world because there’s no airflow. So the cars run at a prescribed speed and all those kinds of things. To [01:56:00] your point, I think there’s a little bit more of that regurgitation going on in the formula one side than there would be maybe in any other game or franchise, you know?

COMMERCIAL: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: You know what’s kind of hard to get into with the Formula One game, which I found a little bit of a struggle as I sat there, you know, playing it is I enjoyed going to Coda. Because I know Coda from literal firsthand experience. And then you look at the rest of the roster and you’re like, oh, well I don’t know any of these tracks.

Like other than a Yeah, spa. No spa. ’cause you’ve played spa on other racing games. But then it’s like Miami, what a trash heap. That’s a terrible track. Horrible, terrible course, right? Like at least you know, you go to something like Forza or whatever and it’s like Watkins Glen and VIR and you have these other tracks that maybe a little bit more familiar, which makes it fun as well, right?

Because there’s a little bit of attachment there. I don’t know. Go into some of the tracks that are in the Formula One rock. It’s like this track sucks. Like I don’t even like

Crew Chief Eric: watching

Executive Producer Tania: it, let alone

Crew Chief Eric: playing it. Fictitiously [01:57:00] definitely got a bunch of those on my list too. So those are all in the negative column in the con column of why I don’t wanna spend the $80 on, you know, the next title of Formula one.

I’d rather have something with a little bit more diversity,

ANNOUNCER!: right? Brazil Crowned Norris again, but Las Vegas under the Neon Lights delivered chaos. Affan won yet. McLaren’s double disqualification sent shockwaves through the standings. November was not just a twist, it was the season’s gamble.

Crew Chief Eric: Shall we talk a little bit?

Formula one? Definitely. Why? You’re wearing that hat a thousand percent right? The only thing that we need to talk about is Brazil. Who saw the Sao Paulo race? Highlights?

William Ross: Yeah. How the hell everyone’s saying, oh God, forta it coming from last to third. Something’s fishy about that.

Executive Producer Tania: He did it before in the rain, 17th to first.

So had he not had the stupid That’s true. What? Lap two tire change.

Max Kaiserman: Yeah. Wait, he got stuck in a pit and got down to 17th?

Executive Producer Tania: No, he started in [01:58:00] pit because he changed the engine overnight and a bunch of other modifications and he failed out of qualifying for the first time like ever in Q1?

COMMERCIAL: Yeah, I saw that.

So he

Executive Producer Tania: started at a pit and then like literally like a handful of laps in, got a puncture and had to go pit in and change tires. But still managed to finish the race in third. It was unreal breathing down the neck of Antonelli in second place. If there was like one more lap, he would’ve Oh yeah. He would’ve had ’em in second place.

Max Kaiserman: Something with max stopping and we share the same first name. So I appreciate him quite a bit. The uh, the, the other shoe’s gonna drop on him one day. I just have a feeling it’s gonna be like Lance Armstrong and they’re gonna say, oh my God, this guy has like, well it is probably not drugs or anything like that, but it’s like they’re gonna analyze his brain and realize he fucking sees in slow motion or something, you know, so he can react faster.

I mean we’ve all seen it like he’s made passes that shouldn’t be possible on tracks and stuff. This guy is just a monster and now he’s doing it in computer games and stuff. He’s like a computer gamer and he’s a monster at [01:59:00] that too. I don’t know if that necessarily always translates, you know, real driving to computer driving.

William Ross: Yeah, well as hell, he is running at the Berg ring. He is got his, with that GT three team, whatever. Yeah, that’s how these last few races I think are gonna be interesting ’cause especially Vegas being the street race and then the last two. So, you know, a lot of stuff can happen in regards to that. I mean, the points, I mean, he is not that far off.

I mean, I think all it takes is for Orlando to crash and not finish one race. He’s not racing in

Max Kaiserman: Lamont 26, is he? No. When is that gonna happen? When is he going over to supercar?

Executive Producer Tania: Everything he is been doing now is to do the Nors life. Endurances. Right? Yeah. Basically.

Max Kaiserman: Does he not have sponsorship to get to Lamont or is he uh.

Executive Producer Tania: I’m sure he does, but I wonder if there’s some sort of F1 contractual Yeah.

William Ross: Block. Yeah, I had that same thought. But if there was then how could they wouldn’t have let him run the Berg ring.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah.

William Ross: For the GT three. So, but I mean, who knows though? ’cause those contracts are insane in regards to you can do this, you can’t do that, does that, and

Executive Producer Tania: I have a feeling his contract must say middle [02:00:00] finger, I’m gonna do what I want and if you don’t like it, I’m gonna go to another team who let me do what I want.

William Ross: Yeah, exactly. I wouldn’t doubt it. You’re break, correct? Yeah. Red Bull’s not gonna let it

Max Kaiserman: go. No. There was the Canadian Grand Prix is what kicked him out of Lamont for some reason this year.

William Ross: Yeah, ’cause they always have conflict on the calendar. Correct. ’cause of the same weekend.

Max Kaiserman: Same weekend.

William Ross: Well now here’s a big thing too, is now they effed up Memorial Day weekend in regards to moving Monaco to two weeks before now.

And so there’s only gonna be the two instead. That was always a great day. You wake up and watch the F1 Monaco and the Indy 500 and you got the CocaCola 600, you know, and now it’s screwed up.

Crew Chief Eric: So Sal Paulo, just for a second to go back. There was a moment though, and the radio call was awesome. So Max makes it from worst to first.

He’s in. First place in the pit cycles and all this kind of thing, but he’s on a harder compound tire and they tell a max, I didn’t think I was gonna be able to tell you this, but you are currently in first place. And he goes, that’s not bad. Right? [02:01:00] And then he just keeps driving. But like two or three laps later, they pitted him to put him on soft, which I thought was stupid.

They should have just left him on. He would’ve been fine on the mediums for the rest of the, and he actually would’ve won the race. But I think that pit stop actually caused him to throw that race away, which I think was dumb. I think he could have done it. He had enough lead on Lando that he could have just achieved a miracle.

Basically. Nobody, they said nobody has ever been able to do this in the history of Formula One, which was come basically from last place from the pit and win a race. I mean, he already achieved the fact that he podium, but to win would’ve been incredible. I think they should have left him out there. So that was a mistake on Red Bull’s strategy.

But I will say the rest of the race, I thought MLO was exciting this year and there was a couple others that were like, Ooh, this is good. You know, this race was the best race of the year. It had everything just shenanigans Rex, like all this stuff was going. I was like, this is why you watch Formula One.

Like it’s, it’s sort of like they took ’em all off the leash and let ’em do whatever they wanted to do and it was amazing. Right. [02:02:00] The one thing I noticed, the last couple of races, correct me if I’m wrong, did Lando get a talking to, or is it team orders? Like what’s going on at McLaren because there’s no more Oscar Lando?

Executive Producer Tania: Well, they’re not even bracing against each other. Oscar’s. I don’t know what’s happened to him. He is fallen off the podium. Exactly.

Crew Chief Eric: And suddenly Lando every race. He’s like a machine super consistent. The fastest car head by 20 seconds. And I’m like, what gives, where was the, where’d this come from?

Crew Chief Brad: Swapped cars?

Yeah,

William Ross: yeah, yeah. He’s

Crew Chief Eric: driving Oscar’s car. That’s what it is. Yeah.

William Ross: Well the Australians are having a heyday in regard to conspiracies, in regards to all that stuff and Oh

Crew Chief Eric: really?

William Ross: Oh God. Yeah. Well, they’re saying, you know, why they’re favoring Lando? ’cause they want a British driver to win and a British team, blah, blah, blah.

That kinda stuff. And you know, Orlando’s been there forever. So all the Australians are saying there’s, they’re favoring him and sabotaging Oscar. I mean, you know, that’s not true. Do we? I know Lando kind of had his midseason maybe. Maybe. You know, Lando had his little personal pep talk where he quit drinking all his stuff and says I gotta do [02:03:00] this, this, and this.

So I mean, he really narrowed his focus back to how it should be all season. A few, um, races back. So, I mean, I don’t know, maybe that played a role, but I mean, he’s got his shit back together, that’s for sure. The kid can drive, that’s for sure. But he, he doesn’t have that. He can’t drive like Max? No, he doesn’t have that bitten his teeth where it’s just, it’s all or nothing.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah.

Max Kaiserman: Did it start raining or something? Why did they switch his tires?

Crew Chief Eric: No, it was weird because that track’s not that long. It’s two and a half miles. Everybody pitted like three times, like other races. Like we’re gonna go to plan a one stop strategy, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, we’re gonna stretch out the medium tires for 56 laps kind of garbage.

And then this time they pitted like every 10 minutes. D absolutely nutty. The

Executive Producer Tania: dg,

Crew Chief Eric: it’s the D, it’s the, yeah, the tire. They were talking about how like sound Paolo is built on a part of the earth that it’s constantly moving so the track is never the same. And like all this like, it sounded like Bill N, the science guy all the time.

And I was like, what are we, this has gotta be bs. Like somebody called MythBusters. ’cause there’s no way this is true.

Max Kaiserman: [02:04:00] Michelin was the sponsor. They wanted more tires going,

Crew Chief Eric: oh, that reminds me of that indie race where like four cars started because everybody was protesting Bridgestone or whatever it was that year.

It was terrible. Yeah. That was

William Ross: horrendous. That’s what killed that race at Indy.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. That it really was. Well, big factor in it. Yeah. Yeah. Well then Ralph Schumacher hit the wall. Right. That wasn’t really good either for, you know. No, that

William Ross: was, yeah, that was bad. You know, hindsight’s 2020, but you know, so where it got to now, back then, I mean, I don’t wanna say a blessing, but No, Austin’s been fantastic.

Vegas and Miami are gonna go by the wayside in another five years, but Austin’s not gonna go anywhere.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s dedicated track. They gotta pay for that thing.

William Ross: Yeah, I mean, I think they just signed an extension of 2036 or something for that too. Oh my goodness.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, I look forward to seeing how the Formula one season closes after the last race of the year, which is Yas Marina.

Looking forward to that too. I like that track on all the simulators. We’ll see how it all came together, and whether or not I stick with Formula One next year, I will have [02:05:00] achieved my challenge, though. I’ve seen all the races this year. You can’t say that I didn’t watch ’em.

ANNOUNCER!: Qatar’s Desert Heat, Abu Dhabi’s Fading Sunset.

The final battles decided the Crown, and as the fireworks lit, the Yas Marina Sky, the 2025 season closed its book a year of rivalries, redemption, and relentless speed etched forever into Formula One history.

Crew Chief Eric: Ah, so we have made it to the crescendo of the formula one season.

Crew Chief Brad: Crescendo or climax.

Crew Chief Eric: You know, that’s dealer’s choice on that one. Sorta like Las Vegas was dealer’s choice, but we’re gonna leave that where it is. We have suffered through, well, sorry. I’m sorry. Is that, is that the wrong adjective Suffered through I?

We have made it through 24 races this year, and we now have crowned a new Formula One champion.

Crew Chief Brad: Congratulations, land stroll. Congratulations. Land stroll. [02:06:00]

Crew Chief Eric: Before we get into he said, she said, were they right? Were they wrong? What do we think about our new crowned Prince of Formula one?

Crew Chief Brad: I think the silence speaks volumes.

Crew Chief Eric: Tanya’s face alone. I wanna discuss something really, really important about the race at Yas Marina. The move on Synoda by Lando.

Executive Producer Tania: Somehow that’s legal, even though he was four wheels outside the white line.

Crew Chief Brad: Right. But Synoda, I think the stewards rationale was Synoda made the extra moves and forced him to basically do that.

So it was soon Sonoda was at fault.

Executive Producer Tania: They called it aggressive weaving, but he didn’t move. I’ve seen there’s been people that have moved way more freaking aggressively than Sonoda did.

Crew Chief Brad: Like Lando at the start of the previous race when he almost took out Max when they left the line.

Crew Chief Eric: To me it was a repeat of the shortsighted tactic that he took in Canada against [02:07:00] Oscar.

When he put it in the wall, it was the same move. But what I thought was interesting about the whole Yas Marina debacle outside of the fact that they penalized Sonota and then let Lando go, was just before that Red Bull gets on the radio with Sonota. And was like, it is now time for the nuclear option or whatever they said to him.

And Sonota goes, sweep the leg. Yeah, pretty much. Right? And he’s like, I know exactly what I need to do. And we are sitting there just rubbing our hands. We’re like, this is the moment we’ve been waiting for because soda’s signature move is to put a front wheel in a side pod and you end up somewhere in a different racetrack and he continues driving and he’s like, oh, I didn’t see you there driving my line, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

It didn’t ha I was, I was so beside myself like I think it was the biggest f you to Red Bull because he did know what he needed to do. Everybody knew what he was going to do. They were waiting for it. And he [02:08:00] said, uh, and he sort of like half-assed it. But unfortunately Lando did this other, we’ll call it the Canada maneuver and it was all bullshit.

It was terrible. That was the moment. Had the FIA done what they should have done, which was penalize. Lando should have penalize both of ’em. Probably. Yes, both. I don’t care. The sono, it didn’t matter if they penalize Sonota

Executive Producer Tania: when they did penalize sonota, but what does it matter?

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. It’s like who He’s going to IndyCar, who cares?

But if they had penalized Lando, max would’ve won. Ah, it’s so close, so close. So close. That is a moment in F1 history that I think will just live in infamy as like the deciding moment that made Lando the champion. Somebody got fired for that.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah. Synoda.

Crew Chief Eric: Get outta my head. Max lost by what? Two points after everything was said and [02:09:00] done. Correct. He was so close. Which race? Could have been the race had everything else played out the same way, would’ve made the biggest difference for Max.

Executive Producer Tania: They say it’s the race where he crashed

Crew Chief Eric: into Russell. You know what’s funny about this whole Lando now the Formula One champion, everything on social media has come to like a grinding halt.

There really wasn’t anything like after every Formula One race, it’s like my phone explodes, you know? And there’s the typical Connor and all those guys doing their thing and their impressions, but that it all died off really quick. There has been nothing. It’s been quiet. Shouldn’t there be some Lando memes or, or something like some goodness out there?

Nothing. What would the meme be?

Crew Chief Brad: We’re all depressed.

Crew Chief Eric: I think you’re right.

Crew Chief Brad: The only people that wanted Lando to win was Lando.

Crew Chief Eric: Pretty much his,

Crew Chief Brad: his own team didn’t even want ’em to win. They were

Crew Chief Eric: papaya rules. Papaya rules, which are totally lame. Nevermind again, I told you guys, I don’t like the way they [02:10:00] handle themselves on that team.

I just, I don’t get it. I don’t understand what they’re trying to do good on them. I mean, we predicted that they were gonna win the Constructors Championship and they did. I mean, that was many, many races ago. Collusion aside, it was a hell of a season finale though, whether it was staged for television or otherwise.

I mean, it literally came down to the wire. It came down to like the last pit stop, and there was a moment there where I thought Max was gonna take it. I mean, it really did. Does it light a fire under his butt for next year, or,

Executive Producer Tania: I mean, of course he’s not gonna sit back and be like, oh, I’ll just lose.

Crew Chief Brad: I feel like he’s gonna be championing a new co-driver.

Executive Producer Tania: Well, here’s the problem. They’re already setting us up

Crew Chief Brad: for

Executive Producer Tania: Max not to win because you know, McLaren stopped developing their car mid-season so they could focus on development of the 2026 car. But Red Bull really kept focusing on developing the car this season for the end, and that’s why he was doing so much [02:11:00] better.

So really now they’re on the back foot for 2026 plus they’re gonna have the new engine so they don’t stand any chance. Blah, blah, freaking blah. Isaac got moved into the Red Bull seat, so we shall see if the second seat curse continues and if he will suck a butt or be able to be halfway decent.

Crew Chief Eric: I saw some videos where Haja was outspoken about how he does not like Max and they do not get along, so that’s gonna be really, really interesting.

Crew Chief Brad: When was the last time Red Bull didn’t stand a chance?

Crew Chief Eric: Right.

Crew Chief Brad: They stood a chance this year against McLaren. They stood a chance pretty much every year in the Mercedes years. I mean, yeah, there. There were some times where the Mercedes were just clearly like a lot faster, but Red Bull was always right behind them.

Since I’ve started watching, which is relatively recently, I can’t think of a year where Red Bull was not in the hunt.

Crew Chief Eric: With all the changes happening at Red Bull. New management, new designer, [02:12:00] new engine, new car, new co-driver, new everything, right, new. If they end up doing better than Aston, what does that say about the magical powers of the wizard, Adrian Newey?

Well, we won’t know till next year.

Crew Chief Brad: I think what that says is one man does not make a championship F1 team.

Crew Chief Eric: Ain’t that the truth? It is an army to put these cars out there. We argued many times about the inferior Mercedes. I think Mercedes put a pretty good show up this year, especially considering surprise of the season rookie Kimmy Antonelli.

That kid can drive, especially when he crashes into other people.

Crew Chief Brad: He can drive. He just can’t see.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, you know there’s other Crashy people out

Executive Producer Tania: there like Lance. I don’t think Lance crashed anybody this season. You remember the sprint race? Dakota? He definitely

Crew Chief Eric: crashed people. No, that

Executive Producer Tania: wasn’t him.

Crew Chief Eric: I thought that was Holgenburg.

No, when he ended up plowing into and then he waved at the guy. Remember that? Mm.

Crew Chief Brad: Wasn’t it signs? Didn’t he run into signs, I

Crew Chief Eric: thought, yes, yes, yes.

Crew Chief Brad: So he had [02:13:00] one

Executive Producer Tania: crash the whole season.

Crew Chief Brad: I think that’s a non-zero number one, one crash involving another car.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: That’s basically no crashes for him.

Crew Chief Brad: You need to take himself out.

Crew Chief Eric: I am very hopeful for Kimmy Antonelli going into next season. I think he’s got some real promise looking at what he’s been capable of doing this year with quote unquote the inferior Mercedes and he’s a rookie not knowing half of the tracks.

Crew Chief Brad: Are we making predictions for next year already?

Crew Chief Eric: Not yet. Not yet.

Crew Chief Brad: Not yet. Okay. I, I, because I, I’ve got mine.

Crew Chief Eric: We’re still talking about this year’s stuff. I still think quote of the season is David Tard mid-season talking about the fact that they still let pensioners out on the track. I am determined that Alonzo needs to retire. Nope. 42 is the new 75. Like what is, guess who finished

Executive Producer Tania: in 10th place?

Crew Chief Eric: Alonzo Boo. That’s like first place in FP two. He’s gonna

Crew Chief Brad: have an Adrian Newey car next year

Crew Chief Eric: with a Honda Engine. So they’re gonna get all the old Red Bull [02:14:00] motors. They’re gonna get the Red Bull designer. And when does Christian Horner show up?

Crew Chief Brad: Well, he’s too busy trying Tom on the, the lady mechanics and stuff.

Yeah, that’s his work. No, I think the quote of the year was, I think there’s some water in the car in the, in the team. Yeah. It must be the water.

Crew Chief Eric: You know, the only thing entertaining about Russell though is his constant complaining.

Crew Chief Brad: I think that’s why I don’t like him

Crew Chief Eric: paddle

Executive Producer Tania: tailing, petal. They all do it child, but

Crew Chief Eric: yeah, they do.

He’s the winer one though. Exactly. So you kind of love it because you wanna hear it and they play it over the air because it adds something to the extremely boring races. And you know, I’ve wondered about, we’ve talked about this while we watched the races. Are those clips from the drivers actually in real time?

Or they just sort of grabbing stuff and throwing it in when they feel like it to spice up the race? You know?

SFX: Yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: his stuff does add a little bit of just comic relief to some very boring races sometimes.

Executive Producer Tania: I think the best one [02:15:00] was, and I think it was. Last season, not this past season. He was agitated ’cause it was raining.

It was raining. He’s like, guys it’s raining. And then he was like, oh wait a second, it’s my sweat. Like you couldn’t tell it was on the inside of your visor. No, we need to close that. The outside big

Crew Chief Eric: eyelashes. It’s like windshield wipers. He was

Executive Producer Tania: splashing it up. You’re right. I hadn’t thought about that.

Crew Chief Eric: I like that.

One time the Red Bull messed up the pit strategy and they put Max on those hard tires and he comes with a radio and he’s like, what are these tires like? He had no clue what they had put on the car and it was like absolutely horrendous. It was so, so bad.

Crew Chief Brad: Maybe that was the race that decided it.

Crew Chief Eric: So rounding out 2025 I think another surprise of the season, Ollie Beerman.

We gotta keep eyes on Ollie Beerman. Those last couple races. Especially in the ha Holy smokes. Dude was flying. Like obviously [02:16:00] they did some redesigns and things like that late season, but still he’s a kid that can drive. I think we need to keep eyes on Ollie Biman going forward. So thanks to wrap out 2025.

Tanya, did you watch the Formula One movie? No. Oh dang. So we’re gonna have to carry that into next year. Then we’re gonna keep pestering you about the movie until you watch it.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s gonna become the Mad Damon Jimmy Kimmel joke

Executive Producer Tania: once I get my Apple TV subscription, because you have to watch Formula One next year on Apple tv.

I guess then I can watch the Apple movie because it doesn’t stream anywhere, including on airplanes. So there you have it.

Crew Chief Brad: I think I saw it on Prime, not for free. Yes, I, I forgot. There’s a caveat there.

Executive Producer Tania: You pay for Prime to then pay more to watch the stop on Prime. No, thank you.

Crew Chief Eric: That being said. There are rumors of them making another Formula One movie.

Guess who’s gonna be in it? Have you heard about this?

Crew Chief Brad: Zel, Washington? Wait,

Executive Producer Tania: wait. I know. So we had Brad Pit, the first one, [02:17:00] then Brad Pit will be back in the second one. We’ll add George Clooney and then we’ll add Matt Damon and then we’ll add

Crew Chief Brad: Ocean’s Formula One.

It’ll be a casino heist at the Las Vegas Grand Prix. You’re close.

Executive Producer Tania: There is going to be an Oceans. Something coming out.

Crew Chief Eric: 17. Yeah. Oceans F1. There you go. It’s perfect. You’re close. You wanna take another stab at who they could possibly get? Uh, I’ll give you a hint who has recently retired from a long running movie franchise.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh my God. Been diesel. Paul Walker.

Crew Chief Eric: He said, Linda, you let rest in

Executive Producer Tania: peace. He said, Tom Cruise. I said, Tom

Crew Chief Eric: Cruise. Yes, Tom Cruise. They are talking about bringing in Tom Cruise for the second Formula one movie. Of course they will. Bullshit.

Executive Producer Tania: We need

Crew Chief Brad: whole trickle making a comeback. We

Crew Chief Eric: need piece of thunder part two.

If they remade Days of Thunder now, what would that be like?

Crew Chief Brad: We’re getting [02:18:00] days of DRS instead. I thought

Executive Producer Tania: the drive to survive. No, they can’t remake Days of

Crew Chief Brad: Thunder. They’d have to continue it. Yeah, they’d have to continue it. They didn’t remake Top Gun. They continued

Executive Producer Tania: it. We digress from Formula One. It’s Days of Thunder never come out.

When it did and it came out today, that’d be some boring ass shit.

Crew Chief Eric: Would be pretty terrible. It would be terrible. It would be bad.

Executive Producer Tania: Like there would be, what would be the drama be? It’d be like fisticuffs. I mean, I guess there were fisticuffs and Days of Thunder too, but I don’t know. I don’t think

Crew Chief Eric: it would hit as well. Come on down here and get yourself some ice cream.

Executive Producer Tania: That is the best quote. Eric’s

Crew Chief Brad: favorite quote from any movie ever. Ice cream. Ice cream.

Executive Producer Tania: When they went to the hospital, weren’t they like drag racing each other in Le Barons or something?

Crew Chief Brad: They were rental cars. Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Were they Le Barons or what were they?

Crew Chief Brad: No, I think one was a Was Illumina. Illumina, because that’s what they raced back.

Crew Chief Eric: They were the street versions of [02:19:00] whatever the NASCAR cars were.

Crew Chief Brad: I think it was Illumina and a Taurus,

Crew Chief Eric: and they were

Executive Producer Tania: hot garbage, but it worked. Can you imagine, what would they do today? A Camry

Crew Chief Eric: and a Camry.

Executive Producer Tania: Camry and a Camaro. I guess

Crew Chief Eric: a Impala. So looking back over the year, it was an exciting year. I mean, I’m glad you guys, I’m gonna say, forced me into watching the season and giving up rally, and I didn’t watch anything else.

That sounds like a personal choice. I watched Rolex and I watched 24 hours of Lama, but Formula One for me still isn’t what it used to be. There’s a lot of things I could do without, but unfortunately I feel like I have to commit to another year. Yeah, of course.

Crew Chief Brad: Commit to the bit

Crew Chief Eric: with all these changes that are coming and the new teams and the new regs and the new cars and new old drivers.

Yeah, I think that leads us to a bit of an issue with the way we’ve been handling Formula One as part of break fix and the drive through and everything else. So here’s an [02:20:00] idea. If we’re gonna commit to another year Formula One and really digging into it, why don’t we spin off a subseries of the drive through.

I got this like idea just scratching away at my brain. I’m thinking formula fanatics and all we do is talk about Formula One and if you don’t like it, you can skip over it and you don’t have to listen to us on the drive through, talk about it. We can actually focus on real news and not our own version of Drive to Survive.

What do you think?

Executive Producer Tania: Like a short, 30 minute segment, what do we do for the other 24 minutes?

Crew Chief Brad: Revisit our predictions each race and see how close we are.

Crew Chief Eric: We get to talk about the races, the results, what happened, the drama, all of it. It’s gonna be awesome.

Crew Chief Brad: And at to Tonya’s point, what do you do with the other 26 minutes?

Executive Producer Tania: A lovely idea. I think people will enjoy that. Brad, are you in? Are you committing?

Crew Chief Brad: I am in with the caveat that we do not call it formula fanatics because I think that name is just [02:21:00] atrocious.

Crew Chief Eric: Well then that’s the name we’re going with.

Crew Chief Brad: Great. I’ll make sure I am not prepared for any of those episodes.

Crew Chief Eric: And so as the echoes of the 2025 season fade, we’re left with more than just statistics and standings we’re left with memories. The roar of Melbourne, the glitter of Monaco, the heartbreak of Vegas, and the sunset of Abu Dhabi a year where legends were challenged, rookies rose, and the balance of power shifted with every turn of the wheel.

Formula one is never just about who wins. It’s about the relentless pursuit, the rivalries that define an era, and the stories that remind us of why we watch the 2025 season gave us all of that. And more so as the engines fall silent and the paddock empties, one truth remains. The [02:22:00] chase never ends because in Formula One, tomorrow is always waiting just beyond the next corner.

Executive Producer Tania: The drive through is our monthly news episode and is sponsored in part by organizations like Collector Car guide.net Project, motoring Garage Style Magazine, the Exotic Car Marketplace, and many others. If you’re interested in becoming a sponsor of the drive-through, look no further than www.motoringpodcast.net, click about and then advertising.

Thank you again to everyone that supports the Motoring Podcast Network, grand Touring Motorsports, our podcast Break Fix, and all the other services we provide.

Retrospective

III. The Red Bull Reawakening

For the first half of the season, Max Verstappen looked mortal.

The RB21 was twitchy. The balance was off. The team was distracted by internal politics and the fallout of Christian Horner’s departure. Verstappen crashed, collided, complained — and yet, even in the chaos, the raw speed was unmistakable.

Then came the turning point.

Red Bull stopped developing the 2026 car. They threw everything at the present. And the RB21 transformed. From Belgium onward, Verstappen was a force of nature. He won in Baku. He won in Singapore. He won in Vegas. He won everywhere.

Suddenly, the impossible was on the table: If Verstappen won every remaining race – and every remaining sprint – he could steal the championship.

It had never been done. It shouldn’t have been possible. But this was Max.

And he nearly did it.

Photo created by Microsoft Co-pilot using the information from our episode.

IV. The Season of Strange Heroes

2025 gave us unexpected brilliance in unexpected places.

  • George Russell — The Desert King: He won in Canada. He won in Singapore. He complained constantly, but he delivered when it mattered.
  • Kimi Antonelli — The Rookie Revelation: Thrown into the Mercedes seat with barely a warning, he drove like a veteran. Brave, fast, occasionally reckless — but undeniably gifted.
  • Nico Hülkenberg — The Long‑Awaited Podium: After a career defined by near‑misses, he finally stood on the box at Silverstone. The paddock roared.
  • Ollie Bearman — The Haas Miracle: Late‑season upgrades turned the Haas into a weapon, and Bearman wielded it with shocking precision.
  • Yuki Tsunoda — The Chaos Merchant: His signature move – front wheel into sidepod – remained undefeated. His radio messages remained unhinged. His final act of the season would become legend.
Photo created by Microsoft Co-pilot using the information from our episode.

V. The Championship Decider: Yas Marina

The final race of the season was a masterpiece of tension.

Norris entered Abu Dhabi with a fragile lead. Verstappen needed perfection. McLaren needed discipline. Red Bull needed a miracle.

They almost got one.

Photo created by Microsoft Co-pilot using the information from our episode.

The Moment That Changed Everything

Late in the race, Verstappen was closing. Norris was vulnerable. And Yuki Tsunoda – armed with a cryptic radio message (“You know what to do Yuki”) – found himself defending against Norris with the subtlety of a sledgehammer.

What followed was chaos.

Norris went four wheels off. Tsunoda weaved. The stewards blinked. They penalized Tsunoda. They let Norris go.

Had they reversed the call, Verstappen would be champion.

Instead, Lando Norris crossed the line as the 2025 Formula One World Champion.

A title won by brilliance, luck, controversy — and a single steward’s ruling.


VI. The Aftermath

The paddock reaction was muted. Social media fell strangely silent. Even McLaren’s celebration felt… restrained.

Because everyone knew the truth: This championship was decided by inches. By politics. By timing. By the smallest margins the sport has ever seen.

And 2026 – with new engines, new aero, new teams, and new chaos – promises to rewrite everything again.


VII. Looking Ahead

Audi arrives. Cadillac arrives. Adrian Newey becomes team principle at Aston Martin. Max Verstappen makes a bigger push in GT3 – and perhaps soon at Le Mans. Hamilton faces the twilight. Antonelli rises. Piastri sharpens. Norris defends.

And the Motoring Podcast Network? We’re not done either.

2026 will bring a new chapter – and a new show.

Formula Fanatics. A dedicated, race‑by‑race breakdown of the world’s most dramatic motorsport.

Because if 2025 taught us anything, it’s this: In Formula One, the chase never ends. It only accelerates.


Support our Creators!

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For as little as $2.50 cents a month, you can get access to more behind the scenes action, additional Pit Stop mini-sodes and other VIP goodies, as well as keeping our team of creators fed on their strict diet of Fig Newton’s, Gummy Bears, and Monster. Consider signing up for Patreon today. And remember, without *YOU*, none of this would be possible!


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Motoring Podcast Network

From Scalpel to Startup: Dr. Matthew D. Jones and the Birth of Towlos

Every Break/Fix episode begins with a story of transformation, and few journeys are as bold as that of Dr. Matthew D. Jones. After more than a decade in medicine at Northwestern in Chicago, Matt traded the operating room for the open road – launching Towlos, the world’s first peer-to-peer trailer sharing marketplace. Think Airbnb or Turo, but for trailers.

Photo courtesy Matt Jones, Towlos.com

What sparked this radical career pivot? A Corvette, a track day, and the realization that renting the right trailer was nearly impossible.

Photo courtesy Matt Jones, Towlos.com

Matt had long been an Audi enthusiast, eagerly awaiting the RS6 Avant’s arrival in North America. When told he’d have to wait two years, he did what any car lover would: bought something else in the meantime. His criteria were simple – naturally aspirated engine, manual gearbox, modern comforts, and a price tag under $80K. The answer? A C7 Corvette Grand Sport, purchased sight unseen during the pandemic.

Tune in everywhere you stream, download or listen!

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That Corvette became more than a stopgap – it was the gateway to track days, friendships, and eventually, entrepreneurship. With buddies in Chicago, Matt began exploring iconic circuits like Road America, Mid-Ohio, VIR, and Road Atlanta. But hauling cars to distant tracks revealed a glaring problem: renting a proper trailer was nearly impossible. U-Haul’s car haulers were designed for Camrys, not Corvettes.

Spotlight

Synopsis

This Break/Fix episode features an interview with Dr. Matthew D. Jones, an orthopedic surgeon turned tech entrepreneur. After ten years in medicine, Matt faced a personal challenge finding a car trailer for a track day, leading him to launch Towlos, a peer-to-peer trailer sharing marketplace. Inspired by marketplace giants like Airbnb and Turo, Towlos connects trailer owners with renters, aiming to make trailer rentals more accessible and efficient. Matt shares details about his career shift, the operational aspects of Towlos, and his personal journey from medicine to entrepreneurship. He highlights the platform’s features, insurance complexities, pricing models, and the importance of community and technology in scaling the business. Matt’s story emphasizes resilience, the importance of supportive partners, and embracing risk to pursue new ventures.

  • What inspired you to make such a dramatic shift from orthopedic surgery to entrepreneurship, and what was going through your mind when you decided to take that leap?
  • What were some of the biggest challenges you faced in turning the concept of a peer-to-peer trailer sharing marketplace into a functioning, scalable business?
  • How does it work?
  • Is there built-in roadside assistance? What about extra insurance? Who is liable, who’s at fault? What if the trailer damages the car? 
  • Where do you take the trailer to get it certified? What about registration/tags? Could someone report the trailer stolen? 
  • How is pricing structured, is that set by the owner? Or the platform? What are the fees like? 
  • As towlos continues to grow, what strategies are you using to scale while maintaining quality, community, and trust among your users?
  • For professionals considering a major career pivot like yours, what advice would you give them about embracing risk and redefining success?
  • What are some of the most valuable lessons you’ve learned since founding towlos—especially ones you wish you’d known at the beginning?

Transcript

Crew Chief Brad: [00:00:00] Break Fix podcast is all about capturing the living history of people from all over the autos sphere, from wrench, turners, and racers to artists, authors, designers, and everything in between. Our goal is to inspire a new generation of Petrolhead that wonder. How did they get that job or become that person?

The Road to Success is paved by all of us because everyone has a story.

Crew Chief Eric: Today on Break Fixx, we’re joined by Matthew D. Jones, a man who’s truly redefining what it means to take a bold career pivot. After a decade in medicine at renowned institutions like Northwestern Medicine in Chicago, he made the remarkable leap into entrepreneurship in 2022, driven by a personal challenge during a track day road trip when he couldn’t find a trailer to rent.

A former orthopedic surgeon turned tech entrepreneur, Matt is the founder and CEO of Towlos, the world’s first peer-to-peer trailer sharing marketplace. Through Towlos, Matt is [00:01:00] transforming an underutilized asset class trailers that sit idle 90% of the time into income generating opportunities for owners while giving renters affordable on demand access to haulers across the United States.

Think Airbnb or Touro. For trailers. And with that, let’s welcome Matt to Break Fix.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Great to be here. Thank you, Eric.

Crew Chief Eric: Every good break fix story starts with the superhero origins. So tell us about your adventures in the world of motorsports and what inspired you to make such a drastic shift from the world of orthopedic surgery into entrepreneurship.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Yeah, man, it was a car. It was, uh, the car that you may see behind me it was the C seven Corvette. That was kind of what spearheaded this whole thing. So I’ve been kind of an Audi fan for a long time and I’ve had a few Audis in the past. 2019, came around then 2020, and you know, I think for the first time.

In history, the RS six platform was coming to North America. You know, read about [00:02:00] that in Car and Driver or something and got excited and called my local dealer in Chicago, Fletcher Jones, who I have to give a shout out to. ’cause they were great and they were working with me. Really. That was a great experience and I, you know, they were gonna get me a, an RSS six Avant at sticker, but they told me, here’s the bad news, it’s gonna be two years.

And I was like, oh, you know, it’s amazing how like your emotions get so high and then they get dashed when you, man, that’s a long time to wait. So I did what any logical thinker does, which is okay, what other car am I gonna get in the meantime? And so I talked to my wife. I think she kind of got it a little bit, or at least she played along.

And so then I started just thinking what might be a good car to get in the meantime that I can kind of have. And then I’d sell when the RSS six was available in, in two years. And so I really kind of started on this little journey where I think I had four criteria. So it was one, I just wanted a, a naturally aspirated engine knowing that those are going [00:03:00] away.

Number two, I wanted a car with a manual gearbox. Number three, it needed to be in a specific price range. You know, I, I couldn’t afford a $150,000 car, so I was looking more maybe between. Let’s say 50 and $80,000, something like that. And then I guess number four is I was looking for something that it wouldn’t probably be a daily driver, but something that it would be comfortable enough.

It had ac, it had power steering, and so it was a little bit more of, let’s call it 2000 plus rather than nineties or eighties type cars. So those were my four kind of criteria. So then. Course start looking around. Right. And you can help me out. You could probably could just name like five or six cars that fit that criteria right now.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, this is shaping up to be a what should I buy episode.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Okay. Exactly. Exactly. What would you buy?

Crew Chief Eric: Well, I mean, you had me at Avant, I mean, anything long roof. I mean, I’m into wind.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Yeah, yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: But what you ended up with is about as diametrically opposed as you can get.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Right. I, I’ve never been a Corvette guy, but I kind of came across Mustangs, right?

I the Porsche Cayman. What [00:04:00] else? There’s a few other vehicles that, that was manual gearbox, naturally aspirated, you know, not terribly old, and then was in the right price range. So I kind of stumbled across the C seven Grand Sport was a COVID purchase, as many can attest. Bought it sight unseen, I think from Kansas City.

It was awesome. 3000 miles on it and I just kind of really fell in love and it, you know, I’ve definitely. I got new balance shoes and found my jorts and become a Corvette guy. And so got that car in 2020 and then it turns out the RSS six came a year early, which never happens, right? So then of course I had this dilemma and I didn’t wanna get rid of the Corvette and, and I was fortunate to be able to keep both.

So I can tell you about the RSS six on another story, but I’ll continue with the Corvette because that is basically what helped spearhead this Towlos adventure. Of course met a couple buddies with Corvettes. My good buddy Trent was kind of my enabler, and he was like, Hey, do you track [00:05:00] your car? And I was like, well, no, I, I’ve been to a couple different racetracks with Extreme experience and some other deals like that.

I had, one of my buddies was in the Viper Club back when I was in med school, and so I would do Ridealongs with him, but very limited track experience. And so I was like, no, I. You know, he’s like, well, you know, again, we’re living in Chicago right at the time. And so he’s like, we like going to tracks around here, a couple tracks around Chicago.

And then they had gone up to Road America a couple times, and so they were like, Hey, let’s swap out the brake fluid and then you’re pretty much ready to go. Like, and so I was like, okay, so you always need a buddy, right? You always need an enabler into these money losing adventures.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s one way of putting it.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: And so that was 2021. When that happened and we were able to drive to Road America, which is about two hours away, that didn’t really seem too bad, but we, we all kind of caught the bug. There’s about four of us, and that’s when we were like, Hey, we would love to plan some weekends where we can just go to tracks farther and farther from [00:06:00] home.

We wanted to go to Amid Ohio. We wanted to go to NCM, we wanted to go to VIR, you know, we wanted to get to Road Atlanta, you know, all these iconic tracks over the us. And that was like, okay, let’s just rent a car hauler. My buddy had an F four 50, so all we needed was a double car hauler. Then we can ride together.

This will be great. Then we, we won’t get stuck at the track. And it was amazing how hard this is, 2021 and it still is how hard it was to rent the right trailer. You could rent a trailer, but it was so hard to rent the right trailer, the right tool for the job. Right. And that’s kind of how Tolo started. We identified.

U-Haul, they make a car hauler that works for Toyota Camrys and Honda Accords. People have Jerry rigged it and, you know, kind of made it work. ’cause that was the only option to get their race cars to the track. I mean, I, I’ve been to a bunch of grid life races and you see all these U-Haul haulers out there in the yards with like stacks of three, two by twelves on them to get them high enough so that the splitter.

Gets over top, then [00:07:00] the car door gets over the fender. Those U-Haul haulers are just not meant to haul a race car or a sports car. And so that’s kind of how things started for Towlos. And by the way, I’m working as an orthopedic surgeon at this time. I ended up doing both for about a year. And then I kind of felt my legs starting to split, and I realized that there was just no way to do both well, and so I was gonna have to make a hard decision.

Crew Chief Eric: So what’s in a name? Where’d the name Towlos come from?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: I wanted to make up a word. You know, you’ve heard all these crazy words like Turo, you mentioned Turo, Airbnb. I mean, that’s not even really, that’s kind of a combination of a couple words, right? Uber, I mean, I guess that’s a word we, so we wanted to kind of follow that same kind of geeky, techy kind of thing.

The other reason that we wanted to make the word up was. When you make a word up, you can own its definition, and so you don’t have to play on somebody else’s presuppositions about what some word means. The challenge you have, of course, is, as you know, how do you pronounce that made up word? So we wanted to make up the word that was number one I I [00:08:00] wanted it to be two syllables.

Often a two syllable word rolls off your tongue a little bit better. Uber Turo, Lyft is one syllable, but I wanted it to be two syllables and I also wanted it to be six letters or less. If it was six letters or or fewer fits better onto a logo. There was several things here, Eric, that I just kind of got lucky as I was going through these criteria.

’cause I didn’t realize till about a year later that there was like, Hey, there’s some real method to that. And I was like, well, at the time I was just kind of winging it. But then the most probably important criteria is that it has to be a domain that’s available. And so we went through this whole list, and so we wanted something that had hitch or tow hall.

Hitch Lee was one of the ones we kinda liked for a while, you know, so we just kinda landed on. Towlos, T-O-W-L-O-S. And that was kind of the origin for the name.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, as long as nobody’s calling you up, Taos,

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: that happens and that’s fine. And even now, Google likes to auto correct me to say, did you mean towels?

And I’m like, no, I’m not [00:09:00] searching for bathroom towels. You know? We know we’ll have made it when Google stops trying to auto correct us.

Crew Chief Eric: Alright, so you made the jump from the medical industry into tech. That is just like going from the RSS six to the Corvette. They could not be any more different, like I always say, apples and chainsaws.

What were some of the biggest challenges you faced in turning your career? Into this peer-to-peer trailer sharing marketplace and making it a scalable, functional, profitable business

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: that was at least five years in the making. You know, you, you don’t make a decision like that overnight, right? As some of your listeners may know, when you’re a surgeon, you basically go to school for your entire life, or at least that’s what it feels like.

So I did 14 years of training after high school, so that’s four years of college. Undergraduate, then four years of medical school, then five years of orthopedic surgery residency, and then I did an optional one year of sports medicine [00:10:00] fellowship. By the time I finished training, I was 32, and then I worked, as you mentioned, in Chicago, worked at Northwestern Medicine, which was a great institution to work for for 10 years.

You know, did orthopedic surgery for 10 years. I really, I enjoyed parts of it. Most parts of orthopedics I liked. I mean, I, I think ortho is one of the best professions within medicine and we in, in medicine and people inside medicine will probably appreciate this. Those outside might not, but there’s, there was a real separation in my head between orthopedic surgery and American medicine and American medicine changed a lot in the.

The 20 years that, that I was a part of it, there was a lot of bureaucracy that has come in a lot of corporatization. You know, insurance has, has played a large role in just the deprecation of the professionalism of the field. There just seemed to be a wedge that was being driven between the patient and the doc and that’s just not fun for the patient and that’s not fun for the doc.

And so, you know, it became a little bit of a grind and, and people [00:11:00] are in the medical field, are pretty familiar with burnout and there’s a lot of docs that are burning out. There’s not too many of ’em that make this crazy pivot like I did, but a lot of them are seeking some type of intellectual outlet outside of their chosen profession.

That was a, at least a five year in the making. I, I don’t remember saying this, but my wife reminds me that probably two or three times a week, I would say, man, I don’t, I don’t know how much longer I can do this. In my head, I, I just kind of thought, Hey, I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to go to medical school and, and undergrad.

You know, you really kind of silo yourself into this and you learn a lot about a little sliver of the world. It’s hard to pivot from that.

Crew Chief Eric: So, earlier you talked about your buddies in your car adventures, you know, getting you into the world of Corvette. You never go at it alone. Kind of like hiking, kind of like off-roading and a lot of other things.

In the world of tech, usually there’s someone else in the equation. So who was your buddy on this adventure? Or did you just pick up a bunch of [00:12:00] programming books and go to town?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: I am the sole founder. I also now have a co-founder named Jeff who’s been an at. Great partner, but I did kind of go this alone, I guess.

Primarily I started building a team around me ’cause I don’t know how to code. I had to find a full stack developer and then a ui ux designer, and it was basically, we were the three amigos. For about a year as we were building this and we were benchmarking Toro, we were benchmarking another peer-to-peer marketplace called Outdoorsy.

They do RVs and travel trailers, so people are, they want to kind of go on an adventure. That’s not our space. We focus on car haulers. Enc. Closed trailers, boat trailers, horse trailers, dump trailers. That’s kind of our niche. And so for travel trailers or campers, outdoorsy or RV share are great options.

And so we kind of benchmark some of these other peer-to-peer marketplaces just to kind of see how they did it. Almost kind of copy some of the lessons that they learned. One of the parallels as an orthopedic surgeon is [00:13:00] we kind of extreme attention to detail into the design of Towlos. And, and I’d encourage anybody in this listening just to kind of go to Towlos tw os.com and, and check it out.

And I’d love a honest, candid review. We are looking for that. And you can call me, you can email me, I’ll put in our information at the end, but I didn’t really have a. Buddy in a sense, like I kind of went alone in a way, and then started building a team around me. I think that’s one of the things that you learn as a surgeon.

Of course, when you’re in the operating room, you are in charge. In my situation, you’d be working with the anesthesiologist, also, A-C-R-N-A. There’s your scrub tech, there’s the circulator. Often there’s a device rep. Many times there’s also a resident or a medical student that’s there in the room. I had my PA that was kind of assisting me often, you know, so there’s probably a team of let’s say, six to 10 people in the room and you’re working as a team.

So there’s a real comradery, and that was something that at least I was familiar with in that [00:14:00] capacity as a surgeon, that has served me well as I’ve built this team. Here at tos.

Crew Chief Eric: So let’s switch gears and get into the meat and potatoes of Towlos. Alright. Let’s talk about how it works.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Let’s do it.

Crew Chief Eric: You mentioned some peer-to-peer marketplaces.

You mentioned specifically in the trailer space with respect to campers and RVs. We’ve mentioned some peer-to-peer market spaces people would be familiar with if they’re on holiday or taking vacations like Airbnb and even Turo with the car rental stuff. How does it work? For race trailers and car trailers and even some of the extensions to this, you know, the horse trailers and dump trailers and stuff like that.

How does it work?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: U-Haul would be the household name. That would be our, eventually would be probably our direct competitor. Okay. Think about U-Haul as the company that worked well for the 20th century. We think of ourselves as U-Haul for the 21st century. So we’re bringing technology. We’re bringing a safe and secure platform.

So the way it works, you know, you need a specific type of trailer, then you just go on Towlos, you put in your city and [00:15:00] state and you put in the dates that you need it, and you hit go. And then it’ll bring up just all the list of the available trailers. And then you can filter by type. So if you know you need an enclosed trailer, just filter for an enclosed trailer.

If you know you need a horse trailer, you filter for a horse trailer and it’ll show you just all the options. And so for those that are familiar with Turo, it works very similar to Turo. So it’ll look and it’ll feel like Turo. So you’ll see the list of trailers there. Then if you see one that seems interesting, you click on that and then it brings up.

The trailer page and it has all the information, the photos, the videos, the hitch size, the GVWR, the capacity, the dimensions, and then all the description right there.

Crew Chief Eric: So the person renting has to go to the person that’s listed their trailer. Up on Towlos and go get it, right?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. As far as going to pick it up, you mean?

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Mm-hmm. Basically, if you see a trailer that you kind of like, all right, this is gonna work for my needs ground clearance, the approach angle, everything that [00:16:00] seems to work, okay. These are low fenders, so I can get my car door up over the fender. You know, you just follow the steps to create an account and rent it right there.

And what it’ll do is it’ll shoot a request to the owner. We call the owner, the host, the owner will kind of review the request. You have to answer a few questions. Towing experience, what’s your plan? Tow vehicle, where are you planning to go? You know, what’s the approximate mileage? And then what are you planning to haul, you know, and what’s the approximate weight of that?

Those four vetting questions really gives the host a real sense for, hey. Who’s this guy that’s trying to rent my trailer?

Crew Chief Eric: It’s interesting you bring that up because I kept thinking, does the system do any matching to say, tell me about your rig, about your truck. What are you gonna be pulling this trailer with?

Because for those of us that have our own trailers, we bought trucks that match our trailers or vice versa. So we know what we’re towing, we know what our payload is and our tongue weight, and you know how we need to position the car and all this kind of thing. But if you’re just a casual track day goer.

You know, your wife drives a Nissan Pathfinder. Well, it doesn’t have a [00:17:00] ton of tow capacity. So does the system match up and say, Hey, all of these trailers aren’t compatible with your vehicle, or is that up to the host to make that decision?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Right now? We leave it up to the host. So those four vetting questions basically then get pinged to the host, you know, and so then when the hosters are reviewing that request, they see, oh, this guy, he has a Ford Ranger.

Yeah, that’s not gonna work with my trailer. Oh, this guy has an F two 50. That’ll be, you know, that’ll be fine. So we will probably do some, and this is where we’re kind of leaning into some of the cool AI tools that are now becoming available. And so that might be one where we’ll kind of do some kind of automatic matching.

Right now we’ve allowed just the host to kind of do that compatibility match.

Crew Chief Eric: I show up at the host house to pick up the trailer, and I look at his trailer and I go, Hmm. I mean, I saw it in picture, but in person, you know. A picture’s worth a thousand words until you see something live, right? Mm-hmm.

What’s the onus on the host to keep the [00:18:00] trailer up to snuff and up to spec? I mean, trailers are kind of strange because they don’t get inspected like cars do, and there’s not a ton of facilities that you can take a trailer too to have it gone through. I’m very fortunate. I have one around the corner where I drop my trailer off and I have it serviced and all that kinda stuff.

So what’s the obligation on the owner’s side to make sure that the trailer’s in tiptop condition?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: I’ll answer that, but first, can I. Kick it back to you and I, ’cause I’m kinda curious, what’s the process that you go about keeping your trailer serviced? And how often do you typically do that? Is it usually an annual thing?

Crew Chief Eric: So trailers are when and not if.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Mm-hmm.

Crew Chief Eric: So there’s no set number of miles. It’s always the, the amount of time that it sits.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Mm-hmm.

Crew Chief Eric: So when I take my trailer in, when I was more actively trailering, it would go every two years. Mm-hmm. So at the end of the second season, it would go in for a full overhaul.

Bearings, brakes, tires, lights. Wiring because generally the chassis stuff doesn’t really have any sort of issue. Take a look at the Leaf Springs, Reese, the Jacks, you know, that kind of thing. And then you don’t worry about it again for maybe another year or two. Now that it’s sat [00:19:00] a little longer, I haven’t taken it in because I haven’t used it, but as soon as I start using it again, it’s the first thing on my list is gotta take the trailer in because it’s been sitting for too long and that whole checklist has to be gone through.

So again, it’s when and not if, and it’s definitely not miles, right.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Do you mind telling me approximately how much that costs to kind of do that type of service? Do you have any, just an estimate.

Crew Chief Eric: The last time I took it in for service to include a new set of tires and everything, I don’t know, it was like four or 500 bucks.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: You know, not nothing, but also not $2,000. And, and that includes probably four new tires, right? Probably. Exactly. And so we follow the same thing, and actually this is something we’re working on right now. As you can imagine, there is some built-in motivation for these trailers to be in great working condition.

The hosts, we’ve had really good track record with this so far, is that they upload photos that. Obviously you can upload a photo that doesn’t show that a tire is dry rotted, but then if you show up, that could be different. We’ve not had any, any issues with [00:20:00] that so far. One of the things we’re working on right now, the concept we’re kind of rolling around is kind something called Towlos verified, which would be similar to, you know, a super host on Airbnb where they get perks, they get, they’re higher ranked in the algorithm.

There’s some perks that we do to give them that carrot to kind of fulfill certain things. Everybody has to go through an annual inspection. Some people do it with a, a shop, some people do a self inspection. That helps to kind of keep the quality up. And then what we’re gonna do is continue to kinda lean into that and try to kind of gamify it a bit by giving people a carrot rather than a stick to be even more motivated to keep their trailer in good working condition.

Crew Chief Eric: So, you know, the adage. Two is one and one is none, especially when it comes to spare tires. On the trailer is the owner, the host, obligated to provide spare tires, gear for changing the tires, extra things for the trailer in case something goes wrong.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Every Towlos trailer is required to have a. A spare tire.

We don’t have specific [00:21:00] requirements for jacks or for, you know, things like that. Most of the guys do keep those kind of things in their toolbox, but we do have a requirement that every to trailer has to have a spare tire.

Crew Chief Eric: So what happens if something goes wrong? Is there insurance? Is there roadside assistance?

What are some of the other things that get added when you’re booking the trailer?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Does Towlos provide insurance? That’s probably the number one question that we receive, both from the host, the trailer owner, and maybe not as often from the guests, but we often get hosts. Again, these are guys that care about their assets, right?

They care about their race car, they also care about their trailer. So it makes sense, and I’ll tell you probably the biggest challenge that I’ve had in this entrepreneurial adventure is solving the insurance. Problem. So all these insurance companies, and we’ve, I think we’ve talked to every major carrier out there.

There’s this chicken and egg problem. They don’t want to really put a lot of effort and money and time into, you know, creating all these policies for this startup that may or may not make it, and it’s not [00:22:00] providing them with $500,000 minimum in premiums per year. It’s like, well, how do we get from where we are now to where we wanna be?

And there’s this kind of always been this chicken and egg problem. The short answer right now is that we have a tiered process for safety. And I’ll just kind of run through that real quick with you, Eric. So one thing is there’s obviously very clear wording in the terms of service that put all the legal responsibility for that trailer onto the guest.

’cause they’re the one operating the trailer. So it’s their responsibility. So there’s very clear wording in the terms. Number two. All the guests upload a photo of their ID and a photo of their insurance card, and that gets uploaded into Towlos, and that’s available in what we call the rental record, kind of in a, an electronic record of that rental transaction.

Number three is the host. Can set a refundable security deposit for every rental. That range is typically somewhere around 200 to $300, depending on the value of the trailer. We have a minimum, but we allow for the [00:23:00] kind of the host to set to have some autonomy on that refundable security deposit. So that ends up covering probably 93% or so of all.

Incidental damage. So you back a trailer into a tree or something, you scratch break the taillight. You bend something. Obviously won’t cover total loss, won’t cover theft, but it covers about 90 plus percent of all incidental damage. What we don’t offer yet is this integrated insurance plan. I was actually working on that earlier today ’cause that’s something that’s we’re gonna be offering here in the next couple months.

And so that will be an integrated insurance option for those trailer owners. There are insurance companies out there and you can get a policy. We work with, there’s a couple different insurance companies that quite a few hosts use. You know, they take out a policy that covers physical damage for the trailer.

Crew Chief Eric: Some of the track day insurance providers that we’ve spoken to, like Lockton and Open Track and places like that have extensions to their track day [00:24:00] policy that can cover the vehicle while it’s on the trailer in motion or at mm-hmm. In the paddock and things like that. They’re very carefully worded, so it’s really interesting because I always feel that trailers are, they’re a liability.

They’re not as. Set. It’s like you paid for it, you use it, you consume it, and something goes wrong. And it’s really unfortunate. There’s really no recourse at the end of that conversation. You know what I mean? But in this case, I’m borrowing somebody else’s trailer and it can go either way. Did my trailer cause your car to have a problem?

Or did you do something to my trailer? Or did your car do something to my, you know, it gets really gray and really muddy really fast. It

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: actually doesn’t. We have hundreds of rentals where it goes smoothly every time. Is that a possibility? Yes. But it’s amazing how things go smoothly almost every single time.

That’s been our experience. We’ve talked to a couple guys that work in insurance, and of course those guys are always thinking about the worst thing that can happen, and I tell those guys, you’re not a good fit for Towlos. That’s just the truth, right? But I’ll tell you, almost [00:25:00] every progressive State Farm, you know, a lot of these major companies, they have a specific trailer policy.

So this is not the paddock insurance that you’re talking about. This is a separate policy for the trailer, and those are often not that expensive just because the trailer is what, 8,000, 9,000, $10,000, you know, unless you’re getting a nice high-end intech trailer or something like that. Right? Probably our average trailer is value is somewhere between eight and $12,000.

Crew Chief Eric: So what about tags and registration? Anything special there for the trailers that have to be considered for the host?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: We do require a registration for all Towlos trailers. You know, there are a few states that don’t require trailer registration. We require it. Again, that’s just a kind of a safety mechanism.

If something goes south, it’s a little easier to track. Just we require, even though not every state requires that, we require a registered trailer to be able to list it on Towlos.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m sure there’s some folks thinking about this right now. Hey, my trailer’s sitting around. It might be a good idea to rent it out, make some money off of it.

It’s like renting a parking spot, you know what I mean?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Mm-hmm.

Crew Chief Eric: [00:26:00] When the minute comes that you cross that threshold and you watch your trailer go off down the road with somebody else pulling it. I’ve had this moment myself where friends borrow my trailer and I kind of cringe.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: You’re not a good fit for Towlos.

Crew Chief Eric: Is there any sort of tracking for the trailer? Because let’s just say, I don’t wanna say somebody’s gonna report it stolen, but you kind of wanna know where your trailer is.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Yeah, absolutely. And that’s another, you know, GPS trackers are very common at this time. We don’t require, they have a GPS tracker on the trailer, but we strongly recommend it.

And I think about. 80% of our trailers have GPS trackers. That’s another thing that we’re working on from a software perspective, and this is where some cool stuff comes in, is we’re working towards being able to do contactless rentals. So you physically don’t even have to be present. Obviously, if you want to be present, and especially sometimes we encourage it for the first time you’re meeting a, a renter, but say, you know Bob, you know he’s a good guy.

He takes his Miata to the track. He’s already rented your trailer on Towlos a couple months before. Now he wants [00:27:00] to do it again. You’re in the office through contactless rental, he can come pick it up and you can initiate everything kind of in a contactless manner and you can do that right now. We have the capability right now, but we’re making it better with some of the integration of some of the technology that comes along.

So you, with some of the geofencing, the automated alerts that like. Hey, you know, your guest is at your trailer. You know some, some of those real time alerts that you can get with different hardware and different device technology. So the short answer again, is that we don’t require GPS trackers, but we strongly recommend them.

So then you know where that trailer is. At all times. There’s also a lot of these trackers that have accelerometers on them. So then, you know, you can also kind of know if something’s being moved when it shouldn’t be. Also, that’s good information for the guest, you know, is if for some reason he’s at a track day and he knows that he parked the trailer in the paddock and should, should just be there overnight and you know, he is getting an alert that says, Hey, this thing’s being moved.

You know, like, okay. That’s a problem [00:28:00] that shouldn’t be happening.

Crew Chief Eric: How is pricing structured? Obviously that’s set by the owner. Is that set by the platform? Mm-hmm. What kind of fees are involved in this?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: We provide suggestions on pricing, and that is getting better and better every month as we scale. Then just there’s economies of scale that we can, you know, give better recommendations, give suggestions, but we allow each host to set their price.

Per day.

Crew Chief Eric: So where do you see the break even point, where the time comes, where you go, well, I’m gonna just buy my own trailer?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Yeah, that’s a good question. So what we found is it’s not so much the price for some of us, it’s the buying a 8,000, $10,000 trailer. That’s not nothing. But that’s also, I mean, how much does your race, car cost?

You know, like. 30, 40, $50,000, 60, 70, you know, like you can keep going. Right. So it’s, it’s often somewhere like 20% of the cost of your car or something. Right. So it’s often we found that it’s not so much the price, that’s the barrier, it’s the convenience, it’s the, Hey, I don’t have the space I live [00:29:00] in. Park, you know, outside of Chicago and I just don’t have the space for a trailer.

I could afford a trailer. I’d rather just rent one. So that’s tends to be where we find a lot of folks that would rather just rent the trailer. Especially now that they know that they have access to the right trailer. Before it was like, ah, I guess I’ll rent a U-Haul. ’cause that’s all that’s out there.

And now that people are finding it out, oh man, I could rent the right trailer. I’m happy to pay a hundred bucks a day. Our national average for a, a single. Car open Hauler is one 16. The unit economics are actually quite favorable for the host. You know, think about it. If you know, if you rent a trailer out for, let’s say four, two day rentals, that’s eight days, somewhere around $800.

I mean, that’s a decent amount. So the unit economics are quite favorable. You asked about the pricing and just kind of the business model. Towlos, like most other marketplaces, just takes a marketplace fee. So we just take 17% of that daily rate. So you list it for a hundred bucks, you keep [00:30:00] $83, and then Towlos keeps 17

Crew Chief Eric: future renters or maybe future owners looking to list their trailer.

They always like to hear about. Other people’s experiences and testimonials are at the top of that list. Do you have any feedback from current owners or renters? Things you can share? Stories that have shaped the evolution of the platform.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: One of the things that we have realized recently is that third party credibility is huge.

You know, like if I say it’s great, people are like, okay, cool. I’ll check it out. If, I don’t know if you know Rutledge Wood, if you know Rutt, we’ve become buddies with him. You know, if Rutt gets out there and says, Hey guys. Check this out, this thing’s pretty cool. That’s huge, right? Kind of getting that third party credibility I think is really important and just kinda helps that brand awareness and then the brand trust, just ’cause we’re only being three years old.

Nobody’s heard about us yet, and that’s one of the big struggles. Again, I think that one of the things as a, as an orthopedic surgeon is. We don’t necessarily are the smartest guys in the room, but we’re probably one of the guys that has some of the most persistence and the most grit of anyone. [00:31:00] That’s one of the things I’ve brought to the table is just having that perseverance, that resilience, that grit to kind of keep pushing through.

So yeah, the, I think the testimonials, I think you’re exactly right,

Crew Chief Eric: as Towlos continues to grow. Any strategies that you’re employing to scale the business while maintaining, you know, quality that community and the trust amongst the owners and the renters? I mean, you mentioned AI is one avenue to pursue anything else.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: We see ourselves as not so much a trailer rental company, but as a company that allows people freedom, brings experiences. So you think about getting a horse to another state to get to a competition. You could borrow a friend’s horse trailer. Or take advantage of the convenience in a safe and secure platform like Tolo.

So we really see ourselves as helping people have more fun, and it just, the tool is a trailer, and so we’re really leaning into the experience, the passion. That’s one of the reasons we love the Motorsports community. I mean, that’s where Tolo started on a racetrack, [00:32:00] specifically Road America. And we love the passion.

We love the community. We see ourselves being defensible by building a community of passionate people. You know, you and I talked about Grid life before we came on air and just the community and what we found. It’s amazing. So we have, you know, we have the Towlos chat, and I cannot tell you how many times, you know this one guy, oh, I have my GT three.

I’m thinking of a specific scenario where one of our hosts has a Futura trailer, which are amazing trailers. Those are those aluminum lowering trailers, right? And so they were back and forth and talking about, oh yeah, I have some small race ramps that I use. Because I have a big splitter on mine and so you’re welcome to use those.

And just like there’s a real sense of community and like helping each other and we love that. I mean, that’s how, why I started this, and it’s just, it puts a smile on our face when we see these conversations and we see these guys helping each other and basically expanding this already very vibrant.

Community, and we’re just trying to add to that.

Crew Chief Eric: Matt, [00:33:00] let’s switch gears yet again into our final segment, and let’s turn back to you. You know, we did a lot of data crunching there, a lot of figuring out how Towlos works. But let’s talk about how, not just the transformation of the platform, but your personal transformation.

So what have you learned after a couple years of going through this process, transitioning from the operating room to Towlos and into the startup world?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: A couple things come to mind. You know when you’re in pre-med and then med school and then residency, and then fellowship, right? Your, your head is down, you don’t really come up to breathe.

You’re just going, and then you wake up and you finish training and you’re 32. You know? So you did that for your entire teens and twenties. One of the things that’s been a really cool, I think, professional and personal journey for me. My last surgery was December 18th, 2021. I do miss it sometimes, especially if I’m thinking about this, talking about it like this, but I’m so intellectually stimulated now, and I’m not bored.

I think if I was bored or if Towlos [00:34:00] wasn’t as exciting or something, you know, I, I would miss it more. But I’ve realized at least two things. One is that I’m actually more naturally a generalist. Of course when you go to medical school, you have the opportunity to be a general practitioner pediatrician, more of a primary care doc.

Of course, I kind of went the other route where I was a specialist and actually a, what’s considered a subspecialist, and as I’ve kind of reflected on my natural personality, I love being a generalist. I actually love learning a little bit about a lot of things, you know, whether it’s cars and I don’t do everything that you guys do as far as, you know, just pulling engines out.

But now I can change the rear diff fluid and the clutch fluid, and the brake fluid and the trans fluid and the Corvette and, and that, you know, learning a little bit about that. I’m now learn a little bit about social media, a little bit about marketing, a little bit about web development. And so what’s been fun for me is to identify people with talent, try to position them in a way that they’re set up for success, and then figure out how to get out of their way.[00:35:00]

That’s been something that’s been real exciting. And so I see in myself in some ways as more of a chief inspirational officer, someone who I can inspire people. I have a plaque right over here that I’m looking at. So when I was in high school, one of the sports I played was basketball, but I wasn’t very good, and so I was still playing JV when I was a junior.

Then I got the plaque. It wasn’t even most improved. It was most inspirational. That was the plaque. I’m looking at it right here. I keep that there as a reminder, Hey, you may not have talent, but you can inspire others to do great thing. And so that’s been something that I’ve continued to aspire to do.

Second thing I think that I’ve learned, Eric, is I’m naturally more risk tolerant. Of course, in medicine, we’re taught to be very risk adverse, which I think is appropriate. You don’t want some cowboy saying, Hey, I think we can fix that rotator cuff. I used to do a lot of rotator cuff surgery, a lot of ACL reconstruction, you know, Hey, I think we can fix that.

I mean, you don’t want some cowboy just. Trying [00:36:00] to figure it out. Let’s see how it goes. So you want docs to be very risk adverse and you want, you know, that success ratio to be up 95 plus percent. Of course, in the startup world, you almost have to be the opposite. You have to be very risk tolerant, you have to be willing to kind of try things.

We call ’em high risk, low data decisions. And we, we make those every day. And so I’ve found that actually naturally my personality is more risk tolerance. So I would say those would be two things that I’ve kind of learned as I’ve reflected back on my journey.

Crew Chief Eric: So if you could talk to Matt on December the 19th of 2021, the day after you retired from medicine.

Knowing what you know now, what would you tell ’em?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: One of the advantages of being a first time founder, which is what I am, is that you’d not been through the pain before. So you just don’t know. In some ways, our naivete is our greatest asset. If you knew how hard something was gonna be, you just wouldn’t do it.

You’d be like F that you [00:37:00] just wouldn’t do it. Right. So I guess what I would tell myself is. Hey, continue to basically do what you’ve done your entire life, which is just keep taking one step forward every single day. And I, I have a little bit of a, I have a quote right here that I’m, I memorized from one of my heroes, Winston Churchill, and it says, success is stumbling from failure to failure.

With no loss of enthusiasm. And so I would remind myself on December 19th, 2021, just, Hey, the definition of success is stumbling from failure to failure, but not losing enthusiasm. And, and that’s, I think what I would encourage your audience, Eric, is for those people who feel kind of stuck in what they’re doing, whether it’s their career, whatever they’re in, and, and it most often applies to a particular position at work or, or, you know, a career is that.

Have the courage to step out because if you do nothing, you guarantee the outcome.

Crew Chief Eric: So, Matt, what’s next, not just for Towlos, but for you personally? Is there a new direction, [00:38:00] technology, partnerships, anything you’re particularly excited about?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: There’s a couple partnerships that I can’t speak about publicly yet that we’re really excited about.

What we’re kind of right at the beginning of right now is raising a venture capital round, and so we’re raising a couple million dollars and that’s both exciting and intimidating. ’cause that’s, again, not something that I’ve done before. You know, I’ve been working on a pitch deck for the last couple months.

We’ve just started to talk to some believers. That’s what really what they are at this point. People that are in the motorsports space. They see the passion, they get it, they see an opportunity, and they wanna be a part of that, and they believe. And so that’s what we’re kind of looking for. So if anyone out there has an interest and wants to talk, thinks that they may be interested in investing or maybe be able to help in an advisory capacity, I’d encourage them to reach out.

I’d love to have a conversation. Uh, you know, I have a rule in life that’s, um, it’s always talked to Bob. I don’t know if you’ve heard this one.

Crew Chief Eric: I know about the Bobs from office space and what about Bob, but who? Who’s this next? Bob?

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Exactly. This one’s a different [00:39:00] Bob. Alright, so here’s the deal. I’ve adopted this philosophy, which is always talk to Bob.

You know, you got somebody, you’re telling him about some problem you have. Let’s say, you know, I need an AI engineer. That was the problem for us about two months ago. We need somebody who is a software engineer, who has a passion for ai. And so of course you always have people that say, Hey, I have this friend Jim, you know, I know this guy, Jim.

I think he might be good. And he’s describing what Jim does and you’re just like, you’re thinking in your head, no. Way, this is not a good fit. Jim is not gonna be the person I’m talking to. You know, that’s gonna kind of solve my problem. What I’ve kind of just told myself is, if at all possible, always meet, in this case, Jim, and I can’t tell you how often you have this conversation with Jim and he says, Hey, I get what you’re going for.

I’m actually probably not the best person for that, but I have a friend named Nancy. She’s been working in this space, and she starts just, he starts describing her skillset and you’re thinking, oh. Okay, now we’re getting somewhere. And it is amazing how many times, [00:40:00] Eric, you end up finding Nancy, only because you first talked to Bob and so you would’ve never talked to Nancy if you wouldn’t have first talked to Bob.

So I, I have this, I always gotta always talk to Bob philosophy,

Crew Chief Eric: man. I’m gonna change my name to Bob ’cause I seem to play that role quite a bit.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: Do you really? Yeah. Okay. We need to talk Bob.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, Matt, we’ve reached that part of the episode where I like to invite our guests to share any shout outs, promotions, thank yous, or anything else we haven’t covered thus far.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: You know, one of my main goals for being on this podcast today is just to kind of inspire people that feel stuck. You can apply that same principle to I think a lot of things. Again, not too many people are kind of making a really crazy shift. If you talk to my father-in-law, he, he would, he wanted my head examine you.

Imagine like your daughter getting married to some orthopedic surgeon. Oh, that sounds good. And then he’s like, no, you know, given this up, pursuing some startup that has no guarantee of success. It’s been a, it’s been a real journey. I’ll tell you, [00:41:00] there’s a couple criteria I think for this and, and I would say one, if anyone’s considering doing a tech startup startup of any kind, you gotta just go in knowing that that’s gonna be difficult.

And I would say, I don’t know if this is an absolute criteria, but I would probably consider this as a criteria, is make sure your partner or your spouse is on board. If there’s tension there, you know you’re going in this direction because you kind of feel. That’s the direction you want to go. That’s gonna be hard just on its face.

But then I think you’re really introducing a lot of additional tension and hardship if your spouse, if your partner is not also on board. So I have to give tons of credit to my wife, Emily, for just being willing to let me take this leap. I guess one thing that I’ll say is as I was preparing for the podcast, I was listening to the episode with Boris said, and I would say if anyone that’s listening to this right now has not listened to that one, go back and listen to that.

That was like, that was so good. I found myself laughing a ton. I mean, just kind of like reliving some of [00:42:00] his memories, the way that he can kind of describe and bring to life some of the experiences that, that he had. So that would be one shout out is go listen to Boris said. The other thing is anybody that wants to reach out to me, matt@Towlos.com, MATT, at Towlos, T-O-W-L-O s.com, love to hear from you.

Thirdly, if you are looking for the right trailer, the right tool for the job, we created a, just a custom promo code that you guys, that your listeners can insert at checkout called fix 15 for 15% off your, your first rental, so FIX 15, and just put that promo code in at checkout.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, folks, that’s a wrap on today’s conversation with Matt Jones, founder and CEO of Towlos, the world’s first peer-to-peer trailer sharing marketplace from the operating room to the open road.

Matt’s journey is a powerful reminder that innovation often begins with a personal need and the courage to do something about it. If you’d like to learn more about Towlos. And how it’s transforming the way people rent and share [00:43:00] trailers. Visit www.Towlos.com or follow them on social media at Towlos for the latest updates and stories from the community.

And with that, Matt, I can’t thank you enough for coming on Break Fix and sharing your story with us. And I have to say that the idea of transforming idle trailers into income generating assets. Absolutely brilliant. It’s one of those ideas that’s so simple, you sit back and go, dang it, why didn’t I think of that?

It’s amazing to see that even in 2025, there’s still something new that can be built, that can be created and that can blossom into something great and we wish you and to los the best of success in the years to come.

Dr. Matthew D. Jones: It’s been a real pleasure. I really appreciate you extending me this opportunity. Um, it’s been a real honor.

Really, really appreciate it.

Crew Chief Eric: We hope you enjoyed another awesome episode of Break Fix Podcast, brought to you by Grand Tour Motorsports. If you’d like to be a guest on the show or get [00:44:00] involved, be sure to follow us on all social media platforms at Grand Touring Motorsports. And if you’d like to learn more about the content of this episode, be sure to check out the follow on article@gtmotorsports.org.

We remain a commercial free and no annual fees organization through our sponsors, but also through the generous support of our fans, families, and friends through Patreon. For as little as $2 and 50 cents a month, you can get access to more behind the scenes action, additional pit stop, minisodes and other VIP goodies, as well as keeping our team of creators.

Fed on their strict diet of fig Newton’s, Gumby bears, and monster. So consider signing up for Patreon today at www.patreon.com/gt motorsports. And remember, without you, none of this would be [00:45:00] possible.

Highlights

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00 Meet Dr. Matthew D. Jones: From Medicine to Entrepreneurship
  • 01:34 The Car That Started It All
  • 04:44 The Birth of Towlos
  • 09:06 Challenges and Pivots: From Surgery to Tech
  • 12:01 Building the Towlos Team
  • 14:05 How Towlos Works
  • 18:01 Ensuring Trailer Quality and Safety
  • 22:16 Legal Responsibilities and Security Measures
  • 23:24 Insurance Options for Trailer Owners
  • 25:25 Trailer Registration and Tracking
  • 28:01 Pricing and Business Model
  • 30:05 Community and Testimonials
  • 32:59 Personal Transformation and Reflections
  • 37:52 Future Plans and Partnerships
  • 40:21 Final Thoughts and Promotions

Bonus Content

There's more to this story!

Be sure to check out the behind the scenes for this episode, filled with extras, bloopers, and other great moments not found in the final version. Become a Break/Fix VIP today by joining our Patreon.

All of our BEHIND THE SCENES (BTS) Break/Fix episodes are raw and unedited, and expressly shared with the permission and consent of our guests.

Learn More

Create a new account on Towlos, use our promo code FIX15 to receive 15% off your first rental.


If you’d like to learn more about how towlos is transforming the way people rent and share trailers, visit
towlos.com or follow @towlos on social media for the latest updates and stories from the community.

Seeing an unmet need, Matt envisioned a platform where underutilized trailers – idle 90% of the time – could generate income for owners while giving racers and enthusiasts affordable access. Thus, Towlos was born. The name, a made-up word, was intentionally short, two syllables, and domain-friendly – allowing Matt to define its meaning from scratch.

Like Turo, Towlos connects renters with hosts. Users search by city, state, and trailer type –  whether enclosed, horse, boat, or dump – and filter results to find the right fit. Hosts vet renters with key questions about towing experience, vehicle compatibility, and cargo weight. It’s a system built on trust, transparency, and community.

Photo courtesy Matt Jones, Towlos.com

Matt’s pivot wasn’t overnight. After 14 years of medical training and 10 years in orthopedic surgery, burnout and bureaucracy pushed him to seek new intellectual outlets. Building Towlos required assembling a team – developers, designers, and eventually a co-founder – while benchmarking against platforms like Outdoorsy and RVShare.

Insurance proved the biggest hurdle. Trailers are assets, and owners want protection. Towlos currently uses a tiered safety system: clear terms of service, renter ID and insurance verification, refundable security deposits, and optional host policies. Integrated insurance is on the horizon, alongside innovations like GPS tracking and “Towlos Verified” inspections to gamify maintenance and reliability.

Photo courtesy Matt Jones, Towlos.com

Matt’s story is proof that passion can fuel reinvention. From orthopedic surgery to motorsports entrepreneurship, he’s built a platform that empowers enthusiasts while modernizing an overlooked industry. For racers, hobbyists, and haulers alike, Towlos offers freedom, flexibility, and peace of mind.

As Matt puts it, “We think of ourselves as U-Haul for the 21st century.” And with every trailer that rolls out under the Towlos banner, he’s paving a new road for motorsports culture – one rental at a time.


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Motoring Podcast Network

Bobby Rahal: Bridging IndyCar Glory with the Legend of Le Mans

For more than a century, the 24 Hours of Le Mans has stood as one of motorsport’s ultimate tests of endurance, skill, and resilience. While Bobby Rahal is best known for his triumphs in IndyCar, his ventures into Le Mans during the late 1970s and early 1980s reveal a fascinating chapter of his career – one that underscores his versatility and passion for racing on the world stage.

The Apple 935; Photo courtesy International Motor Racing Research Center

Rahal’s path to Le Mans was rooted in sports car racing. Growing up around his father’s campaigns at Sebring and Watkins Glen, he was immersed in the world of endurance racing long before his IndyCar success. Watching legends like Brian Redman, Jo Siffert, and Peter Rodriguez in Porsche 917s left a lasting impression, fueling his own ambitions to compete in Europe’s greatest events.

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By the late 1970s, Rahal was racing Formula Atlantic, Formula Three, and even making appearances in Formula One. Yet sports cars remained close to his heart. His partnership with Bob Garretson and Garretson Enterprises opened the door to Le Mans, beginning with the iconic Porsche 935.

Synopsis

In this episode of Evening With a Legend, Bobby Rahal, renowned for his IndyCar accomplishments, takes center stage. Rahal shares his stories and reflections on his experiences at the 24 Hours of Le Mans during the 1980s. Despite endurance racing not being his primary focus, Rahal’s versatility and adaptability shine through as he narrates his journey, starting from sports car racing roots and his partnership with Bob Garretson. Rahal elaborates on his experiences driving the 935 Porsche, his challenges at Le Mans with the March GTP car, and the influences it had on his career. The conversation concludes with insights into Rahal’s ongoing passion for motorsport and aspirations to return to Le Mans as a team owner.

  • What initially drew you to compete at Le Mans, and how did that opportunity come about in the context of your open-wheel career?
  • First impressions are everything – Was Le Mans the first time you’d raced in Europe? How did you prepare for Le Mans?
  • Were there any cultural or technical differences between American and European racing that you noticed during your time at Le Mans?
  • What was it like sharing a Porsche 935 with Bob Garettson and Alan Moffat  during the 1980 race?
  • How did your approach to racing at Le Mans differ from your strategy in IndyCar, particularly in terms of endurance and team dynamics?
  • Let’s talk a little bit more about the 1982 race. Porsche by this point had stopped producing the 935s and had moved on to cars like the 956 and later the 962. Why did Bob (Garettson) decide to move to a March Group C car instead of sticking with another Porsche?
  • What stands out to you most when you look back at your time driving the Porsche or the March in the world’s most famous endurance race?
  • How did racing at Le Mans influence your perspective on motorsport as a whole, or affect your approach once you returned to open-wheel competition?
  • What lessons or memories from Le Mans have stayed with you the most throughout your career in and out of the car?

Takeaway: Bobby Rahal’s Le Mans chapter may not have ended with trophies, but it enriched his legacy as a driver who embraced every challenge. His journey reminds us that motorsport’s greatest stories aren’t only about victories – they’re about the pursuit, the passion, and the people who make racing unforgettable.

Transcript

Crew Chief Brad: [00:00:00] Evening With a Legend is a series of presentations exclusive to legends of the famous 24 hours of Le Mans giving us an opportunity to bring a piece of Le Mans to you. By sharing stories and highlights of the big event, you get a chance to become part of the Legend of Le Mans with guests from different eras of over 100 years of racing.

Crew Chief Eric: Tonight we have an opportunity to bring a piece of Le Mans to you sharing in the Legend of Le Mans with guests from different eras of over 100 years of racing. And as your host, I’m delighted to introduce Bobby Rahal, best known for his accomplishments in IndyCar. He also made notable appearances at the 24 hours of Le Mans during the 1980s.

Though endurance racing was not the primary focus of his career, Bobby showcased his versatility by competing in [00:01:00] the iconic event multiple times, driving for teams like Porsche and March. Despite setbacks preventing a top finish, Rahal’s participation highlighted his adaptability and competitiveness on the world’s stage and his involvement in Le Mans reflects the broader scope of his racing legacy.

Bridging American open wheel success with international endurance prestige. With that, I’m your host crew chief Erick from the Motoring Podcast Network, welcoming everyone to this evening with a legend. So Bobby, welcome to the show.

Bobby Rahal: Well, thank you. Nice to be with you.

Crew Chief Eric: Everybody’s got a superhero origin story, so let’s focus in on the part of your career that surrounds Le Mans.

What initially drew you to compete at the 24, and how did that opportunity come about?

Bobby Rahal: Some people who’ve known me for a long time would know that the early parts of my career were spent in sports car racing. That’s where I started. Specifically with SCCA, but you know, my father raced at Sebring in Watkins Glen from 1969 to 1971.

So we participated in the 12 [00:02:00] hour and the six hour races. I grew up around sports, car racing primarily. I mean, yes, open wheel racing was what I, I wanted to do, but at the time as a kid, I was involved with his racing. I went where he went, so, so, um, in any event, racing in those years. I got the chance to watch the greats at Sebring Watkins Glen, and got to know my well later on.

Got to know, but got to see my friend Brian Redmond, you know, raced the nine 17 Porsches. Of course, Joe Sifford, Peter Rodriguez, you know, all the great drivers that drove for Porsche. And then of course, you know, the Ferrari drivers Alfa Romeo. I mean, it was an amazing period of time. And so that really motivated me to a large degree.

So really before I got to IndyCar racing, you know, I’d won Daytona 24 hour. I had raced at Le Mans. So racing sports cars. Was really, uh, something that was a, frankly a, a goal of mine. And to race at a place like Le Mans was a goal of mine. And I was fortunately, although not [00:03:00] successfully, but fortunately, I was able to participate in

Crew Chief Eric: your road to Le Mans also involves the partnership and friendship that you grew with Bob Garretson.

Bobby Rahal: Yes.

Crew Chief Eric: How did that come about and how did he help get you to Le Mans in your first attempt with the 9 35?

Bobby Rahal: Yeah, well maybe go back a little bit in, in 78. I was racing mainly Formula Atlantic in the United States. I raced in New Zealand at January of 78. Came back. That’s when I was introduced to Walter Wolf, who owned the Wolf Formula One team, which Jody Sector drove for and after.

After the race at Long Beach in 78, Walter, he came to me and said, Hey, I want you to drive our Formula Three car. That was based at Dallara, the Dallara that we know of today. It was based at his small, small factory in Ano Italy. And with the idea that I would race certain Formula Three races in 78 with the idea of racing Formula One races at the end of that year, which I did.

I moved to Italy, lived over there for about six months or so, began my [00:04:00] relationship with this wonderful man named Dr. Del in GaN Lau. Great guy. Wonderful. Drove his first Formula three car ever. Of course, later on he would design and build cars that would really dominate Formula Three. And frankly, now, I don’t know, a series in the world that doesn’t rely on Dallara to a certain degree for providing automobiles to go to race with.

But in any event, at the end of 78, I did the US Grand Prix, Canadian Grand Prix. You know, the hope was I was going to drive for Wolf in 1979. They decided not to run a second car, which meant that I was on the outside looking in. Of course, I, I then went to drive Formula two in 1979 for the Chevron factory.

Great experience. Loved racing in Europe. I mean, I really loved racing. For me, even from the days I watched the movie Grand Prix, which had such a huge effect on my life to the idea of racing in Europe was, to me, that was like, that was, that was the goal. And, and of course I had heroes like Dan Gurney, who had done that for years and been very successful, you know, and Phil Hill, you know, many others.

[00:05:00] So, seven nine drove Formula two. Uh, halfway through the year I was hired by a fund named Herb Kaplan to replace George Fulmer and his Canam car. Did that. We were pretty successful in that car, but really my goal was still to race in Europe, you know, hopefully get back to Formula One. That, as I said, didn’t transpire, but at the end of 79, I went to Daytona for the last EMSA race.

And I went there purely to meet people. ’cause I didn’t really know, even though, you know, I’d come from kind of a sports car background. I didn’t really know many of the people involved in sports car racing. Uh, in those days it was John Paul Sr. It was the Whittingtons. You had, of course the Garson team, Dick Barber, you know, in the 9 3 5.

Porsche of course was really the car to have at the time. So I went to Daytona purely to just introduce myself to everybody, which I did. To be honest with you, I can’t really recall the meeting I had with Bob Garson, but the next thing you know, I’m in Mountain View, California, which is where Garson Racing was based.

And uh, we’re there and here’s this really [00:06:00] awesome 9 3 5 Porsche with Apple computer all over it. And, uh, they hired me. It was, I think about six races. In fact, I think we only did six with that car. John Fitzpatrick was the primary driver for Garson, for Dick Barber racing Garson Enterprises, and he had the sax 9, 3 5.

He won the championship in, in 1980, I believe, with that car. In fact, the car, that Apple car really was an amazingly successful car. It won Sebring as a 9 34. It won Sebring. I don’t think we ever won Sebring with that car as a 9 35, but of course we won at Daytona with it in 81. And then maybe even more famously, in 19 79, 78, I think it was Paul Newman finished second in the same car at Le Mans, currently owned by um, Adam Corolla, who has it restored in the colors that Paul Newman drove in, but an amazingly successful car.

So in any event, I’m trying to think. The first race we did with that car, I believe was Sebring. We did Riverside, a six hour Riverside race, did Sears Point, [00:07:00] Watkins Glen. I was on pole at the Watkins Glen six hour race ahead of the works. Lance is, and you name it. Everybody in the world was there at uh, most part we raced it and I’m not quite sure, I can’t remember the la the other race.

But in any event, I just got this opportunity through Garson, through Bob and probably Dick Barber. I would assume it to some level. It was a great experience and I loved driving the car. And of course then a year after that we go to Daytona with Bob and Brian Redmond and win the 24 hour. So, you know, had a lot of success with that single car.

Crew Chief Eric: You already had a bunch of experience driving in Europe.

Bobby Rahal: Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: But Le Mans was still one of the crown jewels. Yeah. You on your bucket list you wanted to race at and then you finally get there in 1980. Yep. Did it live up to your expectations?

Bobby Rahal: It, it was such, such an amazing. Event. You know, Le Mans it like they say, they say the three biggest races are Le Mans, Indy 500 and Monaco Grand Prix, and I think that’s so right.

Because the environment is just so unique and so amazing and so electrifying that with all due [00:08:00] respect to all the other races around the world. You go to Le Mans in India, or Mon Monaco and I, I’ve raced at Monaco in the Formula three series with Dallara. You know, these are bigger than life, these events, and certainly Le Mans was no different.

I mean, I’ve watched the Steve McQueen movie. When I was a teenager, 17 years old or whatever. Again, for me, because I wanted to race in Europe, to go to Le Mans was just a dream come true, and it didn’t let me down in any respect at all. I mean, it was an amazing circuit. Of course, it still at that time had the original moles on straight, all three miles or so of it.

It didn’t have the original part that was like White House corner and, and things like that, but it was still pretty much the original Le Mans. It had the Dunlop curve, which was a fantastic coming up the front straightaway and we go underneath the Dunlop Bridge fast corner, very high risk corner, especially when it was raining.

But yeah, you know, I, I really ticked that, you know, that little box on your bucket list or whatever to race at Le Mans, even though we ended up not finishing the race that year, we had been competitive [00:09:00] and, and so disappointing not to finish, but so satisfying just to have been there.

Crew Chief Eric: So, a lot of other legends that have been on the show and, and are within your era.

Mm-hmm. There’s like a 20 year span there. Talk about preparing for Le Mans, how difficult it was compared to today, where you have, every simulator has a version of Le Mans that you could race and try. How did you prepare for Le Mans? Did somebody give you notes or pointers or did you just figure it out on your first out lab?

Bobby Rahal: No, you know, in my day, as you say, you didn’t have simulators. I don’t remember people taking much in the way of notes about anything. I mean, it’s not like today. No, it was on the job training. You would, uh, go out and do practice regardless of what track you were coming to, especially if it was for the first time.

Your ability to be competitive was based on your ability to really learn the circuit quickly and to just have that ability to take it all in as quickly as possible and then take advantage of it. And of course, every session you drove, every time you went out, you were just building up that knowledge of the circuit.

And that even held true [00:10:00] during the race, during each stint that you drove. You know, there was just something else you would learn and you get better at it. So no, there was, there was no racing. There was no Jim Russell, there was no, uh, again, no, as you say, no simulator. No. It was just up to you and the team.

And Yes. If you had, for example, I mean, I was so lucky to have to drive with Brian Reman on a number of occasions. Because Brian would kind of fill you in, Hey, you gotta look for this, look for that. But I would also tell you that most drivers, they didn’t share that much. It was, it’s up to you kid to learn.

And so you took advantage of every second you had on the track. And again, tried to learn everything you could every time you were in that car and, and that’s just kind of the way that was the way it was.

Crew Chief Eric: So let’s dig into the 1980 race just a little bit more. Mm-hmm. You touched on some of the highlights.

As a private tier team, Garson Enterprises. Right. This wasn’t a Porsche backed team. You guys were on your own. Right. You know, small operation. What was it like strategy wise compared to what you were used to coming from IndyCar, coming from other racing? How did you have to adapt? Challenges you had to overcome?

Bobby Rahal: [00:11:00] Well, remember again, I hadn’t been in IndyCar until 82, so when I went in 80, you know, my experience was mainly Formula Atlantic, a year of Formula three, year of Formula Two and two Formula One races. But Garson Enterprises was just a phenomenal organization, and yet it was really based on, yes, there were a couple professional people within that organization.

Jerry Woods was pretty much dedicated to building the engines, and he was a great engine builder is a great engine builder, and of course Bob Garson, you know, he had been to Le Mans a couple times prior to my being there. He was a very studious guy, amateur, but very good driver and really kinda led the team not just on track, but off track and by example.

Bob was a wonderful man who just passed away about three, four months ago. But that team was made up for the most part of weekend Warriors, and these guys and ladies were so dedicated to this. Even today, there’s guys like Marty Roff. He, he was an IBM guy. In fact, I think he just retired from [00:12:00] IBM. Only a year or two ago he spent, he’s, like I told you, he always kidded him.

He was the, the longest remaining employee of IBM. But these guys was just not Martin or Marty as we call him. You know his brother Mark and still is involved with him. So for many years, and Mark was involved a certain degree, but there was just a bunch of other people that were. Involved yet, you know, but very knowledgeable, very dedicated.

These were amateur, these were weekend warriors that dedicated themselves to Garrisson Enterprises. I mean, they loved the racing. You know, they traveled all over the place and I mean, it was a phenomenal team that I would put up against any pro team anytime. I mean, that was just the nature. The quality of the people that were involved, some of whom are no longer with us, but the quality of the people, dedication and the knowledge.

I mean, it just, it was amazing, which is what attributed to their success as a, as an organization and how they could beat very professional teams that came outta Europe. I mean, Garrett’s an enterprises, they were as good as it got, regardless of who we were up against. And so, [00:13:00] uh. You know when you went to places like Le Mans and in fact John Fitzpatrick that year with the 9 3 5 with that team was very successful across the board.

I mean, when I drove there in 1980, it was raining at the start of the race. It rained for a lot of the race. I remember going at night, now we get to night and the road, you know, it was convoluted. The straightaway, there’s dips and there’s, you name it, and so you’re going down there, you’re thinking, is that a puddle or is that just a shadow?

And you’re going 200 miles an hour, and if you hit a puddle at 200 miles an hour and you’re not really prepared for it, that might have bad consequences. I mean, it was a super challenge in the race. Fitzpatrick and I were running together. I think he was maybe a lap ahead of us at the time, but anyway, right.

It was. Dry at this point, and I was right up underneath his rear wing. The headlights on my car are like bleaching out all the sign writing on his car. They’re so bright, but in the back of his car is literally on fire in the sense that, you know, the exhaust system’s glowing red, the turbos are glowing red.

There’s fire coming outta the turbos and outta the wastegate exhaust, and it was just the most [00:14:00] amazing site. You’re in the middle of the night, so it’s black all around this. Cars all lit up like a Christmas tree. I wish John had a camera. I wish I could have taken a shot ’cause it, it would’ve just been an awesome picture.

John was a tremendous driver, is a tremendous driver. But that team really is what empowered him to have the success he had. And I think he would agree with me on that. I had the benefit of the same people, so. It was a bunch of weekend warriors, but these guys were pretty damn good at what they did, and they could go out and compete against anybody.

Crew Chief Eric: So let’s talk about the 9 35. We had Rick Nup on, yeah. Last year. Who raced Kremmer nine 30 fives. Mm-hmm. Later evolution of the same car you drove, or similar car that you drove. Everybody that’s talked about 9 35 say how unruly they are. They’re just beasts that you got a manhandle for Rick, it sort of suited his driving style, but for you it was at its early stages of development.

What did you think of driving the 9 35?

Bobby Rahal: Well, you know, in 1979 I won a a sports car race with Brian Redman in MidOhio, and a Canadian driver named Vic Heim, who was one of the [00:15:00] real star of Canadian racing. He had a 9 3 5, but it was a single turbo, 9 35. I drove the car and practiced at MidOhio and I thought, oh my God, I don’t know how you drive something like this.

’cause the throttle leg in the car was so bad. One of those, you put your foot down and you count to like five, and then all of a sudden the power comes in. I elected not to drive that car That weekend. Drove with Brian. We won the race two liter sports car, but by 1980 now, they’d all gone to twin turbos and that changed that card dramatically because it now it had response.

The 9 3 5 did several things very well. One. It went like a bat outta hell. You know, it had a lot of power. Two, the brakes were pretty good on it. All of that was mitigated by the fact that it was a basically a nine 11 chassis. I mean, we had a adjustable front roll bar on the car, and I swore that I could move the roll bar wherever I wanted to, and there’d be no difference.

There was probably that much flex in the chassis. I mean, remember it had an aluminum tube roll cage, which you look back now and you think. Good thing. I never had an accident in that [00:16:00] car. ’cause I can’t imagine a aluminum tube roll cage would do much. But the car was a flexi flyer. I mean, it is one of those deals that when you really drove the car, I mean you could drive it with some oversteer in it.

Some of that was induced by power, but some of it was by tuning the car a bit. Was it the best handling car I’ve ever driven? No, but you know, at the time it was the most competitive car and so you wanted to be in a 9 3 5 Porsche. Great story was in, I think it was 1980. In fact, we’re at El Car Lake and I’m in the car and John Fitzpatrick’s in the um, Sox car.

We’re practicing and he’s like, three seconds, four seconds faster than me. And I’m just like, there’s no way. ’cause I’m driving the wheels off it and there’s no way he’s four seconds quicker than me. And I, you know, I was told, oh, you can only go to 1.2 bar barometric pressure on the boost. Well, as you know, Elkhart Lake has three very long straightaways amongst other things, and I think it was before qualifying or, or right after.

But one of the mechanics came up to me and said, you know, John’s using 1.4 bar. Oh really? Yeah. [00:17:00] Yeah. He’s using 1.4. Hmm. Okay. That’s good to know. Thank you for that. So I went out and, uh, in qualifying and of course you could raise the, there’s a, I wanna say a little wheelhouse or whatever. You’d adjust the boost by down by the gear shift.

So what the heck? I’m gonna see what this does. And I didn’t beat John, but I got within a 10th or something of ’em. ’cause now when you go 1.4 bar, now you’re going a lot faster down the strai at one than you are at 1.2 and you’re coming off the corners a lot harder. At 1.4 engine power was. Almost everything in that thing.

So it was the best car to drive at the time. Uh, was it the best car period? No, but it was a great car and uh, we had lots of success in the car and if you treated it right, careful with the gearbox as we did at Daytona in 81, didn’t get greedy with it. I mean, you could have great races in it, as we did at Daytona 81, and it was really a, at the time, just the car to have.

Crew Chief Eric: So let’s switch gears and talk about your second attempt at Le Mans 1982. Let’s

Bobby Rahal: not.

Crew Chief Eric: Porsche at this point had really stopped [00:18:00] producing the 9 35. Right. Although they were continued in private tier entries for a couple more years. Right. They were focusing their attention on the 9 56 and then subsequently the 9 62 after that.

Yeah. However, there was a big shift, especially at Garson Enterprises to move to a March group C car instead of sticking with Porsche and maybe doing a 9 56. Why was that decision made? Do you have any inside baseball on that?

Bobby Rahal: Well first, and you might remember this, that in 81 I drove with Jim Perro Moretti in the Yost.

It was a Moby Dick car. Basically. It wasn’t a factory car, but Yost had built his own version of the Moby Dick right hand drive, which, you know, all the nine three fives were left hand drive ’cause they’re based on a stock nine 11 chassis. But this one was right hand drive. Of course, on road courses, most of those road courses go clockwise.

So you wanna be on the, you know, on the inside of the corners. It was a left hand shift that took a little getting used to. But in terms of pure, probably speed, that was a very, very quick 9, 3, 5. We [00:19:00] didn’t have a lot of success with it. I think we finished second in mid Ohio with it and, and what have you, but it was an amazing car, so that was a thrill.

But, so in 1981, it was clear that the 9 3 5 was pretty much at the end of its line. Lola had come out with a T 600 that Brian drove to a championship win in in IMSA in 81. And that was powered by a six liter Chevy, a normally aspirated stock block. Very strong car. Especially compared to the nine three fives or anything else that was out at the time.

So Garson, Dick Barber, I think everybody was of the view. Why don’t we combine the best of English designers, IE Lola. And with the best of what Germany could provide, which was 9 3 5 engines and gearboxes, they decided we would go to Le Mans with a Lola T 600 powered by a 9 3 5 engine 9 3 5 gearbox. You know, sadly, or whatever.

It’s like anything that just wasn’t given enough time, perhaps not enough resource. But I remember flying, gonna go to Le Mans. I was on my way to Europe to prepare for Le Mans, and they said, come [00:20:00] to Sears Point. And they called it in those days, and now it’s Sonoma.

David Lowe: Mm-hmm.

Bobby Rahal: And they said, come to Sears because we, we wanna do a test with the car before we put it on the airplane to go to Paris.

So, okay, so I fly to San Francisco, drive up to Sears Point, get there and nobody’s there. I’m there, but nobody else is there and I’m waiting, waiting. No transporter, no car, no nothing. Finally at like, I think it was two or three in the afternoon, I’d been there probably six, seven hours at the time. I called ’em up and I said, Hey, what’s going on?

Are we, does this test happen? He said, no. No, we’re not gonna be able to do the test. So I drove to the San Francisco airport and flew over to to Europe. Well, you don’t go to the Le Mans 24 hour with a car that’s never turned a wheel prior to getting there. And that was the case with this car. If you looked at it, you say, oh, this thing, nobody stands a chance.

But it had not turned a wheel, and it’s, of course, now Brian Redmond and I are gonna drive the car. We get to Le Mans, everything’s by all rights, looks like it should, you know, just dominate. Over the couple days, we couldn’t [00:21:00] build up any boost pressure in the car. The intercos leaked and God knows what all else.

And again, it never turned a wheel. Frankly, we couldn’t qualify the car because it wasn’t fast, ’cause it just didn’t generate the power and it wasn’t fast enough. I think probably in the end that probably was a good thing because if it had been running like a 9, 3, 5 engine car should run, it might have killed one of us.

’cause frankly, you know, we’d have gone very, very fast. But very disappointing for everybody, I think. And, and the team had busted their butts working late nights. Again, remember this is semipro team. People working on the car also have jobs during the day, not just working on that. And these people were working all night long and.

It was an experience that everybody looks back now and truly understands why it wasn’t able to perform. You know, very sad. Could have been so good yet it was kind of so bad and in the end we didn’t qualify and went home with our tails between our legs.

Crew Chief Eric: So that was 81.

Bobby Rahal: That was 81

Crew Chief Eric: and 82.

Bobby Rahal: 82. Again, it’s clear that the GTP category is the category.

It was in SA, I mean, we, we [00:22:00] had a March 82, March, GTP cars to drive at Daytona. I said pole position, lap record with the car. Amazingly, we had a great engine, a guy named Franz Weiss. Franz was Jim Hall’s engine builder at Chaparral. He built my engines in IndyCar, Mario Andretti’s engines in IndyCar. I mean Franz Weiss and his company was, and especially stock blocks Can-Am stuff like that.

If not the best, I’m not sure who had been better. Just produced great product. So we’re at Daytona again, six liter Chevy V eight, normally aspirated. And I, I was on pole. I mean, I remember driving past, I think it was Fitzpatrick on the banking. You know, you think the nine 30 five’s fast in a stray line.

But this march with this engine, and of course it was a much smaller frontal area compared to a 9 35, of course, it had instant response with the stock block Chevy, again, set it on pole and amazingly we were like running, I think third overall or so with maybe an hour and a half, two hours at most to go.

And finally the gearbox gave up the ghost. But the fact that it was that [00:23:00] strong in the right, in the 24 hour and was fairly reliable, that caused us to all think a lot about what do you do at Le Mans? You know, we went to Sebring a month and a half later. So again, I set pole position, lap record. That still exists today on the 5.2 mile circuit.

The gearbox was kind of the Achilles heel to the car, but we lost two of the four gears. I think we only had second and fourth. Even with that, and of course a testament to Franz Weiss’s engines. ’cause I go down the back straight at Sebring and it’s like pegged at 8,000 RPMs or whatever. I mean, it, it is just, there was no fifth gear to go to and ’cause it was gone.

And yet, I mean the thing ran and ran. We finished second to John Paul’s 9 3 5 by, I think it was 18 seconds maybe, or eight seconds, something like that. You know, and sea ring was just so tough in those days, physically on the car. So. In any event, his car showed that it could be competitive with anything out there, so we went to Le Mans with it that year.

Crew Chief Eric: At this point, you’re also running Indy cars, right? So when you compare a group C prototype with Downforce and everything else, that’s different than the Indy car, what were they like when you compare and control? Were they similar to [00:24:00] drive or were they horses of a different car? Well, the

Bobby Rahal: Indy cars were faster, even 82.

I mean, they had a lot of power, a lot of downforce lighter. Those cars still had a fair amount of throttle lag. The Indy cars did single turbo. You know, and of course, you know, on a road course, they were considerably faster than anything out there. The Indy car was just a faster race car than IMSA or GTP.

But GTP cars were still great cars to drive. You know, as I tell people, I think the thing that always impressed me when I first started driving Indy cars in 82 was that the car never stopped accelerating no matter how long the straightaway was. Whereas in a sports car, a 9, 3 5 or a March or whatever.

You know, you go to Moison at Lemo, for example, and it basically stopped about halfway down the street, you know, accelerating, just kind of sat there, but, you know, different cars. It’s just the reality. But yeah, the, the March again, you’re talking about a car built by March Engineering. Much more sophisticated than the nine three fives, the chassis design, the componentry, you know, the 9 3 5, in many respects was still a, a [00:25:00] well-developed nine 11, whereas a march was a pure racing car.

And so consequently the performance of the two were different. But in the end, especially in endurance racing, the the nine, the Porsches, the nine three fives had, you know, years of experience, they had reliability. The engines were super reliable. Gearbox was, as long as you were good to them, super reliable brakes were good.

But that’s what made the difference. Whereas the march was really a car that was meant to go at most six hours and to ask it to do more was probably asking too much.

Crew Chief Eric: For those that don’t know how 1982 ended, is that how it ends for the March story at Le Mans?

Bobby Rahal: Well, you know, we split a fuel tank at Le Mans.

Disappointing. Yeah, we got there. We had run outta money. We no longer had Franz license engines. And of course the mul on Straits A along straightaway, if you don’t have any power, you know, we went there and we just didn’t have any grunt. The engine manufacturer we had who will go unnamed, the engines just weren’t good enough.

You know, arrow wise, maybe the march carried a little too much drag in it compared to the Porsches, which you [00:26:00] didn’t really necessarily see a place like Daytona or Sebring, but you’d see it at Le Mans. In any event, you know, we qualified, but not that well. And of course, in the race, the fuel tank split after about three hours and.

That was, that we were done. We, we did run the car, uh, numerous SA races following Le Mans. You know, one of the things we found after Le Mans, which was that Seabring had basically destroyed the chassis. You know, the rivets had in the cock had been loosened up or fell out, or, I mean, the car was not prepared well, again, financially, it wasn’t garson, it was the sponsor of the team.

Ran outta money, and so the maintenance of the car suffered as a result. And of course the different engine builder, all these things contributed to not really having a competitive proposition at Le Mans 82. Of course, then again, the fuel tank splits and very disappointing. I’m not sure we would’ve been as competitive as say we were at Daytona Sebring.

We should have been more competitive than we were in. In any event, we went back to the states, ran a few more races again, with not very good engines, [00:27:00] again, suffered the consequence of that. So the glory races for that car for us at least, was Daytona and Sebring. Now the next year with creepy crawley, they’re the ones that put a 9 3 5 gearbox boxing engine in a march and dominated Daytona and won a lot of races.

And then of course, later on in 84, now I’m driving Bruce Levins 9 6 2 Porsche, one of the first ones. We’re racing against Randall Lanier in the Whittingtons in a march Chevy, and that car had been fully developed and that was the car to have. So the, the March chassis was the right chassis. It’s just we didn’t have the resource to really run it properly and we suffered as a result.

Crew Chief Eric: Did your Le Mans’s journey stop in 82 because of your rise in IndyCar, or were there other attempts to go back to Le Mans over the years?

Bobby Rahal: Oh, well, for the most part, yes, because of IndyCar. The Portland IndyCar race used to always be on the same weekend or thereabouts as Le Mans in June. One of my great what ifs with my great friend, Jochen Moss, who he and I won Sibr together in 87 with the 9 [00:28:00] 6 2, is that he asked me to drive with him and in the Saber, the Mercedes and I think it was 1989, you know, ’cause we had obviously won Sebring together.

We became friends, you know, good co-drivers together, good relationship. I had to say no. And of course that’s the year he won Le Mans, or one of the years he won Le Mans with the Mercedes powered sober. As you can imagine what ifs, right? The thing that kind of disappoints me in myself is that when I started to focus more just on IndyCar racing, I think probably around 19 90, 91, that was a mistake.

Having had the success, I’d had an IndyCar, I’D won the 500. By that time, I’d won a couple championships. I had won Sebring in 87, a number of other SA races in 87. And I don’t know why, but I thought, uh, I just, I’m, I don’t wanna travel that much or something. And I decided not to, to get out of sports car racing.

And I really think I lost opportunities that could have perhaps enabled me to win Le Mans because I really think that would’ve been great to say, you know, you want indie, you, you want Le Mans. [00:29:00] Never won Formula One World Championship. But, you know, those are two pretty good championships to win. In any event, I, I look back and I think, you know, I shouldn’t have done that because as I say, I think I had, I would’ve had opportunities, but it is what it is, you know?

Now for me it’s really about, you know, I want RLL Raul Letterman Lanigan racing to go to Le Mans. Well, I may not be able to win it as a driver. I can win it as a team owner, and that’s certainly something that I’ve been disappointed over the last several years with BMW. We weren’t asked to do that. But you know, maybe one of these days we can go there as a team and, and win the race.

That won’t maybe be quite the same as winning as a driver, but it’ll be pretty nice.

Crew Chief Eric: Since we’re talking about lessons learned, one of the things that a lot of the pro drivers that we have on the show talk about is how Le Mans’s. Profoundly changed them as a driver and the things that they took away, the memories obviously, that they created that enthusiasm.

They reached their bucket list. Yeah, there’s a whole new experience. How did Le Mans change you? What did you learn from it? Lessons, memories that you took back with you to IndyCar [00:30:00] maybe made you a better driver?

Bobby Rahal: Well, I think that. Yeah, Le Mans, especially in the, with the 9, 3, 5, you know, remember it didn’t have a rev limiter.

I mean, it was a synchronous transmission. It wasn’t straight cut gears. It wasn’t like today where the gearings electronically or hydraulically motivated, or, I mean, it was a conventional gear box. It was conventional brakes, and Brian Redmond was really a great teacher for me about this. Is that, you know, this is how you have to drive the car in order to get it to the end of the race, whether it’s Daytona, Sebring, Le Mans, whatever.

And it really did teach me how to get the maximum out of the car. Having minimum, I don’t wanna say consequence, but you know, get the most feet outta the car at the least price to the car. In other words, taking it easy on the brakes, careful on the gearbox, making sure when you make the shift that you’re in gear.

I mean, all these things because you didn’t have the protections that you have today. You know, I remember Redmond telling me that one year he and CFR were. Pretty much ready to win Le Mans maybe in two hours to go [00:31:00] and sit. Missed a gear shift on the front, straight over rev the engine in the nine 17 and it blew up.

And that was that. You know, that was the same with the 9 3 5. I mean, you had to be sure of everything you did and you had to be careful everything you did and you had to drive it carefully as you could go and yet as quick bay as you could go. And that later on with Indy cars and everything else, I drove 9 6 2, whatever that later on was, gave me great experience, great lessons to learn from.

It gave me the success that I had in later years.

Crew Chief Eric: Alright, Bobby, so before we transition into our last segment here, wrapping up this episode, there’s a couple crowd questions for you. Sure. So first off, Ron Meyer writes, can you please ask him about the Otter Pops sponsor?

Bobby Rahal: Well that was IndyCar. Yeah. Paul Pope owned a company called Otter Pops, that’s frozen popsicles, right.

He regrettably passed away a few years ago, but just a great guy. Had a great time with him and he got hooked up with Maury Cranes who owned Kraco, who was the owner of the Kraco team. I went to drive for Kraco in 89. Otter Pops was [00:32:00] one of the associate sponsors. Yeah, we were very popular in the paddock area ’cause we had all the Otter pop bars for everybody.

But yeah, I guess one of the best things about racing over the years for me is uh, and I tell people this, is that you meet really fabulous people. Some aren’t so fabulous, but frankly, most are. And Paul was certainly one of those. Maury Cranes was certainly one of those, and I was fortunate to count them as friends and fortunate to drive for them, and fortunate to have a lot of experiences with ’em.

Crew Chief Eric: Bob Varsha,

Bobby Rahal: oh boy.

Crew Chief Eric: The Bob Varsha wants to know, what advice would you give your son Graham about continuing his driving career when everything else is going so well? And do you see yourself running a Le Mans’s Classic with him?

Bobby Rahal: So first off, in 2005, Graham was running, what do they call it? Uh, Mazda Super Mazda or something like that.

He finished second in Montreal for the Montreal Race Grand Prix. And we got on a plane. I said, we’re gonna go to Le Mans. I really was pushing him to say, one of these days, you’ve gotta go run Le Mans, you gotta do it. So I took him [00:33:00] over there now in 2005. So in oh five he was 16 years old. So we flew over and we didn’t stay for the race, but we flew around and we walked around the track basically, you know, we’re hacking through the bush.

I said, I want you to go down, we’re gonna go down to this place called Re, which is halfway down the Mulsanne Strait, right. And there’s a bar on one side restaurant and, and I said, I want you to go down, we’re gonna go down there. And we got through the bush. Watched the cars go by at 200 miles an hour. Then we went back to the paddock, went up in the Ferris wheel.

Very kind of emotional kind of thing, you know, that all of these sensations that I had experienced over my years that I wanted him to get a feel for and appreciation of, and got up in the Ferris wheel there right by the last chicane and. At night practice. And you know, as I’ve always told him, and I still tell him, I said he’s still a young guy.

He is 36 years old, so he’s got plenty of time if he wants to go there. But there race and Le Mans. What a great experience it was for me. I hope he does it one day. ’cause I think he’ll feel the same way as far as the, uh, Le Mans Classic. I’ve done that twice. Brian Redmond, I, I had a nine 17 Porsche in [00:34:00] 2002. The first Le Mans Classic.

He and I drove that car there. I thought, who better than to get Brian Redmond to co drive with you at, you know, in a nine 17 Porsche. We had mechanical issues, so we didn’t finish, but still a great experience. And later then I went and raced in a three liter Lola prototype. Three or four years later, I’m, I’m done racing, you know, my day’s over and I don’t think Graham’s ready to, I think he always thought I was crazy doing these races with these old race cars.

’cause there’s certainly no safer today than they were in the day, which wasn’t very safe. Right. So. I doubt I can get him into one, but yeah, that, that’s a great event. You know, Le Mans’s a great event. Le Mans classic’s a great event, especially if you love the old historic cars and, and you see many of them.

And, and I was very fortunate. I drove a Fellow’s two 50 LM Ferrari one time there at the Le Mans Classic. The Lola T 2 86 was a three liter DFE Cosworth powered car. Of course the nine 17 and others. So, I mean, Le Mans is Le Mans, it doesn’t matter what’s driving on the track, it’s a hell of an event and a hell of an experience.

Crew Chief Eric: So since you brought up classic, that would’ve been [00:35:00] the new track format because yes, it started way after the redesign. When you compare driving Le Mansn now, let’s say in a classic event compared to then, what do you think of the evolution of the track?

Bobby Rahal: Well, you know, I’m a traditionalist in a lot of ways.

I can understand maybe one of the chicanes, um, za, I’m not sure about two, but I can understand that. I mean, I was fortunate and I feel fortunate to say to people today, oh yeah, no, I drove the real moan, rait. There is no question that the risk factor was high, no question about it. Maybe I feel less concerned about it because nothing ever happened to me on that part of the track, but for sure a lot of risk.

I’m glad we, I experienced that, so I understand why they made the chicanes that Le Mans, but frankly, I think they caused more incidents than they had before. The most disappointing change for me at Le Mans today compared to when I drove is the Dunlop Curve coming up, the front strait, going up the hill underneath the Dunlop Bridge.

It was a, a fast bend that then led down to that left [00:36:00] hand corner. I can’t remember the name of it. I’m not, I’m gonna say Tet Rouge, but I don’t think it is. And that was an amazing corner, you know, fast and yet, you know, really attest, you know, not horribly risky, I would say, but still, just some really great corner and a great sight on the track arcing over the the hill.

And turning right slightly. And that’s gone. And what they’ve got now is, you know, I’m not a big fan of it, but the rest of the track is really not a whole lot different than when I drove it. In fact, when I drove my nine 17 there, you know when you went and came through Mulsanne Corner and went towards Indianapolis, that’s pretty much the same as it was 1970 or 71.

And, and so when I told people, I said, when I went through there, you’re going there 200 miles an hour. And I went through, you know, there’s two kinks, right between Mulsanne and, and Indianapolis and the second one has a little bit more elevation to it. And you go through there, you don’t just squint too much to think it was 1970, it was really right out of the movie Le Mans there, you know, the rest of the track is not a whole lot different, but as I said, I kind of get Mulsanne.

But I really disappointed about the changes [00:37:00] they made at, at.

Crew Chief Eric: So, Bobby, earlier you talked about what ifs, a lot of thinking about what ifs. So what if we could transport Bobby Raha 1980 to 2025? What car would you jump in to run the 24 hours of Le Mans this year?

Bobby Rahal: I think you’d have to say it’s gotta be a Porsche.

You know, the odds are pretty good if you’re in a Porsche. My dad raced at Porsche Carrero six. We had an Elva Porsche, of course I drove the nine three fives, drove 9 6 2, which I did five races in 87 in Imon. I won three of ’em with the 9 6 2, and then I won two other races with 9 6 2. So I mean, it was an amazing car.

And I have the feeling that driving the current Porsche is not a whole lot different, which is why they win a lot of races. ’cause if there’s a company that understands endurance racing, it’s Porsche. If I’m gonna go back and if there’s a car, for sure, a manufacturer would be Porsche.

Crew Chief Eric: So looking back, how do you think your participation in Le Mans contributes to the broader story of your racing legacy?

Bobby Rahal: Well, I think there’s just the fact that I did it again, I wasn’t successful doing it, but you know, I, I was willing to [00:38:00] try just about anything to further my career. And for me, clearly because of my father’s experience racing at Seabring and Watkins Glen, my being there from a gopher to a weekend warrior mechanic, teenager, to seeing the racing, I mean, sports car racing was always very important to me.

Still is last 17 years or 18 years, for me, some of the best has been associated with BMW. In their sports car racing program. We’ve won Daytona twice, won sea ring a couple times, a lot of other races. I mean, I just love sports, car racing, you know, it’s like anything, I don’t think I made Le Mans in any way. I think it made me in in certain ways.

You know, it’s disappointing not to go back to be able to drive there or be a team owner there, at least for the moment, but clearly one of these days. And just being able to tell people my experience going down the mos on straight. Or my experience of going through Indianapolis or any, or the Dunlop Curve.

I mean that to me that I have an experience that few people have, and that’s something that I treasure and it’s something I think has value for people when they’re interested [00:39:00] in talking about great events like the Lamo 24 Hour,

Crew Chief Eric: what’s next? You kind of hinted at a couple things. What’s going on?

Bobby Rahal: Well, I mean, I’m hopeful.

Next is us as a team running at Lamo one of these days. That’s the big goal. Mean, obviously we still want to go win Indy again. We’ve won that three times as a team and for me once as an owner, so four victories at at Indy. Wanna do more of that? I mean, anything we enter, we want to win. But I would love to be able to go back to Le Mans as a team and competitively race against the other teams and.

You know, potentially win that race. Maybe I’d hang it up after that. I’m not sure. ’cause F FDA won India, Daytona and Le Mans. Kinda like, well what else is there? Right.

Crew Chief Eric: On that note, it’s time for me to pass the torch to our A-C-O-U-S-A President for some final thoughts. Bobby? Thank you so much.

David Lowe: It’s been an honor and a pleasure on behalf of the a CO, the A-C-O-U-S-A community.

Thank you. You’re so gracious with your time. Thank you.

Bobby Rahal: Thank you. Well, it’s great seeing you and you know, this is an important event for all of us, right? And, uh, I love talking about it. Wish I [00:40:00] could talk more about it. Wish I had more experience, but I love talking about it. And uh, as I say, one day maybe we’ll be back there.

Crew Chief Eric: We look forward to that.

Bobby Rahal: Thank you,

Crew Chief Eric: and that’s the finish line for this evening with a legend where we took a closer look at the endurance racing chapter of Bobby Ray Hall’s storied career known to most as an indie car legend and team owner Bobby’s Ventures into the 24 hours reveal, a driver eager to push boundaries and compete on the world’s biggest motorsport stage.

Bobby’s experiences behind the wheel and lessons learned in the grueling environment of Le Mans adds yet another layer to his already remarkable legacy. So to keep up with Bobby’s ongoing work in Motorsport, check out ray hall.com or follow Ray Hall Letterman Lannigan Racing on your favorite social media platforms.

And we hope you enjoyed this presentation and look forward to more evening with a legend throughout the season. And on behalf of everyone here and those listening at home, thank you Bobby, for sharing your stories with us.

Bobby Rahal: My pleasure and thank you so much for giving me the time to chat with everybody and with yourselves and, and it’s been a real pleasure.

Crew Chief Eric: And on a [00:41:00] personal note, it has been an absolute honor to interview you tonight. So thank you. Watching you growing up on tv, all those kinds of things. Absolutely amazing.

Bobby Rahal: Thank you. Take care.

Crew Chief Eric: This episode has been brought to you by the Automobile Club of the West and the A-C-O-U-S-A from the awe-inspiring speed demons that have graced the track to the courageous drivers who have pushed the limits of endurance. The 24 hours of Le Mans is an automotive spectacle like no other. For over a century the 24 hours Le Mans has urged manufacturers to innovate for the benefit of future motorists, and it’s a celebration of the relentless pursuit of speed and excellence in the world of motorsports.

To learn more about or to become a member of the ACO USA, look no further than www.Le Mansn.org, click on English in the upper right corner and then click on the a CO members tab for club offers. [00:42:00] Once you’ve become a member, you can follow all the action on the Facebook group, A-C-O-U-S-A Members Club, and become part of the Legend with Future Evening with the legend meetups.

This episode has been brought to you by Grand Touring Motorsports as part of our Motoring Podcast network. For more episodes like this, tune in each week for more exciting and educational content from organizations like The Exotic Car Marketplace, the Motoring Historian, break Fix, and many others. If you’d like to support Grand Touring Motorsport and the Motoring Podcast Network, sign up for one of our many sponsorship tiers at www.patreon.com/gt Motorsports.

Please note that the content, opinions and materials presented and expressed in this episode are those of its creator, and this episode has been published with their consent. If you have any inquiries about this program, please contact the creators of this episode via email or social media [00:43:00] as mentioned in the episode.

Highlights

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00 Bobby Rahal’s Early Racing Career
  • 02:58 First Experiences at Le Mans
  • 05:47 Racing with Garretson Enterprises
  • 07:32 Challenges and Triumphs at Le Mans
  • 14:29 Driving the Porsche 935
  • 17:54 Switching to the March Group C Car
  • 21:51 Daytona and Sebring Successes
  • 23:49 Comparing Indy Cars and GTP Prototypes
  • 25:30 Challenges and Disappointments at Le Mans
  • 27:34 Reflections on Racing and Missed Opportunities
  • 29:36 Lessons from Le Mans
  • 31:26 Crowd Questions and Personal Stories
  • 37:47 Final Thoughts and Future Aspirations

Bonus Content

There's more to this story!

Be sure to check out the behind the scenes for this episode, filled with extras, bloopers, and other great moments not found in the final version. Become a Break/Fix VIP today by joining our Patreon.

All of our BEHIND THE SCENES (BTS) Break/Fix episodes are raw and unedited, and expressly shared with the permission and consent of our guests.

Learn More

Evening With A Legend (EWAL)

We hope you enjoyed this presentation and look forward to more Evening With A Legend throughout this season. Sign up for the next EWAL TODAY!

Evening With A Legend is a series of presentations exclusive to Legends of the famous 24 Hours of Le Mans giving us an opportunity to bring a piece of Le Mans to you. By sharing stories and highlights of the big event, you get a chance to become part of the Legend of Le Mans with guests from different eras of over 100 years of racing.

The Porsche 935 was the car to have in endurance racing at the time – fast, powerful, and notoriously demanding. Rahal recalls its quirks vividly: the early single-turbo versions suffered from severe throttle lag, while later twin-turbo evolutions transformed the car into a more responsive, competitive machine. Despite its flex-prone chassis and aluminum roll cage, the 935 was a proven winner, and Rahal’s stints in the car included pole positions, victories at Daytona, and unforgettable battles at Watkins Glen and Riverside.

At Le Mans in 1980, Rahal joined Garretson Enterprises in a privateer effort. Racing through rain-soaked nights on the original Mulsanne Straight, he experienced firsthand the electrifying atmosphere that makes Le Mans one of the “big three” races alongside the Indy 500 and Monaco Grand Prix. Though mechanical issues prevented a finish, Rahal describes the event as a dream fulfilled – an essential milestone in his racing bucket list.

Rahal’s 1982 March 82G; Photo courtesy MECUM Auctions

By 1981–82, endurance racing was evolving. Porsche shifted focus to the 956, while privateer teams explored alternatives. Garretson Enterprises partnered with March Engineering, combining English chassis design with Porsche power. On paper, the March GTP prototype promised speed and sophistication. In practice, it was plagued by reliability issues—gearbox failures, leaking intercoolers, and even a split fuel tank at Le Mans 1982. Despite flashes of brilliance at Daytona and Sebring, the car never realized its full potential.

Rahal reflects on the challenges of racing a car that hadn’t turned a wheel before arriving at Le Mans. For a semi-professional team of “weekend warriors,” the effort was heroic, but the odds were stacked against them. Still, the experience highlighted the passion and dedication of Garretson’s crew, who competed fiercely against factory-backed giants.


Comparing Worlds: IndyCar vs. Le Mans

By 1982, Rahal was also racing IndyCars, offering him a unique perspective on the differences between American open-wheel machines and European endurance prototypes. IndyCars, lighter and more powerful, never stopped accelerating, while sports cars plateaued halfway down the Mulsanne. Yet both demanded precision, adaptability, and courage – qualities Rahal embodied throughout his career.

Though Rahal never claimed a podium at Le Mans, his participation remains a testament to his versatility. He bridged the gap between American open-wheel success and international endurance prestige, proving that true racers thrive wherever the challenge lies. His stories of rain-soaked straights, glowing turbochargers, and the camaraderie of dedicated privateer teams capture the essence of what makes Le Mans legendary.


ACO USA

To learn more about or to become a member of the ACO USA, look no further than www.lemans.org, Click on English in the upper right corner and then click on the ACO members tab for Club Offers. Once you become a Member you can follow all the action on the Facebook group ACOUSAMembersClub; and become part of the Legend with future Evening With A Legend meet ups.


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Liepert Motorsports Impressive Performance Despite Unfavorable BoP at Malaysia 12H

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Leipert Motorsport competed last weekend with a Lamborghini Huracán GT3 EVO2 in the 12H of Malaysia, part of the Creventic 24H Series, held at the Sepang International Circuit. In the GT3 category, the Proficar-backed team fielded an all-Swedish driver line-up. Led by former Formula 1 driver and Indy 500 winner Marcus Ericsson, the cockpit was shared with Hampus Ericsson, Thomas Karlsson, and Axel Bengtsson.

Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport

A particularly emotional highlight: For brothers Marcus and Hampus Ericsson, the 12H of Malaysia marked their first-ever race together — a meaningful moment for the entire team.

Intensive Preparation and Strong Qualifying

Thursday was fully dedicated to extensive track time, allowing the drivers to get to grips with the car and circuit. For three of the four drivers, it was their first time at Sepang — and a crucial day to practice key procedures such as driver changes and pit stops. The weekend also marked the GT3 race debut for all four drivers — and with the exception of Hampus, none had previously driven a GT3 car. Their progress was clearly visible and carried over seamlessly into Friday.

  • Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport
  • Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport
  • Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport
  • Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport
  • Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport

Qualifying further confirmed this upward trend. Hampus Ericsson set the third-fastest lap time, which was unfortunately deleted due to a track limits infringement. Based on the average time from all three qualifying sessions, the team secured eighth place on the grid.

Race Start Incident – Strong Comeback Over 12 Hours

Starting driver Marcus Ericsson delivered a very strong opening stint. However, after around 30 minutes, the team suffered an unexpected technical issue: a rear wing bracket broke, requiring an unscheduled pit stop and wing replacement. The stop cost the team valuable laps, initially dropping the Lamborghini to the back of the field. From that point on, the four drivers began a focused comeback. The Huracán ran flawlessly for the  remainder of the race, allowing the team to deliver a consistent and error-free

“For our driver line-up, this was a weekend full of firsts – which makes it all the more impressive how quickly they adapted and how professionally they approached the challenge,” said Managing Directors Marc Poos and Marcel Leipert. “It proved especially valuable to have such an experienced driver like Marcus Ericsson on board — not only for his performance on track, but also as a clear leader for the rest of the team. The BoP classification for this event, however, was unfortunate. Although an adjustment was made during the race weekend, it wasn’t enough to properly balance the car’s performance.”

Photo courtesy Liepert Motorsport

Nonetheless, the team was very satisfied with both the drivers and the overall performance. Leipert Motorsport will be back in action in just a few weeks: the next race is the 6H of Abu Dhabi on January 9–10, followed by the 24H of Dubai on January 17–18.


About Liepert Motorsport

Leipert Motorsport was founded in 2002 and became one of Europe’s top GT-Teams in Sprint- and Endurance-Racing. Spreading its GT-Engagement even wider across the continental borders, this step is the logical consequence for the German team after being a front runner and championship winning team in multiple competitions.

Carrying the Shelby Legacy Forward: A Conversation with Aaron Shelby

The Break/Fix Podcast has always been about capturing the living history of the automotive world – stories from racers, wrench-turners, designers, authors, and enthusiasts who’ve shaped car culture. In this episode, we welcomed Aaron Shelby, grandson of the legendary Carroll Shelby, to explore what it means to carry one of the most iconic names in motorsports into the future.

Photo courtesy Aaron Shelby

For Aaron, Carroll Shelby wasn’t just a racing icon – he was simply “Grandpa.” Born in 1971, Aaron spent his childhood between Dallas and Los Angeles, visiting Carroll at his wheel company office or swimming at his Marina del Rey apartment. Much of their time together was spent at Carroll’s East Texas farm, where family weekends were filled with stories, food experiments, and the famous chili that became a Shelby trademark.

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It wasn’t until Aaron’s teenage years that he began to understand the scope of Carroll’s influence. By then, Carroll had reemerged in the car world through his partnership with Chrysler, bringing the Shelby name back into headlines and onto racetracks.

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Aaron’s first car wasn’t a Shelby – it was a humble Acura Integra. Guided by his parents, he learned the value of starting small before stepping into performance vehicles.

Photo courtesy Aaron Shelby

Professionally, Aaron pursued finance, eventually becoming a banking executive in Dallas. But when Carroll passed, Aaron was asked to step into the family legacy. With his business acumen and passion for motorsports, he now serves on the board of Carroll Shelby International, helping steward the brand into the future.

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Synopsis

This Break/Fix episode features an in-depth interview with Aaron Shelby, the grandson of legendary automotive icon Carroll Shelby. Aaron discusses his upbringing surrounded by automotive history, his efforts to preserve and expand the Shelby name, and his role on the board of Carroll Shelby International. The conversation covers various aspects of the Shelby legacy, from iconic vehicles and racing history to the importance of auto tech education and the Carroll Shelby Foundation’s charitable work. Aaron also shares insights into future projects and developments at Shelby American, including new vehicle lines and international expansion, while emphasizing the brand’s core values of innovation and performance.

  • Growing up as the grandson of Carroll Shelby, what are some of your earliest memories of the Shelby name and its impact on car culture?
  • How has your perspective on your grandfather’s legacy evolved as you’ve taken on a more active role in preserving it?
  • Shelby has always been synonymous with performance and racing innovation—how do you see that spirit carrying forward in today’s motorsport landscape?  And in the media (Ford V Ferrari, etc.)?
  • Are there particular races, cars, or moments from the Shelby racing legacy that resonate most deeply with you?
  • What are some of the biggest challenges you face in keeping the Shelby name relevant to both lifelong fans and younger generations?  How do we keep younger people interested in racing, tuning, engineering, etc.? 
  • If Carroll were alive today, what do you think he’d say about the direction of racing, particularly with electric and hybrid technology becoming more prevalent?
  • Shelby cars have always embodied a blend of American ingenuity and performance—how do you ensure that DNA remains intact in current and future projects?
  • When you think about the future of the Shelby legacy, what excites you most, and how do you personally hope to shape that vision? And what’s next for Shelby? 

Transcript

Crew Chief Brad: [00:00:00] Break Fix podcast is all about capturing the living history of people from all over the autos sphere, from wrench, turners, and racers to artists, authors, designers, and everything in between. Our goal is to inspire a new generation of Petrolhead that wonder. How did they get that job or become that person?

The Road to Success is paved by all of us because everyone has a story.

Crew Chief Eric: Today on Break Fixx, we’re honored to welcome Aaron Shelby, grandson of the legendary Carroll Shelby. And while his grandfather forever changed the automotive and racing world with iconic machines like the Cobra and the GT 40. Aaron has carved out his own path and is a steward of that legacy,

Max Kaiserman: serving on the board of Carroll Shelby International, and leading efforts to preserve and expand the Shelby name.

Aaron Blends business acumen with a deep passion for motorsports and automotive culture. In this conversation, we’ll dive into what it means to carry on one of the most recognizable names in racing [00:01:00] history, how Aaron connects the past to the present and the exciting ways he’s keeping the Shelby spirit alive for future generations.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s right, and joining me tonight is returning guest. Max Kaiserman, who you might remember from our Luna Replicas episode. So welcome back, max.

Aaron Shelby: I see you.

Crew Chief Eric: And with that, let’s welcome Aaron to break fix.

Aaron Shelby: Hey guys, happy to be here today.

Crew Chief Eric: Normally we would start out an episode, tell us your superhero origin story, but you are the descendant of a superhero.

So let’s talk about growing up as the grandson of Carol Shelby. What are some of your earliest memories of your grandfather and the Shelby name and the impact that it had on you? The impact that you saw in car culture?

Aaron Shelby: Sure. You know, I was born in 1971, so my first decade roughly, Carol wasn’t in the car world.

We split some time. I was born in Dallas, we lived in LA for a bit. He and my father were partners in a company called Carol Shelby Wheels, a manufactured aluminum wheels in the garden area of Los Angeles. And so I would go up to the office every now and then as a little kid, and he would be up there sometimes, but it was just grandpa.

I’ve got a brother that’s two years [00:02:00] younger and we’d hang out with him a little bit. He lived in Marina del Rey in a high rise apartment that had a pool. I remember, you know, a number of times my mom taking us over there to go swim in the pool and hang out with him for lunch. And you know, a lot of ways, very typical.

We spent a ton of time with him in his farm in East Texas. That was where he was from originally. That’s where he always liked to go and recharge. And so we do a lot of. Family weekends out there when he was in town and he was just Carol, there was no car business out there. He never brought up car business.

He didn’t talk about it at all unless you really poked on him with it. Most everybody that saw him in East Texas was somebody he knew from high school or family, friends or cousins, and they didn’t talk about it. They were just, Hey, remember this time in 1940 when we did this and you know, we hung out and did this after school or whatever.

It was just very typical from that perspective. Until my teenage years,

Crew Chief Eric: almost like you were talking to a veteran of like a foreign war or something like that. It’s like, we won’t talk about it unless you ask me about it. Right.

Aaron Shelby: That’s exactly right. And one funny thing from him from that time period, you know, it, it changed as technology changed, but the man [00:03:00] lived on the telephone.

And he had this phone book that was like a Bible. It was huge. You know, assistant would type it all up and he had everybody’s phone number in there. And when he’d get a little bored, he’d just sit there and dial people’s numbers up and talk and see what was going on. And sometimes it was business related, sometimes just catching up with friends, but.

Every now and then he’d start yelling at somebody on the phone. And that was, you know, later in life that was, seemed to be his way to, uh, lead in or manage people. As the louder I yell, the more it’s gonna happen. And he’d always kind of do it with a smile on his face. I mean, it wasn’t, I don’t think out of anger necessarily ever, but it was just, that was his methodology on getting his point across loud.

Texans. Yes, exactly.

Crew Chief Eric: Speaking of last year, we had the privilege of having Leanne Patterson on, who was actually one of Carol’s PR folks, especially during the Dodge years. Yes. And she made it sound like every time you went to the ranch, quote unquote, there was always a pot of chili ready, and it was Carol’s secret sauce, and it was very down to earth.

Is that exactly, I mean, does it play out like that? That

Aaron Shelby: was pretty much it. You know, Carol was, um, an experimenter in the kitchen, let’s say. He, he did know how to cook things [00:04:00] and some things he cooked were really good. Could he do it again the next day? Probably not because he didn’t pay much attention to what he was doing or how he did it.

But yeah, there was definitely some surprise pots of things every now and then. And then there was some really good stuff that he cooked. You know, he had friends that raised cattle out there and he’d go buy fresh steaks and have a big freezer full of those. And it was like, oh, just go grab a few steaks outta the freezer.

We’ll do those tomorrow night for dinner. And at a bit of it, I’ll actually take back to his childhood and growing up in the depression era where his family did not have a lot. His ability to then make his own stuff and gather what he wanted from a food perspective, I think always played to him. And then later in life, you know, after his heart transplant particularly, he lost a lot of his sense of taste.

And so things that to him tasted good, were always a little strong to everybody else. Whether it was too salty or too hot or whatever. He was just trying to elicit some kind of taste outta it. It was definitely interesting and I had some, some good things and some interesting things out there.

Max Kaiserman: You know, the slogan for the, uh, Carol Shelby Chili is Fix it the way you like it.

There’s like a pound of hot powder in there you could add to it. That’s exactly

Aaron Shelby: right. And that’s what he wanted you to do. I mean, he knew [00:05:00] everybody was different. He wanted you to be able to customize that. And you talk about the chili, that was one of his just kind of whims of he caught lightning in a bottle there and just, it really worked for him.

Max Kaiserman: Still made today. It is, you know, coming from this family and, and with Carol’s legacy, what, what is your background? What did you find yourself at throughout life? So I’m

Aaron Shelby: a numbers guy. I’m not necessarily an idea guy, although I have a few of them, but nothing like Carol did. And then when my father started racing cars when I was eight, formula Ford’s initially at like Riverside and Willow Springs and places like that.

And your father was Michael, right? Patrick. Patrick. Oh, so he was the youngest son. He’s the youngest of the three? Correct. And you’re the older of your I’m the oldest of the grandkids. I’m the oldest of my brothers, but I’m the oldest of the six grandkids as well. Cool. You start to get. A little more of that Shelby history.

And then right on the heels of that, Carol joined Chrysler, the Dodge Years as I call him for the 1980s. All of a sudden, he’s on magazine covers again, and all the stories are talking about the Shelby history [00:06:00] from the sixties and where’s Carol been for the last 10 years, and which is a whole nother.

Story we’ll get into, and there he is in the car world again. And so I gotta go to some pretty neat races. When I was a kid, I went to the Las Vegas Grand Prix in 1982 I think it was. He was a Grand Marshall, so my mom and I flew over and met him there, and that’s when I met Mario Andretti. And so there’s certain things like that that popped up, but it really wasn’t until later, probably my teenage years that.

I began to understand more the scope of his history, what he and the team at Shelby American created and where he was going in with his life. What was your first car? Let’s see, probably a year old, maybe a year and a half old. Acura Integra. There was a base model with a five speed, and I loved it. It was great.

It was a good first car. I really wanted one of the Dodge Shelby cars. Probably pestered Carol for a year and wanted like the Shelby Lancer, the Daytona or whatever at the time, and he said, absolutely not. You need something that you can learn on and then maybe you can get one of these later on. My mom went out and bought this Acura for me and gave it to me when I turned 16.

It was awesome. [00:07:00] I loved it and had a couple of Acura after that and enjoyed ’em all. When I got outta school, I was a finance major. I went into banking and my grandmother and her side of the family, so Carol’s first wife, they’re, I could say prototypical Texans. They were an oil and gas and real estate and banking and all those things.

When dad sold the wheel company in the late eighties, he bought into a small bank in the Dallas market that my grandmother had ownership in and became chairman. And so I didn’t start there initially, but wound my way up there in 2003. And have been in that bank for, you know, 22 years now, almost 23 years.

So that’s where I’m comfortable, you know, do a lot of lender finance. We’ve sold the bank a couple of times now, so we don’t, family-wise, we don’t have much ownership there, but that’s my daily job run. Dallas-Fort Worth for this bank, in addition to our single family mortgage group, was really opportune for me on the side 10 plus years ago, almost 12 years ago now, to be able to jump into the Shelby world, it’s something I always had a passion about.

But it was Carol, you know, there wasn’t a succession plan in his mind [00:08:00] on I want this family member to be involved or that family member. My dad, like I said, was in racing. He’s always been passionate about the cars. My uncles liked it as well, but neither of them were wanting to step into that role, and so they asked me to come in and, and take a shot at it, and I’ve enjoyed it immensely.

So I think bringing that finance background that I have. Whether you’re talking about the foundation side of things and what we do or the business side of things, I do help Gary quite a bit when it comes to budgeting and kind of talking through numbers, and so I enjoy that. That’s what I bring to the table and just, I also look at what Carol did for so many years and he just made people feel comfortable.

You know, he made him feel like family and he made him feel like it’s just another guy you’re sitting down and talking to. And so I spend a lot of time with that as well. In today’s enthusiast world, we have the Texas Concourses Dallas area, and we had a little panel and a couple of guys have known Carol for.

35, 40 years, and they both said the same thing. He’s like, he was just somebody you could sit down next to and have a three hour conversation about fishing in the Gulf of Mexico and you never talk about cars. But he knew about it. You know, he just could talk about anything. And he made it about you. He [00:09:00] made it about what your interests were, not what he was interested in.

He would throw his knowledge in, of course, with different questions, but that’s really kind of where I saw he was successful and what’s helped that brand grow. And so that’s, you know, where my background is and where I try and carry us forward today.

Max Kaiserman: How have you seen the evolution of his legacy and how you’ve interacted with the legacy as you’ve become more involved with it?

Aaron Shelby: One of the best things that he wound up doing in life was joining back with Ford Motor Company in 2003, four timeframe. Obviously the next new Shelby didn’t come out till oh six, but that first couple years and just putting him back in that fold and with that team at Ford at that point in time, Edsel being a prime driver behind all that happening.

Really reenergized him. You think about that he was getting, you know, late sixties, early seventies, really, probably early seventies at that point in time. The end of the nineties was a struggle for him financially and business wise. He was, I wouldn’t say lost. There was plenty going on in his life, but there wasn’t a lot of constant in his life and.

That joining back [00:10:00] together with Ford and what that created for the last 10 years of his life was really critical to not just his personal wellbeing, but the brand today being what it represents. Had he not done that, I think we would be looking at a much different Shelby brand today than we are.

Crew Chief Eric: I don’t wanna discount the Chrysler years though, because.

As we know, Carol went to Chrysler because of Lee Iacocca, who was with him at Ford. And there’s all that partnership and friendship there. But the Viper and the Viper coup, which are basically the next generation Cobra and then Daytona coup are in their own right classics. I mean, they’re amazing vehicles.

I I don’t wanna shortchange them in any way. So is there anything happening between Shelby and Chrysler in the foreseeable future?

Aaron Shelby: Not at this point in time. You, you never say never on anything. Those were important years. I look at him as important ’cause it was my teenage years. So that’s kind of when I saw Carroll get in the car business and he and his team did a lot with a little, he first got over to Chrysler.

I think the comment was, you can go to our parts bin, but we don’t have a whole lot. We have no money to give you to do anything. Just [00:11:00] see what you can put together here. And I think for a 10 plus year partnership, they did a really good job. Putting out some fun cars. Carol was always really proud of the work was done with Chrysler and the vehicles that came out.

Given, again, kind of the budgetary constraints, the engine technology at the time, and doing those little turbo four cylinders. He had a lot of fun with that. Obviously culminating into Viper, which was how do you hit it outta the park? More than that, as a. Final feature before you leave. So really neat. We have a 92 Dodge Viper in our family collection.

I think it’s a really important piece of Shelby history that he was involved in that project, and I’ve been fortunate to be able to meet a lot of the team members that worked with him on that through the years. And it’s a scary car. Kinda like the four 20 seven’s a scary car, but it’s a important piece of Shelby history and in that important piece of Dodge and Chrysler and Shelby history as well.

Crew Chief Eric: So since we’re still waxing poetic about the Shelby legacy and a lot of the really cool cars that people identify with, like the GT 40 and the three. 50 and all those. There’s a couple unsung heroes in this list, and I’m not talking about the Omni GLHS or the Daytona or any of those cars. [00:12:00] What I’m referring to specifically is sort of that middle period there.

And you alluded to it earlier, Aaron, where Carol was experimenting, he was still trying to be in the car world and there were some offshoots. You had the series one, the series two, and then the V 10 Cobra concept in 2004, which is not too far off of the copperhead concept that Chrysler had put together.

So I wanna show a little love. For those cars. For the people out there that really like those and hope that they had gone into mass production, how are they reflected in the celebration of Shelby?

Aaron Shelby: The series one particularly, is an important vehicle. I’ll be real upfront. It’s my least favorite Shelby because I know the history of it and kind of the about bankrupted him, and I just knew a lot of the behind the scenes.

But from a engineering perspective and a company perspective, it’s really important. It’s actually the only ground up Shelby ever made as far as. Chassis created from nothing and just truly ground up. So there is that important part of Shelby history in that vehicle. We have one in our collection. You know, there was only 249 that got produced ultimately, uh, they were shooting for 500 and they just [00:13:00] didn’t have the money, nor the desire, I think, in the public to buy ’em at that point.

But I tell you, if I take that thing to a cars in coffee today, it turns heads. ’cause nobody ever sees one. And so I think from that perspective, they know it’s a Shelby. It, it’s not like some of our modern cars that have Shelby all over it. It has series one badging and you see Shelby on there one or two places and that’s it.

So you gotta know what it is and we get a lot of, particularly with the kids that don’t have any idea what it is, they get fascinated with it. You know, another interesting one, if you go back to the, the sixties timeframe is the Sunbeam tiger. And a lot of people don’t know what Carol had to do with that one.

And it’s unfor, I don’t fit in those cars, so I don’t have one. But, uh, does anybody

Crew Chief Eric: fit in those?

Aaron Shelby: It’s a neat little piece of history, you know, getting that 2 89 motor in there and, and really turning that thing into a fun little car. So. You look at that stuff, and it was Ford’s project, but the Shelby GR one, which was kind of an updated Daytona coup prototype car, if you want, came out around oh four.

So that car still looks fantastic today. It’s amazing how many people ask, well, why don’t you just license that? Start doing that on your own from Ford. I’ll be honest, super performance looked at it a while [00:14:00] back. It’s just kind of too difficult, unfortunately in today’s world to do something like that, but that design is really iconic.

You mentioned the V 10 Cobra, Chris Theodore that was on that team that did that, he actually bought it a number of years ago, hashed out the motor to make it work again. You know, it was an Unrun prototype. When they got rid of it, they plugged up the motor and all that. Well, he cleaned the whole thing out and got it running again, and he’s since sold it at auction.

But I just had somebody ping me wanting to know. We wanted to buy it. It’s coming back up for sale again. So it’s a neat piece of history as well. And I think there’s a lot of Shelby prototypes that are littered through there that will continue to gain value through the years. You look at what Craig Jackson has and the Little Red and the Green Hornet mustangs that were prototyped vehicles that tested different parts and just the story around that stuff.

It’s what continues the legacy to be as strong as it is today.

Crew Chief Eric: Can we give a little bit of credit to the instinct? Success. That was the GT 500 KR that came out a couple years after his return to Ford. I mean, that was a monster of a Mustang that hit the roads.

Aaron Shelby: It really was. And I think between oh seven and 12, that whole run of both Mustangs that Ford put together and [00:15:00] Shelby did with Ford’s help really just re-energized the Mustang brand, the Ford brand, and Shelby.

And what it meant to be a performance car company. Obviously the GT and oh five and oh six was a top-notch vehicle. I don’t want to discount that at all, but very limited and not everybody could obtain one of those. When you talk about the every man sports car in the Shelby Mustang, that really was the launchpad for where we are today.

Max Kaiserman: Shelby has become. Was even in the sixties in its own time periods, the synonymous with performance and racing and racing accessibility specifically. You go buy a Mustang and drive it to work on a Friday and drive to the track on a Saturday, it became a lot more accessible. And how do you see that spirit carrying forward today?

Is racing still accessible? Is the Shelby name still accessible?

Aaron Shelby: Yeah, I think we’ve evolved a little bit. I would love to get us. Personally back into racing. We’re not today. Obviously our cars are very performance driven and we encourage everybody to go take ’em to the track and have fun with them, but there’s not [00:16:00] necessarily a team component and certainly not a Shelby team component at the track today.

That’s something I think, and I’m speculating a bit ’cause I wasn’t in the room, but when Ford and Shelby were working on things back in oh seven to 10 to 12, Ford had some racing programs and ultimately when the three 50 came out, they did run that as a GT three car for a bit. I think that was important, but they really have their own racing umbrella, so it’s up to us if we wanna do that.

And I will say a step we’re taking in that direction next year is working with Turnkey Automotive. And what we have is our GT three 50 R model coming out for the TransAm Spec series next year. It’s not gonna be us running it, we’re gonna do it as a customer car to start with. But that’s kind of getting our toe back into the official racing waters,

Max Kaiserman: but it’s still available to the public.

It’s something that through SCCA or FIA, people could enter their own cars on a weekend or something. Exactly,

Aaron Shelby: and that’s

Max Kaiserman: the whole

Aaron Shelby: point of this one. So what you’ve got is your production stuff that any of our stuff you could take to the track today and have some fun with on a production basis. But this is gonna be more track geared under TransAm rules and it’ll be available to [00:17:00] anybody that wants to buy one and go race in that series.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s really interesting you bring that up because as of this year, Ford has. Campaign, the whole Dark Horse series as part of IMSA and the G, the lower GT three support races and things. And so are you aiming to compete against the Dark Horse with the dark horse as a replacement too? How is that gonna play out politically?

Aaron Shelby: So we talked to Ford about that a little bit. We specifically picked the TransAm series because Ford’s not corporately involved there. So it’s not a direct competition there. There are some of the drivers that race Mustang based cars. I won’t deny that, but there’s no Ford backing. Ford doesn’t have a sponsorship agreement with TransAm, et cetera.

So that was part of our choice. In addition to Turnkey, who’s helping us build those cars out of Michigan right now has a long history with the TransAm series and is well respected for creating some of their race cars, whether Camaro based or otherwise, over the last 10 years. And so they’ve helped us kind of navigate those political waters with TransAm and.

That we thought was a good entry point for us so that we’re not in direct conflict with Ford.

Crew Chief Eric: So I’ll add to this, ’cause [00:18:00] normally I ask this next question to our pro drivers about how they feel about something called BOP or balance of performance. Mm-hmm. So let’s just say a Shelby car comes to the forefront and is gonna run against.

The rest of the makes in, let’s say, GT three and IMSA or in WEC or at LAMA or something like that. How do you feel, let’s say, if you were the team principal about the balance of performance, do you think it would be in Shelby’s favor or against,

Aaron Shelby: I’ve watched this a lot in the last, well, I’ll say last 10 years.

I mean, when I started going in 16, when Ford went back with the GT and, and whether MSO or, or the a CO or, or wc. I don’t know that there’s a secret sauce to balance the performance. I think it’s a trial by error. And as soon as somebody other than Ferrari, I’ll say, gets out in front too far, they like to just reel ’em back in.

Whether it’s dialing back horsepower or putting more weight on you or doing something and it, it doesn’t seem to have a lot of rhyme or reason to it. And you talk to some of the team owners, doesn’t matter to the make, and they get a little frustrated with how it works ’cause they feel like they’re all being anchored back somehow from performance.

So from a Shelby [00:19:00] perspective, I like to think we’d be a little innovative and get out there with something that would blow everybody away. The first couple races. Then we’d have to get dialed back. That’s looking at our history and looking at, I think, where we would evolve into things.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m glad you you phrased it that way because I think at the heart of that is the ingenuity that American ingenuity that was brought to the forefront with the Shelby brand.

Something that I think a lot of us still continue to hang our hats on is it’s that roll up your sleeves to tenacity of, you know, never given up and wanting to win, and all the crazy stories that come out of that. Over the years, the Shelby cars obviously have embodied that. How do you ensure that that DNA.

That idea that ethos remains intact with current and future projects at Shelby.

Aaron Shelby: So for me, I’ll say I’ve got the easy role in this right now. The hard part of that falls on the team at Shelby American in Las Vegas, Gary Patterson, our CEO and President, and Vince La Violette, who’s our chief engineer and development officer there.

They both spent a lot of time working directly with Carol. These aren’t new hats to this. You guys may have probably met both of them through the years. They know Carol, they [00:20:00] know what he wanted. And they carry that DNA into the company today for any new associates, employees that come in and trying to train up what we’re doing, whether it’s working with our supplier partners and describing what we’re trying to accomplish with the vehicle or directly with the folks on the shop floor and just describing what the Shelby ethos looks like.

They have that burden more than I do, I think. ’cause I’m not there on a daily basis. You know, I act as a brand ambassador and I get to Vegas probably three or four times a year. But I meet with Gary probably every two weeks via phone call or something, so I know what’s going on. But they’re the ones that carry the mantle on innovation and efficiency and how do we push the envelope?

On something that maybe Ford couldn’t do because of, you know, they’re a big political company and there are just certain things they can’t do, and we’re gonna sell a hundred of something where they need to sell 5,000 of something to make it make sense. I don’t view it as pressure for me, I think it’s a live thing and it’s a live piece of Shelby DNA that we just try and instill through.

The various Shelby channels that we touch people with today.

Max Kaiserman: And I can say from the vintage perspective that I’m, I’m [00:21:00] sort of part of the vintage Shelby legacy of the sixties, what we do that’s incredibly alive and well. That is one of the most collectible cars, vintage GT three 50 or GT 500 Mustang.

They are still trading in the. Quarter million dollar range for a, a nice example. And people are very proud to have one. I have a clone, I have a 66, 3 50. Yeah. But even the Hertz legacy with Shelby Oh for sure. Has been renewed in just the last few years. The new GTS and the GT 500 H, you know, are now hitting the public because they’ve come off of the rental circuit.

It, it means something and

Aaron Shelby: that’s what is, I think if anything surprises me, it’s. The enthusiasm around the brand. I was just at the Goodwood Revival and while there was nothing Shelby specific this time, I just went to go have some fun and visit with some friends. You know, there was still a dozen cobras in two different classes that were racing.

There was two GT three 50 Rs that were racing in a separate race. And when you start to talk Shelby and you, if I wear my Shelby pitch shirt like you guys have on right now, people come up to you and ask you questions. There’s something about that brand and that. [00:22:00] Time period and the vintage cars and what they represent.

It’s just really special and it’s not something that can be recreated. You’ve got obviously a huge Porsche community in Corvette community and Ferrari community, but they’re different. One thing I hear repeatedly is how the Shelby community is like family. And it’s a small community based on comparing to some of those others.

But it’s a strong community and it is really all pulling in the same direction all the time, which I find interesting and, and a bit humbling. I think, to me, that’s something I didn’t expect when I started this 10 years ago.

Max Kaiserman: Well, the real hot rodders, and I think that’s the difference is, you know, a PORs.

You can buy a great Porsche outta the box. You can buy some of these other cars right out of the box. Uh, a Shelby Mustang, the original Daytona coup was a hot rotted and, and aluminum paneled modified British racing car from the fifties. I mean, like, and they, and it was winning. I mean, it was winning against purpose built cars.

Yep. In the mid sixties, Carol would say it’s an old car with buggy springs and, and they were getting it to win. To me, that’s the brotherhood. That’s somebody that says, we’re gonna put our [00:23:00] minds together. And anybody, the kids sweeping the floor might even have an idea that gets us an extra two seconds or something.

Exactly right. Peter Brock and Chuck Cantwell and you know, you name it, they’re still singing that song. Hey man, we were, we were a team. This was a real team.

Aaron Shelby: That’s exactly right. I was actually with both those guys at the SAC 50 out in Sonoma, you know, and Peter’s been a great friend to us. He’s in Las Vegas, so Vince and Gary involve him a lot.

And what we’re doing on the next car, so to speak. And they usually get him involved in looking at our design and the renderings. They love to have his input and I believe he just turned 89 years old. He is super active. His mind is still super sharp when it comes to talking aerodynamics and looks and what you want to see in today’s world.

And he was 20 when he did this stuff. It was crazy. He was a kid. Yeah. And Chuck is the same. I mean, what he added in that couple years that he was at Shelby, particularly the GT three 50 program, I guarantee you just talking to him today, he never envisioned that there would be this much celebration about that car.

60 years on. I mean, obviously he went on to a very [00:24:00] successful career with Penske and some other things later on, but we’re so fortunate to be able to have some of those. Folks that tie us to the past and tell their stories again, today, it’s uh, not gonna be many more years when we won’t have anybody left.

Unfortunately,

Max Kaiserman: also not for nothing. They are the nicest people in the world. Peter will sit there and talk to you for an hour. Chuck Cantwell. He’s so quiet. Sometimes you gotta lean in. But he has the greatest stories, you know, he does.

Aaron Shelby: And it’s just one of the things that I think. I certainly missed, I met some of these folks when I was younger around Carol, you know, I didn’t do a ton of events, but would show up every now and then.

I gotta meet Phil Hill and Dan Gurney and these guys, and, and I knew who they were, whether I was too shy or just didn’t know the questions I asked. I just kind of sat there and didn’t ask enough. I mean, I look back on it now, I’m like, well, I should ask ’em about this and that. I, I just didn’t, it wasn’t top of mind.

You know, these folks won’t be around forever, and I think that’s one of the neat things about all the vintage events today, whether it’s Goodwood or Sac, or Pebble Beach, whatever it is, they bring these guys together to tell their stories, to get their stories out to a wider audience.

Crew Chief Eric: So Aaron, you mentioned the Texas Concor this year at [00:25:00] Pebble Beach.

Shelby was the featured mark at the Concord to Elegance. Were you able to go out and participate and get involved in that?

Aaron Shelby: The team says Shelby kind of took over the peninsula on the weekend. I mean, we had an awesome weekend, not just. We had a team, Shelby group of enthusiasts, about 40 people out there.

But you know, at the track, obviously there’s always cobras and mustangs, but at the quail on Friday there was a GT three 50 class. We took our 65 R model out there for that. There was, I think, 12 cars in that class. It was great to see all those sitting there. In addition to Craig brought little red out for that, and in addition to two other prototype 60 sevens that were out there by their owners.

So really some neat recognition. Come into Sunday and you’ve got six cobras on the lawn at Pebble Beach. It was awesome that, you know, that kind of 65, 66 bumps up into the end of what they celebrate out there. So we were really fortunate to be able to have the cobras out there. Thursday, Gary Patterson and I were on a panel at Pebble Beach talking about Shelby history and, and what it means to be out there.

I was fortunate then to be able to give out the awards to the class winners in the Cobra class as well. A [00:26:00] lot of Shelby recognition. Really appreciate the team at Pebble Beach for helping put that on this year, and it was a special time for sure to celebrate the 60 years.

Max Kaiserman: Are there any historic races or current races that are still going, that are moments in Shelby racing that particularly resonate

Aaron Shelby: with you?

For me, I mean, it’s. The granddaddy of them all, so to speak, is the Lamont 24 hours. You know, Carol still is the only person to have won that as a driver, a manufacturer, and a team owner. I don’t think that’ll ever happen again. I just in, in today’s environment, how much it costs to go do that. I just don’t think it, it will.

So it’s a special place I try and go. Most years I was actually at Lamont in Lamont Classic this year, which was a lot of fun. The neat thing and we talk about the enthusiasts and the market that follows Shelby today, the French and the folks around Lama really appreciate the Shelby history there, winning it with Aston Martin in 59, and then the Daytona Coop winning its class in 64, and then obviously ultimately with the GTE forties under the Shelby umbrella in 66 and 67.

So there’s a lot of history and they appreciate that. Texan outlook, if you [00:27:00] will, and just what he came over and did more or less on a, I wouldn’t call it a shoestring budget with the gts, but it was a struggle to get there with the Daytona coops, and nobody expected anything outta that team. And this little ragtag bunch of Southern California guys came over and beat Ferrari.

It was, it was enormous at the time. And that still plays well over there.

Max Kaiserman: Well, I’d like to jump ahead real quick and talk about that for a second. The legacy of the hot Rodder, the chicken farmer that was beating Ferrari. Yeah. What do you see how that applies today? How do you, how do you get someone engaged in, Hey, you can do this too, we’re not special kind of thing.

Aaron Shelby: The best way to describe that part of the Carol Shelby Foundation today, one of our core pillars is auto tech education, and that is providing scholarship dollars for kids either while in high. School or usually a local community college to get their full auto tech degree and certificates on whatever it is that they need to work on.

And that’s a lot of what I talk about with these classes when I go talk to the kids. We’ve got five different schools around the country that we support with scholarship dollars in addition to. Several new car dealer associations that sponsor [00:28:00] different competitions and things that we provide some dollars to, and I talk about the opportunities that this can afford them.

You’re not having to pay for four years of your university. You’re getting usually a pretty inexpensive, if not free education, and there is a ready stream of jobs for this group to come out, whether it’s at a dealership or a mod shop or something like that. It can be a stepping stone. It’s not, I was telling somebody at lunch today.

You don’t qualify, get your certificate and go work on brake for the next 50 years. I mean, if you want to, you can, but you go work on brake for one or two years, then you move on to something else in the dealership and you move up and then all of a sudden you’re an assistant manager of the shop floor or you’re a manager of the shop floor and you’re making $250,000 a year.

We try and promote that side of it. There’s a different component to it where we have some internships that have come through Vegas. We don’t currently have any relationships. But in the past we’ve had some relationships with some NASCAR teams. We’d had internships out there. I’ve helped a couple of people get some jobs in the IMSA programs through the years.

There is that path. A lot of these kids just need a door to get open for them to get that opportunity. [00:29:00] Uh, to me it’s critical, I think, on how our society infrastructure is going to succeed going forward. We’ve gotta have those technical skills.

Max Kaiserman: You touched on earlier about Carol Shelby Foundation and the work you guys do with education.

Could you talk more about that?

Aaron Shelby: So Carol actually started the foundation after he had his heart transplants actually started up and officially was incorporated in 1996. We’re coming up on its 30 year anniversary next year, but it was a Shelby Heart Fund. Originally, he wanted to help families with children getting heart transplants.

That’s a pretty narrow scope that he realized pretty quickly and pretty expensive. So he broadened it. Through the years and now our focus is auto tech education as we discussed earlier. And then we also help families with children going through transplant care, not just hearts, but any kind of transplant.

So we work with five different transplant hospitals, pediatric

Max Kaiserman: transplant hospitals around the country. My best friend who I was just the best man at his wedding is a, uh, pediatric pediatric anesthesiologist Oh, wow. At Johns Hopkins. Yeah. Guys are linked in to Hopkins at all. I can get you connected with them.

Aaron Shelby: Yeah, that one [00:30:00] would be good. We use, uh, university of Pit. Bird Medical Center up there. We have a good relationship with, we’ve got one in Southern California, Loma Linda Children’s here in Dallas, one in Kansas City. A lot of these introductions start through our team Shelby Group meetings, and sometimes it’s somebody that they know and we do some local fundraising for them, and then we tie that relationship in, so it’s.

It’s impressive. I’d

Max Kaiserman: love to help with that in some way. Just Hopkins is huge on the East coast here. Of course. Major, major, major medical system.

Aaron Shelby: We also work with Children’s Organ Transplant Association out of Indianapolis. If you are a family in a rural area and your kid needs a kidney, a liver, whatever, they literally have a playbook for you.

This is what you need to think about. This is how you need to raise some funds to help yourself. You know, it’s not everybody that has a. Pediatric transplant hospital in their backyard. So it’s gonna involve a lot of travel and care for other family members or pets or travel and time off work. And Coda’s a great organization.

We do not have any kind of infrastructure to help with that, but we give money to Coda because they’ve got a staff that really helps families around the country. I think last year they helped 300 [00:31:00] families through that process. So you know, at the end of the day, the Carol Shelby Foundation is where Carol wanted his legacy to be remembered most.

And so having those core pillars of helping families with healthcare needs. And the auto tech education is critical for us to continue that Shelby legacy and brand.

Crew Chief Eric: See, I thought Max was gonna go in a totally different direction because I know his heart aligns with the Ford versus Ferrari movie ’cause some of the, the work he’s done with that.

So I’m wondering, going back to the California hot rodder and touching all those things you highlighted, let’s just dive into that for a second. How true. Was the movie to some of the stories, you know, or what did they get wrong and what did they get right?

Aaron Shelby: Some of the things that were correct. Obviously the overarching story is correct.

You are cramming five years into two hours, so there’s some things they gloss over, have to kind of Hollywood eyes to, so to speak. But the overall arching story is correct. It was this group that was not expected to do much. Became successful, got Ford’s wallet basically, and after their success to go make Ford successful.

And they did. There was a lot of politics involved. We’ve got [00:32:00] some commentary in our archives between Shelby executives and Ford and Ford executives and Pullman Moody and you know, the Ford executives were playing both those teams off of each other. That took place for sure, depending on who inside Ford had, what desire.

I think Matt Damon did a good job of getting Carol’s character across. I wasn’t necessarily a fan when I first heard he was gonna play Carol. I liked Matt a lot. I just didn’t see it. But he really did a good job bringing his character to life and I talked to him about it at the red carpet. I gotta meet him.

And I said, you know, you play a lot of real life characters. If you could look across his movie spectrum. How did you get into this role? And he said, you know, Aaron, your grandfather was one of the easiest because he’s got hundreds of hours of interviews on YouTube. And I just went and started watching interviews and watching interviews and, and it wasn’t all from like 2010, it was like 1962.

And then, you know, 1994 and 1987, there was all kinds of different ages and he really picked up a lot of Carol’s mannerisms and characteristics that way. And I thought he did a really good job of getting that across in the movie. Who would your grandfather have wanted to play him? [00:33:00] Well. I’ll, I’ll give you who I would’ve picked.

I would’ve picked Matthew McConaughey tall, skinny, Texan, just like Carol would’ve, sounded just like Carol. I don’t think that would’ve been a stretch at all.

Max Kaiserman: Was he as calm though? You know, McConaughey has this vibe of everything’s all right all the time.

Aaron Shelby: I, I think Carol could play that pretty easy. If you talk to the team, particularly back in the sixties, I mean, he was the leader and he was the pied piper, so to speak.

He didn’t have to be yelling at everybody to. Get ’em to do things. They wanted to do it ’cause they wanted to succeed and I think he could have done that pretty well. So it, it would’ve been interesting. Matt did a good job and I think in general played it in a really good light. I will expand just a little bit back to both of your questions.

So that movie has done more to gather a younger generation of Shelby fans than I think anything we could do outta the company today. It just really created that genesis story and got people to recognize. Even more modern enthusiasts that have become in the Shelby world in the last 15 years. When he joined back with Ford, a lot of ’em didn’t know the origin story, didn’t really understand that Carroll was a race car driver, and the success that the Cobra had and what [00:34:00] all happened back then.

That movie really opened a lot of eyes to the Shelby Ford partnership and where that success came from. You know, going back to the Ford versus Ferrari movie, outside of the Shelby recognition, the best thing it did was bring 10 miles achievements to light. ’cause so many people did not even know who Ken Miles was.

And he was so critical to the success. And he was a fantastic driver

Max Kaiserman: and an engineer. I mean, he was a, he was a born engineer. Phil Remington. Charlie apu. I mean these guys that really were critical to this. Phil Remington especially, and he designed mm-hmm. The whole control arm replacement system. Yeah.

For the UP engine G GT 40. These guys made that happen and it’s so great that it has a rebirth. You know that vintage history has a rebirth and now you know, has a modern take on it. Yep, that’s exactly right. Carol saw the rebirth of the electric car. You know, it had been a thing in the 10th century. Yes, yes.

What would he say today about the direction of electric vehicles in daily use and in racing as well? If you

Aaron Shelby: look at Carol’s history, he was a look forward guy and he was a technology guy. [00:35:00] He loved technology. And while a lot of stuff that he tried didn’t work, we actually have him on, in one of his last interviews in 2011 talking about electrification and that he was really excited about what he was reading about electrification for cars, but knowing that he wasn’t gonna see the optimum performance of that, whether you’re talking track or just daily use, but knowing it was coming from the engineers he was talking to.

And so I think he would love to see where it sits today. Would he base the whole company around it today? Probably not. Just like we’re not today. I think at some point. If there’s a spot for a Shelby Electric vehicle, we’ve done a couple little trial runs on some machs and things, but I don’t think the technology nor the market is where we need it to be.

To be a Shelby vehicle today. Doesn’t mean it won’t always be that way. At some point we might get there, but I do think Carol would really like it. What people don’t understand a lot of times is Carol was a, he was an entrepreneur. And he was an idea guy, and so he tried hundreds if not thousands of things through the years that just never worked and he didn’t care.

He just wanted to try ’em out. And I think electrification, he would be looking at the battery technology and the [00:36:00] software and he’d be looking at everything that the tech guys are looking at today and say, how do you make this better? I mean, it’s one thing to get in a Tesla and go, you know, zero to 60 in two seconds, but how do you get that thing to last for 20 laps in a race?

You can’t, doesn’t mean it won’t always be there. It’ll get there at some point in time.

Max Kaiserman: It’d be a killer drag race though. Oh yeah, for sure. Instant torque. You know? I can only

Crew Chief Brad: imagine. Yeah, he would love that.

Max Kaiserman: Yeah. Carol would’ve loved instant torque. I mean, it really was What, where the rubber hits the road literally.

Yep. And the endurance comes later. Right. That’s, that’s the, but in his own words, you know, Carol said he was a serial entrepreneur and had adult a DD. He just, he went from one thing to another. Thing when he got bored with it. But it all had a, a similar vein of that sort of innovation and engineering.

Exactly.

Crew Chief Eric: And I’m glad you guys went here with the electrification and the rebirth of the partnership with Ford. You know, and that’s getting stronger every day. Ford has been talking, there’s no longer rumors they have made it official. Right. There’s some Formula one stuff going on and we’ll leave that to the side side.

But they’re returning to LAMA for the projected 2027 season in the LMDH.

Aaron Shelby: Yeah. The [00:37:00] hypercar class. Mm-hmm. Yeah, exactly.

Crew Chief Eric: The GT P class. So are we gonna see a quote unquote, let’s call it another Ford GT in the upper echelons of racing? And is Shelby gonna be involved there, or can you say Aaron?

Aaron Shelby: Well, I, I can’t really say with any real knowledge on that.

I, I’m excited that Ford’s doing that. I tell you that I think from a Shelby perspective and just a racing enthusiast perspective, it’s gonna be really neat to see. I have had a lot of fun the last two years seeing the Mustangs race and the GT class over there. You know the Corvettes sound okay, but there’s nothing like that Mustang coming down the MO saying Strait.

It is just an awesome sound. It does not sound like a Porsche, Ferrari or Aston Martin by any means. So I think this is a logical step for Ford to take and I’m excited to see what the program looks like and and how they end up performing in 27.

Crew Chief Eric: You mentioned the family collection a couple of times for those that want to see Shelby’s up close.

There’s a couple collections. One in Boulder in Las Vegas, but is there a museum?

Aaron Shelby: So there’s really. Three, I’d almost say four museums at this point in time. Obviously at the Simeon, you’ve [00:38:00] got the 2287, the Daytona coop that’s there. I think they’ve got a Cobra as well, if I remember. But as far as official museums, the Shelby American Collection in Boulder is probably the most extensive when it comes to racing history, and whether it’s the cars or the memorabilia there.

The Miller Family Collection is housed there in addition to a number of other owners that keep their cars there, so that’s really a impressive one. It’s been open probably almost 30 years now. You’ve got the Cobra experience in Northern California, run by Drew Serb and his daughter Emily. Really neat history there.

They’ve done a good job of getting a lot of paraphernalia, let’s say, out of the old Venice shop and things that are on display in addition to all the great cars and a little film they put together. Just a ton of record history there. And then in Orange County you’ve got the Segerstrom Center. Ted and Ray Segerstrom opened this up about five years ago, and they’ve got a huge warehouse that they put their Shelby collection in.

They essentially had a collection of cars. They didn’t know what to do with it, so they wound up hiring museum design group and created a museum out of it. And they do events there, and it’s opened to the public. It’s really a neat place. So on the top of that, on the. Fourth [00:39:00] side, you’ve got Shelby American in Las Vegas.

We have a small museum there. What we curate through there changes a lot of stuff’s on loan. Some of it’s replica, some of it’s original stuff. We try and refresh things pretty frequently, but we give tours and tell the Shelby story there. Four really neat spots around the country you could go to to learn Shelby history and see some of these cars up close.

Max Kaiserman: When you think about the future of Shelby, what excites you the most and how do you personally hope to shape that future moving forward?

Aaron Shelby: So two things that I really think that we can add to our success level in. We have a lot of opportunity internationally. You know, it’s not just the movie, but. I will tell you in Europe, Australia, South Africa, there was already a really hardcore Shelby enthusiast group in, in all those areas to be able to get that out there.

I will tell you, it’s not easy when you’re trying to talk about homolog, getting these cars to go overseas and things like that. So that’s been a bit of our struggle, but. We’re getting there. We’ve got a good opportunity. We have a good distributor in Europe that’s working with some Ford dealers over there.

We were really doing well, kind of up to [00:40:00] 2019 into COVID and we got kind of kicked back with all that thing slowed down on us. Now the tariff stuff’s gonna probably kick us back a little bit as well, but to me that’s where we have a lot of opportunity and, and we see that in addition to licensing side, I think we have a lot more opportunity there.

This year. There’s been some neat things that came out. Lego did their first Shelby 4 27 Cobra Lego kit came out in July 4th, which I thought was apropos for that. I think they’ve been having great success with it, from what I understand. Just recently, Oliva introduced a new Shelby watch that’s gonna be a worldwide sale and they’re really fired up about it.

They had some at Pebble Beach and went to several events and were really enthused with the response that they got out of everybody that saw it. In addition, fossil earlier this year did, did a watch. Really limited run. It was only. 500 units. So that was a pretty small run, but I think they’re gonna be in line to do something else.

So, you know, I don’t see us being Harley Davidson, so to speak, and having the name on everything, but there’s other opportunities to partner with some pretty exciting companies out there on the licensing side, and that’s gonna be where we lead to success and continue to build just the brand awareness in the future.

Crew Chief Eric: [00:41:00] So leading off of. What Max was just asking you about shaping the Shelby legacy for the future. What’s next for Shelby? Any new vehicles, anything exciting? Any spoilers you can share with us?

Aaron Shelby: Yeah, we’ve got a few things, a few exciting announcements this year and what we realized a number of years ago is kind of from what we do with Shelby American in Las Vegas.

It’s doing more niche production runs. It keeps that desire out there and keeps the need out there. And so we introduced a Bear Jackson in January, the brand new GT three 50 that we’re producing at Shelby. A limited run of cars this year. We’ll do another limited run next year, but that’s our entry level Shelby Mustang right now, and we’re excited about that.

We already had the super snake that we had introduced last year. On top of that, at Pebble Beach, we introduced the supers snake R. So we have a more track oriented top end Shelby.

Crew Chief Brad: We

Aaron Shelby: put a ton of engineering work into that car. We’re only doing a hundred of ’em this year, and they’re already all called for excited about what we’ve got on the Mustang side.

And then what. A lot of people don’t recognize too, while we’re known for that work trucks is 70% of [00:42:00] our business today. You know, we’ve got five different Shelby truck platforms out there right now, and those evolve a bit as Ford updates, models and things. But anything from our super Baja F two 50, down to a kind of modern day Ford Lightning, if you want to call it that.

It’s our Shelby Supers snake, but single cab, short bed, lowered truck. With a supercharger on it. Probably I’ll do a hundred of those this year. So there’s a lot of neat stuff that we’re doing and always kind of tinkering and evolving whether you want to be off-road or on road with the trucks. And then all the track oriented stuff that we do with the Mustangs is really exciting.

Crew Chief Eric: So what I heard you say is that the Viper truck is coming back too, right?

Aaron Shelby: Uh, you might have read between the lines somewhere. We’ll see.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, on that note, Aaron, we’ve reached that point of the episode where I like to invite our guests to share any shout outs, promotions, thank yous, or anything else we haven’t covered thus far.

Aaron Shelby: Well, you know, I’ve gotta thank you guys for having me on for one, and just the Shelby community in general. It’s been so great to meet so many great people around the country and around the world that we deal with. None of this happens without the team at Shelby American, Gary Patterson and Vince Levi Violette, Tracy [00:43:00] Smith, et cetera.

You know, it takes a team to put all this together and make it look easy, although everybody knows it’s not behind the scenes. There’s a lot of effort just like you guys put on your show here. So just thank you to all of ’em and, um, continue to see people throughout the year. We got a few events left this year, and if anybody is out there and runs into us, come up and say

Max Kaiserman: hello.

From his personal memories of growing up being a part of the legendary Shelby family to his current role guiding Shelby International into the future, Aaron reminds us that history isn’t just something we preserve, it’s something we carry forward. The Shelby story is one of passion, innovation, and relentless pursuit of performance, and Aaron continues to keep that spirit alive for both longtime enthusiasts and new generations.

Discovering the brand. If you’d like to learn more, be sure to visit shelby.com and follow Shelby American across social media for the latest news events and performance cars.

Crew Chief Eric: And with that, Aaron, I can’t thank you enough for coming on break fix and sharing part of the Shelby legacy with us and the exciting news of all the things that are coming, we are looking forward to one of the best known, best American brands to [00:44:00] continue, especially in the Motorsport world for years to come.

So thank you for what you’re doing and keep up the great work.

Aaron Shelby: Will do. I appreciate it guys. Thanks for the time today.

Crew Chief Eric: Thank you.

We hope you enjoyed another awesome episode of Break Fix Podcast, brought to you by Grand Tour Motorsports. If you’d like to be a guest on the show or get involved, be sure to follow us on all social media platforms at Grand Touring Motorsports. And if you’d like to learn more about the content of this episode, be sure to check out the follow on article@gtmotorsports.org.

We remain a commercial free and no annual fees organization through our sponsors, but also through the generous support of our fans, families, and friends through Patreon. For as little as $2 and 50 cents a month, you can get access to more behind the scenes action, additional pit stop, minisodes and other VIP goodies, as well as keeping our team of creators.

Fed on their strict diet of fig Newton’s, Gumby bears, and monster. So [00:45:00] consider signing up for Patreon today at www.patreon.com/gt motorsports. And remember, without you, none of this would be possible.

Highlights

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00 Welcoming Aaron Shelby
  • 01:25 Growing Up with Carroll Shelby
  • 05:10 Aaron’s Early Career and Family Background
  • 09:15 Shelby Legacy and Racing History
  • 11:44 Shelby Prototypes and Unique Cars
  • 15:43 Shelby in Modern Racing
  • 20:57 Shelby Community and Legendary Figures in Shelby History
  • 24:56 Shelby at Pebble Beach
  • 26:07 The Legacy of Shelby Racing
  • 27:32 The Carroll Shelby Foundation
  • 31:30 The Ford vs. Ferrari Movie: Fact vs. Fiction
  • 34:47 Shelby and the Future of Electric Vehicles
  • 37:43 Shelby Museums and Collections
  • 39:19 Future of Shelby: New Vehicles and International Expansion
  • 42:38 Closing Remarks and Future Events

Learn More

STEM & Automotive Education Programs

  • Scholarships for Automotive and Diesel Technology Students CSF partnered with the College of Southern Nevada to provide $37,500 in scholarships for students in automotive and diesel technology programs. This includes:
    • Ten annual scholarships of $2,500 each
    • Split across Fall and Spring semesters
    • Designed to support students pursuing careers as certified technicians
  • Support for Automotive Training Centers CSF contributes to educational infrastructure, such as the Carroll Shelby Automotive Technology Center at Northeast Texas Community College, helping students gain hands-on experience in automotive engineering and repair.
  • Mission to Teach Life-Changing Skills Aaron Shelby emphasized that the Foundation’s expanded mission includes teaching kids skills that help them succeed in the auto industry, addressing the national shortage of qualified technicians.

Medical Assistance & Health Advocacy

  • Support for Children with Life-Threatening Illnesses Originally founded to assist children needing coronary and kidney care, CSF continues to provide:
    • Funding for major surgeries
    • Grants to organizations conducting research in organ transplant management
  • Global Charitable Impact CSF has helped charities worldwide raise funds and launch healthcare programs and facilities.

Additional Educational Support

  • Scholarships Beyond Automotive Fields CSF also provides scholarship money to students pursuing education in automotive and related fields, not limited to technical training.
  • Customized Fundraising Initiatives Through merchandise and commemorative items (like the authorized Carroll Shelby signature), CSF raises funds to support its programs

LEARN MORE AT https://foundation.shelby.com

Bonus Content

There's more to this story!

Be sure to check out the behind the scenes for this episode, filled with extras, bloopers, and other great moments not found in the final version. Become a Break/Fix VIP today by joining our Patreon.

All of our BEHIND THE SCENES (BTS) Break/Fix episodes are raw and unedited, and expressly shared with the permission and consent of our guests.

Aaron emphasizes that Carroll’s genius wasn’t just about cars – it was about people. Carroll made everyone feel like family, whether they were talking about fishing or racing. That ethos continues to guide Shelby American today, where innovation and accessibility remain central.

From the GT500KR Mustangs of the mid-2000s to rare prototypes like the Series 1 and the V10 Cobra Concept, Aaron sees each chapter of Shelby history as vital to the brand’s identity. Even lesser-known projects, like the Sunbeam Tiger or Chrysler collaborations, hold a place in the Shelby story.

Photo courtesy Aaron Shelby

While Shelby American isn’t currently fielding a factory-backed race team, Aaron revealed exciting plans: the company is working with Turnkey Automotive to launch a GT350R TransAm-spec car for customer racing. It’s a step toward reconnecting Shelby with its racing roots, while keeping the spirit of accessibility alive – any enthusiast can buy one and compete.

Photo courtesy Aaron Shelby

Perhaps the most powerful part of the legacy is the community. Shelby owners and fans form a tight-knit family, united by a passion for performance and ingenuity. Whether at Goodwood Revival (above) in the UK or a local cars-and-coffee in Texas, the Shelby name sparks conversations, admiration, and connection.

Aaron sees this as the true measure of Carroll’s impact: not just the cars, but the people who carry the spirit forward.

Photo courtesy Aaron Shelby

Carroll Shelby once said, “I never made a damn dime until I started doing what I wanted to do.” Aaron Shelby embodies that same philosophy – blending business discipline with a love for motorsports, ensuring the Shelby name remains synonymous with innovation, accessibility, and passion for generations to come.


Guest Co-Host: Max Kaiserman

In case you missed it... be sure to check out the Break/Fix episode with our co-host.
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David Hobbs on 1960s British Club Racing and the White Ferrari GTO

Every so often, Break/Fix takes a detour from its main episodes to deliver a Pit Stop Mini-sode featuring bonus content that digs deeper into motorsport history. This time, we had the privilege of sitting down with legendary driver and commentator David Hobbs to revisit the vibrant world of British Club Racing in the 1960s, and to explore the fascinating story behind John Coombs’ famous white Ferrari 250 GTO.

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Hobbs’ journey into racing began humbly in 1959, behind the wheel of his mother’s Morris Oxford. By 1960, he was campaigning his father’s Jaguar XK140, still learning the ropes and discovering the importance of racing tires the hard way. As a Jaguar apprentice, Hobbs found himself under the watchful eye of Lofty England – Jaguar’s managing director and former Le Mans-winning team manager – who quickly recognized his talent.

Despite being chastised by supervisors for neglecting his apprenticeship duties, Hobbs was soon tapped to test prototype cars at Silverstone. That moment, walking past skeptical managers alongside Jaguar’s top brass, marked the turning point in his career.

Spotlight

Learn more about David Hobbs and his fabulous racing career on this episode of Evening With A Legend. Go Behind the Scenes via our Patreon.

Synopsis

On this Pit Stop mini-sode of the Break/Fix podcast our team, consisting of Crew Chief Eric, William Ross (Ferrari Marketplace Podcast) and Jon Summers (The Motoring Historian) delve into the history of British Club racing in the 1960s with legendary pro-driver and commentator, David Hobbs. The discussion covers David’s early racing career, the dynamics and culture of club racing during that era, and significant figures such as Lofty England, John Coombs, and various renowned drivers like Graham Hill, Mike Hawthorn, and Jack Sears. Hobbs shares personal anecdotes, his experiences with different racing cars, including the famed white Ferrari 250 GTO and Jaguar E-Type, and his interactions with key personalities in the motorsport world. The episode also touches on the transition from amateur to professional racing and the evolution of race car engineering.

Transcript

Crew Chief Brad: [00:00:00] We always have a blast chatting with our guests about all sorts of different topics, but sometimes we go off the rails and dig deeper into their automotive and motor sports pasts. As a bonus, let’s go behind the scenes with this pit stop mini episode for some extra content that didn’t quite fit in the main episode.

Sit back and enjoy and remember to like, subscribe and support break fix on Patreon.

Crew Chief Eric: It is always fun to get back together with John, the motoring historian, and William from the Exotic Car Marketplace. But today is extra special because we are gonna take a deep dive into 1960s British Club racing with. None other than legendary pro driver and commentator David Hobbes. So I wanna welcome David Hobbes back to break Fix as we dive into this interesting part of Motorsports history.

David Hobbs: Well, good afternoon, gentlemen. Thank you for inviting me for a, a recap of 60 odd years ago.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, David, this comes about because John, William and I have been working on a [00:01:00] project about John Coombs and his famous white Ferrari, two 50 GTO, and when we were digging into the history, you start to realize how small the motor sports world is.

Your name starts popping up because that’s when your career was starting to come about. And so we figured, well, let’s ask a living legend about living history. So let’s dive into British Club racing in the 1960s. Can you take us back? Well, British Club

David Hobbs: racing in the 1960s was actually very, very healthy.

And of course, in those days it really was club racing. The first two cars I drove in 1959, I drove by Mums Morris Oxford. Which was hardly a racing car. I drove it, took it from the tracks when I didn’t have it towed, how that is. And in 1960, I drove my dad’s XK one 40. But unfortunately I was so naive and, uh, so raw that I had never quite understood the, uh, ports of racing tires.

And I raced out on Michel X. In the very first race with I ever turned at, at Alton Park on the last [00:02:00] lap of a GT race and was outta the race. I, I modified that ’cause I was actually a Jaguar apprentice at the time. I had started off buying, being a Damer apprentice, but then I became a Jaguar apprentice ’cause of my dad’s affiliation with Daimler, with his, uh, automatic gearbox.

I, you know, I, I chose the school, so I couldn’t go to university, so I became an apprentice. But of course, I got so involved in the racing and luckily, loft England, who was the managing director of Jaguar when I became a Jaguar apprentice, was the team manager who won Lamont for. Jag in 1950, what? Five, six, and seven.

Lofty was a team manager. He had worked his way through the company and by the time I was the apprentice, he was the managing director, but he also was a clerk of the course, what you’d call a chief steward at lots of silvers to the club racers run by the British racing driver. Luckily for me, lofty took rather fancy to my driving style, and so he was a great help.

I had, uh, a funny incident and the apprentice supervisor, whose name was Harold Barker called me into [00:03:00] his office and tore me off a strip and said I was the worst apprentice I’d ever had. I was never there. I’d ever went to tech, I’d ever passed any examiners, which I didn’t. I. I did spend a lot of time at the racetrack.

By 1961, I was driving the Low Elite, which my father’s company had bought me to help promote the gearbox because it had dad’s automatic gearbox in it. So although Harold Barker tore me off this terrible strip, just said, I dunno what you’re gonna do ho. He said, I think I just don’t see a life for you.

You’re gonna be probably be homeless. And he said, you’re absolutely completely useless. Well, luckily a couple of weeks later I was working in experimental department and the foreman called me. I was, says here, Hobbs. He says, Mr. England wants to see you in his office. So I thought, oh, blindly. This seems got a bit outta hand now.

So I went up to the office and Lofty said, oh Hobbs, we have an experimental car. We have a prototype car, and we’d rather like you to take to silver to drive it for us. Would would you be able to do that? I said, I’m sure I could. So, so the next thing, I’m walking through the [00:04:00] main office block with the Lofty England as the managing director with, uh, Jim Haynes, who was the, uh, chief engineer at Jaguar.

Wally Hassen, who was the chief engineer man, and, uh, Mike McDowell, who was the competition manager for Ja. And we walked past Mr. Barker’s office and I was there. He was look in the door while I’m walking down with all these heavy hitters and say, oh, afternoon, Mr. Barker’s still here.

That was the high point of my apprenticeship. Anyway, we did go testing and Michael Parks, if you remember the name, Michael Parks was going to run me that afternoon. He and his girlfriend were there and his girlfriend. Ultimately became Enzo Ferrari’s personal secretary. And she is still alive and kicking, apparently living in Italy and I just can’t remember her name.

But she was a very bright young spark and uh, Michael was very attracted to her. But anyway, I spun the car going through the old Abbey curve, which in those days was pretty much a flat out lefthander. It’s gone now, but I spun it the flat spot, all the tires ’cause they hadn’t got [00:05:00] his spare tires. So we went back to the factory.

So during 1961, dad had a bit of a windfall in the Westinghouse breaker signal. Bought some shares in the company and I thought it’d be a great idea if we raced the loads of elite with the gearbox, which of course the big thing about dad’s box was it was the four speed, the friction drive, no fluid drive.

So it used very little power. It had four speeds with automatic or and full manual override. So it made a perfect racing mops and we were very successful in the Loads League. Well, or races. Of course, during that time, lofting was a, was a big supporter, and when I finished my apprenticeship at the end of 1961, a lot of things happened.

The Army draft finished at the end of 61. I finished my apprenticeship in December the 31st, and I got married on December the 16th. And Lofty had got me a professional drive with a guy called Peter Berry who had a 3.8 mark, two Sudan and an XKE, both in green. Bruce McLaren had driven for him in [00:06:00] 1960 and he asked me to drive for in 1961 and Lofty got me that drive in 1962.

So when I left apprenticeship, I got up to a flying start with my racing career by driving for Peter Barry. And of course our biggest competitor, one of our big competitors, was for two big competitors, a key endeavor, which is run by a guy called Tommy. So with, and John Coon. So I met John Coons fairly soon.

You know, after leaving Jag. He knew that Lofty England knew me and thought a lot about me. Funnily enough, in my last year while the apprentice supervisor was slagging me off, I got a call to see if I’d go to entry because it was the British Grand Prix today entry, and one of the supporting races was a GT race.

And I rushed up there. He said, can you go and drive for Tommy? Sat with an Ike endeavor, E type, and of course I rushed up to Adrian. By the time I got there, Jack Sears, who was another very, very, very good amateur driver. I mean, he is a farmer, but he [00:07:00] was a hell of a driver. Unfortunately, Jack Sears was also there and he hadn’t gotta drive that weekend.

So before I got there, they had actually put him in the car. They did gimme some lapse in it. I was a bit nervous ’cause I’d never driven a big car before. I’d only ever driven the elite, so I was used to about 85 horsepower, not whatever. The Jag gave a couple of hundred, 250, something like that, and a much bigger vehicle.

Obviously John Coons was there at that meeting as well because Graham Hill was driving John Coombs as E type. This is before the Ferrari came along. Coombs was very successful. Graham Hill drove for him in the, uh, in the 3.8, mark two, which was also white. He drove for him an E type, which was white, and then of course they got the.

The two 50 GTO, which of course was a hell of a car, and they had some very spirited races with people like Tommy, who was a pretty good driver. Michael Parks drove for him. Obviously, he was a very good driver and some chap called Sterling Roth drove for him as well. In in the number seven before the GTO, he had a, a [00:08:00] Ferrari, uh, two 50 short wheel base, which was a hell of a car.

Those races used to be really exciting because they were very, very. Compared to today. I mean, these were modified street cars. You could take the seats out or you could put lighter seats in and you could do other weight saving, but you couldn’t do much. They didn’t. They didn’t have a space frame like most race cars do today, so they were much more difficult to actually get stiffener.

The chassis were never stiff. But it made them very exciting racing and the, and the public loved it, and John Coombs was a huge part of that.

Crew Chief Eric: David, there is so much to unpack here. I’m sure we all have questions.

Jon Summers: Our understanding is that Coombs bought this GTO because the E type was not competitive. And in an interview that John Coombs had with.

Simon Taylor from Motorsport Magazine 15 years ago now. He says that he had a meal with Bill Haynes, where he said to Bill Haynes that this car’s like a pendulum. If you don’t make it lighter, [00:09:00] I am going to have to race my Ferrari. And coming outta that lunch, this white Ferrari apparently spent the winter of 1962 at Jaguar.

Evolving and this process gave us the lightweight e type. That’s what we think happened. Do you have any insight on that or were you in Daytona meeting, bill France at that time?

David Hobbs: I’m afraid I don’t have any insight on that. No. Uh, that would’ve been above my pay grade, but I couldn’t believe that a lot of people have done that, taken cars that take ’em apart, and obviously the lightweight E type was very, very good.

It still wasn’t quite as good as the Ferrari. I dunno whether it had a bit less power. The V 12 and the Ferrari was a great engine and the chassis was pretty good too. The uh, GTO was in the end was quicker than the lightweight. Now obviously, lightweight E types now have evolved enormously. They’re not really jags anymore.

They’re so different. But, uh, yeah, so I can, I can believe that being true. And John Cobs is a huge, huge Jaguar fan, so I know [00:10:00] he would’ve liked to have made the Jaguar faster than the Ferrari, because after all he was a Jaguar dealer in Guilford.

Jon Summers: I just want to touch on that. You talked about how a lot of the lightweights now are not really anything like they were years ago.

I assume that for WPD. The Coombs car might be in that category. ’cause you see it being raced at Goodwood all the time and it presents like a new car. I wonder if you, you are familiar with the cars at Revs, the Briggs Cunningham lightweight E type. Is that as far as you are aware, more like an original lightweight

David Hobbs: E that Briggs Cunningham car got a name.

What’s this type? Is it the EJ two or whatever it’s called, the e something.

Jon Summers: I don’t, I don’t know. I I, I’m just trying to think of what, where would be like an original lightweight E Yeah, that would be a good comparison point. What we are thinking about is, can you look at this Ferrari and say, well, the guys at Jaguar obviously looked at this Ferrari and then made these changes to the Jaguar as a result, and therefore [00:11:00] we need an early lightweight e

David Hobbs: point of comparison.

I think really that the Jaguar we’re trying to, uh. I don’t know about crib, but to try and actually improve the E type by following some of the Ferrari practices, uh, rather than the other way around. I mean, I think the Ferrari was always the quicker of the two cars. Well, ’cause the E type in those days, they didn’t have the material ology that you got today.

These are E type straight sixes. Give over 400 horsepower. Well, when that straight six engine first came out, it gave about 160. So to give four 60 is a massive increase, which obviously you wouldn’t be able to do with the original blocks, crank shafts and main eng, main bearings and that sort of thing. So the only reason they can do that is because of modern materials.

You know, I mean, I don’t know that the in outs and the depths of the. Cos England relationship or the Coombs Jaguar relationship. But I just know that John was a very, and at one stage he was talking about trying to get me in one of his cars. But of [00:12:00] course, Graham was always there. And so that was, uh, unlikely to happen.

But, uh, Coombs was always a very nice chap. Terribly, terribly, terribly, terribly posh. You know, it was a terrible English, terrible. Like myself, who’s rather unc Coth very, very smooth and urban was our

Jon Summers: cobes. You told us that fabulous story a moment ago about, you know, walking past Mr. Barker’s office with the chopped brass.

Yeah. From Jaguar there. Yeah. Let’s imagine our Ferrari arriving at Brown’s Lane here. You know, when BMW buy a Tesla. They strip it down to the component parts and they measure all those component parts to do, you know, we imagine men in in white coats doing that. Is that what Brown’s Lane was like? How many people did Lofty England or did Bill Haynes have?

To be looking at this and what would the process have been like? Would they have driven it around on the streets? Would they have booked Silverstone for a day and driven it down to Silverstone to do that? What do you think that process [00:13:00] would’ve

David Hobbs: looked like? Hard to help you there, but I mean, I worked in the experimental department at Jaguar, which is where all that type of person would’ve been, and there wasn’t very many people in there.

I mean, there’s Mr. Walker who was the foreman. And uh, he was really a farmer. Obviously Bill Hayes would’ve been all over it and people like Mike Kimberly, who was an ex apprentice but was riding rapidly through the ranks and he ran the XJ 13 when I tested it at Myra in 1967. He was still a Jag, but by then he was one of the chief engineers.

And of course she ultimately went to work for Lotus and ran Lotus for many, many years. So people like him would’ve been all over it, like it run, you know, looking at checking everything out. And like all engineers, my dad had terrible issues ’cause my dad was a fruit farmer from Australia. His father had a fruit farm, his grandfather had, it was an orange grove in Adelaide.

And dad was one of nine children, seven of whom were boys. And it was assumed that he would just go into the business, so he didn’t go [00:14:00] to university. But it turned out from a very early age that he was a, a mechanical engineering kind of genius, and he invented that automatic gearbox entirely on his own and started when he was about 19, invented all sorts of mechanical.

Machines ’cause of his day. You know, those early cars back in the, in the mid-teen 19 teens, they were all crash boxes. He didn’t think they were much good for women, so he thought they could probably have an automatic gearbox would be a good idea. So he started working on it when he was about 19 and he had this problem all the time that people would look at his stuff and say, well, Howard, you don’t have a degree in, in mechanical engineering.

Probably don’t know enough about that and I, I can guarantee it. The people like Bill Hayes would’ve looked at that RA and say, oh, well we could have done that, or, or we wouldn’t have done that, or whatever. They would look at it, but they would always be looking at it with slightly jaish eye it, which obviously some of it bought on by, I suppose.

Jealousy. Why didn’t, I think it,

William Ross: [00:15:00] obviously you, you ran your dad’s box in your car. Yeah. What other race cars did you guys try it out in? Or did someone start using it on a continuous basis? I mean, how much success did that have in the racing?

David Hobbs: Well, it had a lot of success, but dad always had the problem of manufacturing, you know, that everybody wanted him to make the gearbox.

They didn’t wanna make it themselves. Ford had a lot of prototypes. We never had the gearbox in any other racing applications except that race where I met Bill France. Jimmy Clark drove my load sleep in the GT rate in the very first, what was now the Rolex 12 hour, which was in those days, the continental three hour, which is what took me to Daytona just a few weeks after I was.

Colin Chapman had called me back in like October and said, could we borrow your car for Jimmy Clark to drive in America? So they borrowed it. They flew in over there, they and Jimmy Clark drove it and he was leading the class by about five minutes. And unfortunately when he came here for a one and only fuel stop, the start had [00:16:00] got Friday and it wouldn’t start when dad’s company finally went belly up at the end of 63.

Which is just over a year and a half later on the floor on the shop floor was a five speed automatic Formula one car for Colin Chapman. So Colin Chapman had certainly tweaked that this was the way to go. Dad had had designed and developed and manufactured a gearbox for him, which never actually got used.

But Dad spent a lot of time also with Jack Braman. Jack Braman came to see Dad on multiple occasions asking to talk to him about putting the automatic in the Formula One car. You know, it, it would’ve been perfect. I mean, obviously now with electronic controls instead of hydraulic, it would’ve been better.

Obviously, you know, things have gone way further than dad had, but he was the first guy to build a four speed automatic transmission. Although, uh, Jim Hall gets the credit for having the first automatic racer. I’m not sure that I didn’t beat him to it in 1959 with mum’s boys up, but I’m sure. That will certainly go [00:17:00] unheralded.

Even if it was the case, we never, we never raced it in anything else.

Crew Chief Eric: So let’s go back to the club racing scene. I want to get a better understanding of what that meant because when we look back on the history with our eyes now, we see famous names, Graham Hill, Roy, Salvador, Jack, Sears, as you mentioned, racing in these race.

The caliber of the racing and the British club racing scene. In my mind, I’m thinking when I hear club racing, I think SECA, like grassroots, amateur racing, but you already had these pro drivers in there. Was it a feeder system to something else? Were the pro drivers using it just to make money? Were they using it to jump off to bigger races like LAMA or SPA or something like that?

Kind of tell us about how it worked.

David Hobbs: It certainly wasn’t ever used. I mean, no professional driver ever went back at the club racing. We had a lot of races in England, which would be national races. They would be club racers sort to, but they’d be very high end club racing. Not really club racing. When you got people like Graham Hill, obviously Graham Hill started club racing.

They all did. I mean, Jimmy Clark [00:18:00] started in club racing. I did. Everybody did Sterling mos. Of course there was no go-karting, so you could take that outta the equation and nobody could start until they were 17 in England because you had to have a driving license before you could race a car. Unlike today, where you can race a four in one car when you’re 12 if you got the skill.

Yeah, some of that racing. In England there was, we had a lot of racing in England, which was a, was a very high level and it was basically semi-professional. Now the prize money was obviously negligible. Club racing, had no prize money. Very, very small cups. Trophies.

Jon Summers: You were in Leamington Spa. David, how far would you travel?

Would you travel all the way up to Scotland for a race or,

David Hobbs: well, I never did, but I did go, uh, I think the farthest north I went was Alton Park and the far south I went was Goodwood. I never raced at Castle. Coon raced a lot of Silverson because it was close to home, which is at Leamington Park Race at Mallory Park.

I don’t even know that Mallory Parks exist. Race at Alton Park Ston. Dub that [00:19:00]

Jon Summers: Mallory does say exists. I was there a couple of summers ago watching, uh, motorcycle racing. Oh yeah. Yeah. So got the front end light over the start finish. Yeah.

David Hobbs: I like Mallory Park. Yeah. Had some good race at Mallory. I won a race there.

Load as things had moved on in 1965. I won the, I won the sports car race and load the T 70, which is a bit of a handful around Murray Park. So, I mean, I mean I drove, I drove the Jag and I drove the Morris to and from the races, the elite. We did have a two wheel trailer, but it was an open trailer. It was just a two wheel trailer, and I had a Ford Zephyr to pull it with.

So we had about two spare wheels, maybe a jack and a hammer, and that was sort of about it really. Club racing in America. Now it’s just so bizarrely. Club racing. I mean, everybody comes with a closed trailer and a mechanic and a manager and all sorts of high tech equipment and yeah, everybody got racing tires, obviously.

But it is just a completely different situation to, uh, [00:20:00] the club racing. I started with now club racing in England also has evolved and a modern club racing. I have no idea. I’m, I haven’t been back to England for a club race for. 40 years probably. So I don’t follow it, but I’m sure it also has advanced enormously from my day.

My day was real, real amateur stuff. No driver schools. Jim Ru started the first driver school at Sefton, but he didn’t start that till. The mid sixties, it was very different and it really was club racing. Spent more time in the cafe, in the pub, in the bar after the racing we did.

Crew Chief Eric: Going back to John Coombs for a moment, when he took delivery of the Ferrari, you were already in the States, am I to understand that correctly?

David Hobbs: Probably still there, but. I don’t particularly remember him taking delivery of it. All I know is a grave hill suddenly appeared in it, you know, instead of the lightweight, he’d suddenly eat type.

Crew Chief Eric: So having encountered John and, and you mentioned that he was a bit posh, is there any reasoning behind the white paint that he chose?

Was it to stick out because he [00:21:00] wanted to sell more cars if he raced on Sunday, went on Monday sort of thing? Or was there a reason behind the white?

David Hobbs: No idea. Probably didn’t like it. He used to wear very light gray suits or maybe light gray. But what,

Crew Chief Eric: let’s talk a little bit more about the drivers. I’m sure you’ve got some on your mind, William, that David has already mentioned that we kind of wanna dig into a little bit more that either owned this Ferrari or drove and raced this Ferrari at some point.

William Ross: Well, I mean you get into, you know, obviously with the club racing, but at what point to take that step up, was there something in between club racing and then professional, obviously like, you know, Mike Parks and that, but then you had. Jack Sears stepping up, but then you know, Roy Salvador and that jumping in, I mean, where’s that stuff?

Is it just a big leap from club racing all of a sudden now you’re going against the big guys or how did that kind of progress?

David Hobbs: Absolutely, yeah. I mean, you are racing, club racing and obviously it was a feed of system of sorts beyond drivers. Obviously there were some older drivers, not many, and a lot of people that did club racing had no interest in going any further.

People like me [00:22:00] and Jack Sears and Graham Hill and Jimmy Clark. They had designed on, on going into professional racing, even though there wasn’t much money in it. Really very little money at the time. Well, I think when Jimmy Clark won the World Championship, the first year he won, I think his total take was about a hundred thousand pounds.

You know, now we talk about drivers who are getting two and a half billion dollars a race, but then a hundred thousand pounds back in 1962 was significantly, yeah, would be a lot more than that now. But I mean, yeah, I just won some races and then people started asking me if I would drive for them. In better club race club racers that might have some money attached.

And they would actually ask me how much money I wanted to drive, or they would tell me how much, and I would say, well, how about 50 pounds more? Or whatever. And we’d sort of haggle over of the driving fee, which was pretty low. It’d be somewhere between 25 and a hundred pounds. But also in club racing, when you started to do well.[00:23:00]

Like I did with the elite, the elite became successful, so it became somewhat of a draw. You could go to someone like Clive Worm Layton who ran Mallory Park and you could ring him up and you say, look, I’m wanting to enter the the B-R-S-C-C race. In May. How about some starting money? And they’d say, Ooh, I dunno about that.

People starting money. And you’d say, well, I don’t want much. I didn’t want like a hundred pounds. And you’d finally, you’d settle on about 50 and so you would get some money, but there was no prize money. But there was what we call starting money, you know, appearance, money really is what it was pretty low, but still.

Literally

Jon Summers: just pick up the phone and Yeah. Yeah. And call the track owner and, and say when you were planning the season Yeah. Just to see where you could

David Hobbs: Yeah. Called call the guys at Silverton and try and get some starting money.

Jon Summers: Yeah. Years ago, Orlando C told me that those of you that used to be like roll.

Representatives, or whatever the phrase was when [00:24:00] asking for payment from a TV company or a journalist or something. What he used to do was he and Y and Mass, I think was the other guy used to do it with, they would ask what Sterling asked for and then ask for half of that. Now that gives the impression that everyone talked amongst themselves.

So would you talk with Graham Hill and if Graham Hill was getting a hundred dollars starting money, you might ask for 50 or 75. Was it like that?

David Hobbs: Well, I wouldn’t be talking to Graham Hill ’cause he would been above me, but I’d be talking to other club drivers, people like Chris Ashmore and David Piper and Richard Atwood, you know, people like that.

We were all, where we all started together. Graham was a good bit ahead of me. He is like four or five years ahead of me. You know, I never get my first races when I drove in professional races and I was driving against people like Graham Hill or Jack Sears, Michael Parks, you know, I could find, hardly believe that I was actually in the same race that they were in, you know, where they’d actually talk to me or say something.

You

GROUP: know,

David Hobbs: Graham Hill usually had somebody horrible to say. But other than that, everybody else was fairly nice. So[00:25:00]

Crew Chief Eric: let’s talk a little bit more about Jack Sears. He owned the car for how long? William?

William Ross: Uh, he had it for a long time. 30 years. What does he own? The one car he owned that GTO for a long time, you know, after it kind of, I guess you’d say retired from professional racing, you know, he took it a lot of club racing and stuff.

But Jack owned that car for

Jon Summers: a long time. Oh yeah. After John Coombs had it. Jack’s his, seems to have had it all the way through the 1970s. Oh, did he? There’s quite a lot of photographs of Jack Sears with the car painted red. With it being around, uh, events. I was sort of. Surprise, the number plate is EUP.

And I’ve realized that it appeared in a number of books that I’d looked at and I think I may have even seen it. Uh, shows,

David Hobbs: believe it or not, I’m not really a huge car man. I really only race ’cause I like the racing. I’m very poor on cars. You asked me what model that is. I mean, I’d say I don’t know I’m gonna, but I mean, Jack Sears was a gentleman farmer.

He had a pretty big farm [00:26:00] out in East Anglia, didn’t he? Hell of a driver and a, and a absolutely terrific guy. I mean, he was such a g he was a real GI liked Jack a lot and he was very, very fast. But yeah, I, I didn’t realize, I didn’t realize he owned that car, but I see it’s gonna be an auction down here in Florida and then

William Ross: Yeah, in January at comb.

David Hobbs: Yeah.

William Ross: Yeah. You know, going back in, obviously trying to make the jag make it turn into lightweight to compete with the fraud, besides trying to improve the motor, get more horsepower and making it lighter. Do you know what else they attempted to do or did on that Jag to try and get it more competitive with that Ferrari?

David Hobbs: Not really. I was doing on my own thing, so I, I don’t really know, but I mean I drove that XJ 13, which was gonna be their next big thing. That’s awesome. By that time, Jaar was somewhat constrained by the fact they’ve now become part of British Leland, and of course the guy that ran British Leland, was it the Donald Stokes period?

Yeah. Stokes exactly. S he put the kibosh on the, uh, [00:27:00] XJ 13. He just said, forget it, put it away. Because Richard Atwood and I, I, I drove it four or five times at Myra. Mike Kimberley was the engineer in charge, and Malcolm Sayer, the, you know, the renowned body work guy from Jag was there, and Sir William was there.

Lofty was there, obviously. And a couple of mechanics and we ran it on Sunday morning at six o’clock in the morning in sort of in secret. Ultimately it was exposed. We went to a test day at Silverstone and Richard Atwin and I drove it. It was Richard’s first time in it to give them a, a workless, you know, of what needed to be done.

’cause we were running five or six seconds off things like GT forties. And the reason that Lofty wanted me to test the car and not Norman Jewish, who was the Jaguar test driver. Because by that time I had driven GT forties, lower T seventies and other big engine powerful stuff. So he asked me to drive it.

Norman Dures never quite got over it. He was pissed off to the end of his life that I’d driven the car.

William Ross: What was the potential you [00:28:00] feel for that car? I mean, do you feel with enough work on it, you know, engineering, that that could have been competitive with the GT forties?

David Hobbs: Well, the best thing about it by a country mile was its engine.

It had the twin overhead cam version of the V 12, which back in 1967 was giving 570 horsepower. I mean, it was an incredible engine. In 1967, the car was very ancient. It had the E type type of suspension where the drive shaft is like your bottom link. It had rubber bushings everywhere. It had Dunlop disc brakes, and Dunlop hadn’t made disc brakes for years.

It had like seven inch rims on the back and five inch rims on the front, where now we replicate GT forces, which had got 11 or 12 inch rims on the back and it had an all done up our five race tires on it. So it was very difficult to get a really good feel of how good it was. And of course, that Malcolm Sayer, that swoopy looking body was so fantastic at Lamar back in the fifties when you know you were looking for air, that [00:29:00] you were looking for speed.

Relatively low horsepower, but you know, the days of downforce had started to appear, the lower T 70 dad flaps on the front and they had a, a, uh, spoiler at the back. Just didn’t have any of that. This was very slippery, but probably had horrible lift at speed, front end, lift at speed. I think the car needed a lot.

Richard and I gave them a, a good work list, which would’ve helped obviously decent sized wheels and tires, but made a. You’ve only gotta look at the difference in Formula One between the soft tire and the medium tire for qualifying to see the difference between a 1960s Dunlop R five Treaded Tire, which is like maybe six inches wide and a tire that’s got a slick no, no tread or very, very, those very early slicks.

A bit of tread, a little tiny tread about 12 inches inches wide. I mean, just right there. You, you are looking at four or five seconds.

William Ross: Yeah.

David Hobbs: And then of course, would the car have stood that sort of the chassis when the chassis started to flex badly? Um, when you’re [00:30:00] starting to put the loads and those tires could generate through it.

If you added some sort of spoiler or wing to it. So I don’t know. But the engine would’ve certainly been right on the top of the tree. ’cause the GT fortune when I was driving the GT 40 for golf in 1968, I mean, they were giving about 385 horsepower. With the what? With the heads? The um, Westlake? Yeah. With those heads.

They were giving about 385 horsepower.

William Ross: Out of all the cars that you had the privilege of racing and driving, what was your favorite car?

David Hobbs: Well, I drove so many, it’s hard to tell, but I think the GT 40 was a very special car in its day. I mean, it was great long distance car. The engine, by the time I got round to drive 68, were pretty reliable.

Had that beautiful ZF gearbox, which was terrific. It, uh, was reasonably slippery. It had very little down force, and it was really easy to drive and easy to set up. Small adjustments of roll bars and bit of ride height and maybe a camba, little bit of camba change would make a big [00:31:00] difference. Didn’t get too hot inside, which was great for long distance racing.

Had good visibility and it had no vices. It didn’t have any severe push on certain corners or snap over steer or anything like that, so it, it was a good car to drive. The 9 62, you know, 10 years later was another incredible long distance car. I mean, amazing, reliable as hell. You run a whole thousand kilometer race, then you go to the next thousand kilometer race and run all the practice sessions and on that same engine, then you might put a fresh engine for the race.

You might not. So that was a hell of a car. Single seaters. Probably one of the best cars I ever drove was M 16 at, uh, Indy in 1974. The McLaren, that was a hell of a car, but in some ways the very best car I ever drove was the last McLaren Canam, the M 20, which had been Peter Re’s car in 1972. Then McLaren pulled out because of the Porsche on saw and I drove that car in Carly Black label colors [00:32:00] for uh, Roy Woods in 1973.

And that was a hell of a, I can see why McLaren had won the championship for like five years, six years in a row ’cause it was just slightest touch to a flat change or ride height. Major magic difference. Had incredible traction. One of our best races probably ever was in the, uh, cannon race at Watkins Land in 1973.

I came second to Mark Donahue in the 9 17 30 against which we had absolutely no hope ’cause it had about three, at least 300 awards about, and we did. And I beat all the other nine seventeens. The, with Brian Redmond and Jody Shechter, George Farmer, and a bunch of other, no name has been, never was drivers, you know, like that.

People like Shechter know, obviously. No good at all. To me, that was one of my best ever races. Uh, came second to, uh, Dar

Crew Chief Eric: so to go back to drivers for a second, one of the other folks that drove the white Ferrari that we’ve been talking about. Oh, we’re talking about a white Ferrari. Are we, we were, we were, yeah.

David Hobbs: Carry on. [00:33:00]

Crew Chief Eric: So Roy Salvadori, did you have any interactions with him? Can you tell us anything about him? His personality, his driving?

David Hobbs: Well, Roy was another driver who, who I couldn’t believe I was racing against ’cause there’d been a name for my youth. But of course Roy was really all those guys. The only guy that really, really, really, really, really, really meant it was Stern.

All the others, I mean, Graham, Graham, Hilde, but Sterling was the ultimate professional. I mean, he was the first real professional driver. I mean, he worked out, he didn’t drink much. He didn’t have sex the night before the race, an more that was supposed to do, but he thought he was so sterling was, was the man and, uh, he was the man really to beat.

He, he was the guy that sort of would accept standard. The Roy Sam was obviously incredibly good. Winning Lamont with, uh, Carol Shelby, 1959. I mean, I knew Roy. I didn’t know any of ’em very well, but he was always a bit of a hero of mine. It was very quick.

Crew Chief Eric: So speaking of heroes, and I know this is a soft spot for [00:34:00] John Summers, John being a expert in the history of Mike Hawthorne, was Hawthorne an inspiration for you?

Was he a hero? Did he inspire you to go into racing?

David Hobbs: Well, unfortunately he didn’t because he was up against Sterling. Although he handed to Sterling, he gave Hawthorne. His championship. It hadn’t been for Sterling. Mos Hawthorne would never have won that championship because Hawthorne spun in the Portuguese Grand Prix, which was in downtown Lisbon.

And to rejoin the track, he drove against the traffic and he was disqualified and sterling ever. The gent went to the stewards afterwards. Of course, unlike the stewards today. They listened to driver input. Sterling said, I say chaps, that’s a bit unkind. You know, I mean, the chap had to go back ’cause he had spun the car.

So he, he had to, to rejoin the race. He, he had to go against the traffic, you know, but not for long and didn’t hurt anybody without the way, so they reinstated Hawthorne who won the championship by one [00:35:00] point. If you don’t be for Sterling, you would never won it. Sterling would’ve won it. He’s won and only championship.

But I liked Hawthorne and loved England, loved him. He thought he was the best six to sliced bread because he was. That English gen always wore his bows tie always down the pub having a drink. But I recognized even then that Sterling just had that extra something. Mike didn’t, I mean, not to say that Mike wasn’t a hell of a driver.

I mean, he was an incredible driver, but to me, Sterling was, I mean, I was only like 14 or 15. So Albert Sterling to me was the bee’s needs.

Jon Summers: David, you’ve said a, a couple of things about Lofty, sort of taking a personal shine to you and you just applied there. He sort of took a personal shine to Mike Hawthorn.

I mean, I always felt like Mike Hawthorn was quite a good. Advertisement for Jaguar cars. He was. Do you think Lofty England was thinking like that or literally do you think it was looking back on your relationship with Lofty England, do you think he was just like, this is he’s one of us. I just like the guy [00:36:00] personally.

I can work with him personally. Do you think that’s what it was, or?

David Hobbs: I think he just had a lot of respect for Mike. I do know he was a great fan of Mike, but I’m not quite sure about their relationship other than I don’t know how well he knew him In my case. The only reason he liked me was. I lived in a place called American House, which is halfway between Leviton and Coventry, and I would come out the drive on my motorbike, going to work as an apprentice.

A lofty would go swooping by an E type, so I would race him to work going to, uh, Brown’s Lane. The only thing is when I got there, lofty would be standing arms at Kimba and he’d look at his watch. Ho, I’m supposed to be here at nine o’clock. You are supposed to be here at eight.

But then when I drove the Jag, my dad’s Jag, having rolled it at the first race, I had it repaired by one of the guys in the body shop at Jag. He repaired it at his house in dorm tree in the garden shed at the bottom of his garden. And he [00:37:00] knocked out. We had to get a new hood ’cause the hood had opened on the way home.

And uh, I was with my girlfriend Margaret, who’s in the other room now painting. So I repaired it. Unfortunately, when Joe went to spray repainted, it was duck in blue. By the time he got home from work, it was like a May evening, so it was about seven o’clock by the time he got around to spraying it. So it was a typical English May evening.

The humidity was high, so the car came out. It was a mat car, Matt finish, which today of course is very groovy. But this was a rough mat. This wasn’t as smooth, Matt. This was, this was, and the hood was a real makeshift job. Knocked up the hood out of sort of canvas or something. So he always looked terrible, but as I say, he was often the clerk of the course.

He had saw me at one race, race for DB four and we swapped leads pass, pass, REPA pass, rep pass, and eventually I won the race. He was probably a 10 and a on the club circle at Silver, the club circle as it was. Lofty. He thought I’d done a good job. He said, what I like about you Holmes, is you, you race, you race well.

You [00:38:00] race like you mean it. And he said, I like that. That’s very commendable. And from then on he, he followed my career. So, uh, he became a bit of a fan. So that’s how uh,

Jon Summers: you lofty. What was your bike? So I can pick to you racing him to work.

David Hobbs: When I was 16, my parents bought me a lamb better. Scooter, me and Margaret used to drive around flat out on his scooter.

I go about 55 mile an hour. So I swapped in the board of T Triumph speed twin, which was before the swinging arm. He’d only had a sprung hub, which had suspension without that much, you know, bug roll suspension. And uh, we used to drive around a couple of lunatics on that bike. I love that bike. It was driven so smooth, silky smooth, silky smooth by the horizontal twin engine was terrific.

American police used to have those triumph speed twins and the triumph tiger one hundreds in those days. So, uh, that’s what I like to ride. I wouldn’t wanna write it now, but,

Crew Chief Eric: well gentlemen, I think that’s been an interesting look back into [00:39:00] early 1960s British motorsport. I appreciate David joining us yet again to come on the show and talk to us.

I think we got what we need, right?

GROUP: I think so. Uh, nice to meet you. That’s fantastic. Thank you very much, David. Thank you for your time. Thanks David. I’m sure we’ll meet again.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s been a pleasure. Thank you, David.

GROUP: Alright, thank you Eric.

Crew Chief Eric: We hope you enjoyed another awesome episode of Break Fix Podcasts, brought to you by Grand Tour Motorsports. If you’d like to be a guest on the show or get involved, be sure to follow us on all social media platforms at Grand Touring Motorsports. And if you’d like to learn more about the content of this episode, be sure to check out the follow on article@gtmotorsports.org.

We remain a commercial free and no annual fees organization through our sponsors, but also through the generous support of our fans, families, and friends through Patreon. For as little as $2 and 50 cents a month, you can get [00:40:00] access to more behind the scenes action, additional pit stop, minisodes and other VIP goodies, as well as keeping our team of creators.

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Highlights

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00 Special Guest: David Hobbs
  • 01:23 Early Racing Days; Apprenticeship and Career Beginnings
  • 03:13 Racing Success and Challenges
  • 08:30 Club Racing Insights
  • 14:59 Technical Innovations and Gearbox Development
  • 17:04 Evolution of Club Racing
  • 21:11 Exploring the Drivers of the Ferrari 250 GTO
  • 21:23 The Journey from Club Racing to Professional Racing
  • 22:29 Negotiating Driving Fees and Starting Money
  • 25:02 Jack Sears and His Long-Term Ownership of the GTO
  • 26:35 The Jaguar XJ13 and Its Untapped Potential
  • 30:23 Favorite Cars and Memorable Races
  • 33:07 Sterling Moss and Other Racing Legends
  • 35:33 Lofty England’s Influence and Personal Stories
  • 38:55 Concluding Thoughts and Farewell

Bonus Content

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All of our BEHIND THE SCENES (BTS) Break/Fix episodes are raw and unedited, and expressly shared with the permission and consent of our guests.

Central to Hobbs’ early racing was his father’s pioneering four-speed automatic gearbox. Installed in a Lotus Elite, the gearbox offered both automatic and manual override, making it uniquely suited for racing. Hobbs recalls how Colin Chapman borrowed the car for Jim Clark to drive at Daytona in 1962, underscoring the gearbox’s potential. Though the company ultimately folded, the innovation left its mark – years ahead of its time.


Club Racing: Grassroots Yet Star-Studded

British club racing in the 1960s was a curious mix: grassroots in spirit, yet populated by names who would become legends. Graham Hill, Jim Clark, Jack Sears, Roy Salvadori, and Stirling Moss all cut their teeth in these events. Prize money was negligible, but “starting money” or appearance fees kept drivers motivated. Hobbs describes phoning track owners directly to negotiate fees – sometimes as little as £25, sometimes closer to £100.

Unlike today’s polished club racing scene, the era was raw. Cars were often driven to the track, trailers were minimal, and spares consisted of little more than a jack and a hammer. Yet the racing was fiercely competitive, with modified street cars thrilling spectators.

British Club Race 1961, Photo courtesy Jon Summers, The Motoring Historian

John Coombs, Jaguar dealer and gentleman racer, became a central figure in this landscape. His cars – always painted white – were driven by Graham Hill and others, and when the Jaguar E-Type proved uncompetitive, Coombs turned to Ferrari. The arrival of the 250 GTO (above) shifted the balance, inspiring Jaguar to develop the lightweight E-Type in response.

Hobbs recalls the rivalry vividly: the Ferrari’s V12 and chassis gave it the edge, though Jaguar engineers worked tirelessly to close the gap. Over time, lightweight E-Types evolved far beyond their origins, but in the early 1960s, the GTO remained the benchmark.

After Coombs, the GTO passed into the hands of Jack Sears, as Hobbs puts it “a gentleman farmer and formidable driver.” Sears owned the car for decades, racing it extensively and preserving its legacy. Today, the car, having bared the registration EUP 4 for a time was a fixture at historic events and more importantly – is now up for auction – serves as a living reminder of the era’s glamour and grit.


The Spirit of the Era

For Hobbs, the essence of 1960s club racing was its authenticity. Drivers were amateurs in the truest sense, racing for passion rather than fortune. The paddocks were filled with camaraderie, pub gatherings after races, and the thrill of competing against future world champions.

Looking back, Hobbs acknowledges the Ferrari’s superiority but celebrates the ingenuity, determination, and character of the British racing scene. It was a time when innovation – like his father’s gearbox – could change the game, and when club racing served as the crucible for motorsport legends.


Guest Co-Host: William Ross

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Guest Co-Host: Jon Summers

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Ferrari, Provenance, and the Collector’s Dream: A Four‑Part Mini‑Series

Few cars command reverence like the Ferrari 250 GTO. With only 36 built, each carries a mythology of racing triumphs, engineering quirks, and ownership sagas. This mini‑series of conversations – spanning historians, auction executives, and Ferrari specialists – traces the story of chassis 3729GT, the only GTO painted Bianco Speciale (white), and expands into the broader culture of Ferrari collecting, culminating in the Bachman Collection’s appearance at MECUM Kissimmee.

Episode 1: Spotlight on Chassis 3729GT

In this episode of the Ferrari Marketplace Podcast, William Ross from the Exotic Car Marketplace discusses the legendary Ferrari 250 GTO “Bianco Speciale”, with a special focus on chassis 3729GT, the only white GTO ever produced. Guests Sam Murtaugh from MECUM Auctions and Chris Miele from the Prancing Horse of Nashville join to explore the unique history, specifications, and modifications of this rare car. The conversation covers its racing pedigree, ownership history, and upcoming auction at MECUM’s Kissimmee event. The podcast also delves into auction logistics and the significance of showcasing high-value cars like the GTO. Additionally, the episode highlights the broader MECUM auction experience, including entertainment, events, and logistics. The hosts emphasize the importance of documentation and the evolving nature of collector car sales, framing the upcoming auction as a historic moment in the Ferrari collector market.

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  • Unique identity: The sole GTO delivered in white, one of only eight right‑hand drive examples.
  • Racing pedigree: Driven by Graham Hill, Roy Salvadori, and Mike Parks, with period modifications for cooling and aerodynamics.
  • Ownership lineage: Long‑term custodianship by Jack Sears (1970–1999) and later John Shirley, former Microsoft executive, who restored it to its original white.
  • Auction significance: Its appearance at MECUM Kissimmee marks a rare public sale of a GTO, positioning it as a headline attraction.


Episode 2: The Historian’s Lens

This episode of The Motoring Historian focuses on the history of John Coombs’ 1962 Ferrari 250 GTO, also known as “Bianco Speciale,” the only white GTO from the factory. Coombs was a prominent British car dealer and race car tuner, known for his work with Jaguars in the post-war period. The discussion delves into Coombs’ pivotal role in car racing and his rivalry with other notable figures like Mike Hawthorn. It also explores Coombs’ decision-making, including his choice for a right-hand drive configuration and the specific racing modifications made to the GTO. The narrative touches on broader themes of car manufacturing, racing strategies, and automobile culture in the 1960s, providing insights into the significance of this particular GTO in automotive history. The script culminates with a discussion on the car’s market value and its auctioning by MECUM Auctions, highlighting its unique features and provenance.

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Jon Summers, “The Motoring Historian,” contextualizes the car within British racing culture:

  • John Coombs’ legacy: A Jaguar dealer and tuner who turned to Ferrari when the E‑Type proved uncompetitive.
  • Jaguar connection: Coombs allegedly loaned the GTO to Jaguar engineers, influencing the development of lightweight E‑Types.
  • Right‑hand drive rationale: Beyond national preference, Coombs may have sought performance advantages on clockwise circuits.
  • Color symbolism: White and black were Coombs’ racing colors, distinguishing his cars in a sea of British Racing Green and Italian Rosso Corsa.

Episode 3: Provenance and Value

In this episode, William Ross from the Exotic Car Marketplace and guest David Neyens from Motorcopia.com delve into the intricate details of Ferrari’s legendary 250 GTO, one of which is set to cross the block at Mecum Auctions. They discuss the car’s rich provenance, including its one-of-a-kind “Bianco Speciale” color, its status as one of only eight right-hand drive models, and its storied history with notable drivers like Graham Hill and Roy Salvadori. David provides an in-depth market analysis and valuation estimate, predicting the car could fetch upwards of $63 million. They also highlight the importance of documentation and the evolving mindset of high-net-worth individuals investing in such rare automobiles. The episode underscores the excitement and historical significance of the Ferrari 250 GTO, making it a highly anticipated lot in the upcoming auction.

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David Neyens of Motorcopia.com adds depth:

  • Production numbers: Debate over 36 vs. 39 GTOs, reflecting Ferrari’s hand‑built variability.
  • Engine saga: Original V12 separated and used in a Cooper F1 car; later replaced with a factory‑cast block, ensuring authenticity.
  • Market history: Public auction appearances are rare – only three in the past decade – with values ranging from $38M to $70M depending on provenance.
  • Drivers and lore: Graham Hill, Roy Salvadori, and others embody the era when professional and “gentleman drivers” blurred together.

Episode 4: The Bachman Collection

In the final episode of the mini-series, host William Ross along with special guests Chris Miele from Prancing Horse of Nashville and Sam Murtaugh from MECUM Auctions contribute to the conversation by focusing on the Bachman Collection, a notable assemblage of Ferrari models with exceptionally low mileage. They outline the Ferrari Classiche certification process, emphasize the importance of original components and low-mileage cars, and spotlight several key models from the collection, including the two 288 GTO, multiple F40s, an F50, and the LaFerrari. Miele and Murtaugh provide anecdotes about the collection’s owner, Phil Bachman, and his dedication to preserving and maintaining his cars in pristine condition. The podcast anticipates high excitement and strong interest as these prestigious Ferraris go across the auction block at the MECUM Kissimmee auction.

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The series expands beyond the GTO to MECUM’s broader Ferrari offerings:

  • Classiche certification: Red, yellow, and gray “books” authenticate originality, adding provenance.
  • Highlights:
    • 166MM: Early Ferrari delivered to the U.S., raced in period.
    • 275 GTB/4 Alloy: One of only 16 alloy‑bodied examples, praised as among the finest surviving.
    • 400i Manual: Rare manual gearbox variant, one of just 388 built.
    • 288 GTO: Single‑owner car with rare luggage option, only ~1,200 miles.
    • F40s: Two single‑owner cars with ultra‑low mileage, original tires preserved.
    • F50: The elusive supercar, tied to stories of factory politics and personal determination.
  • Auction logistics: MECUM’s “collections team” ensures careful handling, while Kissimmee’s scale – 5,000 cars over 13 days – creates a spectacle unmatched in the collector world.

Together, these episodes paint a portrait of Ferrari collecting as equal parts passion, provenance, and performance. The white GTO stands as a singular artifact of racing history, while the Bachman Collection demonstrates how rarity and meticulous preservation shape modern values. More than machines, these cars are cultural touchstones – symbols of competition, craftsmanship, and the enduring allure of Ferrari.


Guest Co-Host: William Ross

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Guest Co-Host: Jon Summers

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Guest Co-Host: David Neyens

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TEAM AMERICA Makes Its In-Person Debut at Women With Drive V & PRI – A New Era for U.S. Sim Racing

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Init Esports is proud to announce a historic milestone for American sim-racing talent: the first-ever in-person TEAM AMERICA national events are heading to Women With Drive V and the Performance Racing Industry (PRI) Show this December. As the official sponsor and racing hardware provider of TEAM AMERICA, MOZA Racing will play a central role in elevating the competition and celebrating the next generation of U.S. sim racers.

Women With Drive V
— Celebrating the Future of Women in Motorsports
will be held at the Indianapolis Convention Center | December 8–10, 2025

As a dedicated supporter of Women in Motorsports North America (WIMNA), Init Esports will bring three state-of-the-art simulators — fully equipped with MOZA Racing hardware — to Women With Drive V, where the leaders, athletes, and trailblazers of motorsport gather to move the industry forward.

All attendees, including drivers, team owners, and motorsport executives, will get the chance to strap in for a Hot Lap Challenge. The fastest female racer will take home a MOZA R5 Direct Drive Racing Bundle, igniting new pathways for women to compete in esports and beyond.

PRI
— The First-Ever TEAM AMERICA Booth & Time Trial Showdown
will be held at PRI Show Sim Racing Arena –  Lucas Oil Stadium booth 9209, Indianapolis | December 10–13, 2025

Following Women With Drive V, Init Esports brings TEAM AMERICA to the PRI Show floor in the Sim Racing Arena for its first official national competition.

There is still one more online event for TEAM America, on Dec 6th (register here), but invites have been prepared for the Top 12 racers from the 2025 TEAM AMERICA Online Series to come and battle for national glory in real life — powered by MOZA Racing, in Indianapolis. The high-stakes TEAM AMERICA Time Trial Challenge takes place on Saturday afternoon Dec 13, featuring rapid-fire sessions and epic racing energy.

From Thursday and Friday, PRI Show attendees can also jump into the sims to set their best times — a chance to qualify for the Saturday Finale, where they’ll face the top American talent head-to-head.

Michael Good, PRI President: “The PRI Show has always been about pushing the boundaries of motorsports innovation, and sim racing is a natural extension of that mission. TEAM AMERICA’s debut at PRI represents a pivotal moment for U.S. esports racing, bringing together technology, talent, and opportunity under one roof. We’re proud to host the Time Trial Challenge and showcase how virtual racing is creating real-world pathways for the next generation of competitors.”

At the conclusion of the event, the top performer from TEAM AMERICA will earn the opportunity to become a MOZA U.S. Ambassador — a driver who will become an official MOZA athlete and represent the United States on the global stage.

Don’t Miss the Action

Be part of the breakout moment for U.S. esports motorsport: Follow @InitEsports  to support the best American racers as they rise toward international stardom. This is TEAM AMERICA. Faster Together. The 2026 Calendar of racing will be revealed officially on site.


More Screen to Speed…

Dive into the journeys of remarkable individuals making waves in sim racing and bridging the virtual with the real. From the thrill of digital circuits to the roar of real-life racetracks, they explore the passion, dedication, and innovation that drives the world of motorsports. They hear from athletes, creators, and pioneers sharing their stories, insights, and the powerful ways sim racing is connecting communities and creating pathways into motorsports.

INIT eSports focuses on sim racing events and digital tournaments. They bring eSports content to fans and sponsorship opportunities to brands, while maximizing audience reach across multiple sports, industries, and platforms. INIT eSports is a woman-led company where Diversity, Equity, Inclusion and Accessibility is in their DNA, and their platform aims to combat bullying and cheating to help make the eSports world as safe and fair as possible. To learn more, be sure to logon to www.initesports.gg today or follow them on social media @initesports, join their discord, check out their YouTube Channel, or follow their live content via Twitch.

At INIT eSports, founder and CEO Stefy Bau doesn’t just settle for the ordinary. She creates extraordinary experiences by producing thrilling online competitions and real-life events that transcend the boundaries of the eSports universe. And she’s here with us on Break/Fix to share her story, and help you understand why you need to get more involved in the world of eSports. 

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About Performance Racing Industry

Performance Racing Industry fuels the passion for motorsports by building, promoting, and protecting the worldwide racing community. PRI supports the interests of racers, enthusiasts, builders, tracks, sanctioning bodies and businesses through legislative action and advocacy, its monthly business magazine Performance Racing Industry, and the world’s premier motorsports trade show, the PRI Show. PRI also supports businesses by providing market research, education and best practices in motorsports business and racing technology. For more information, visit PerformanceRacing.com.


About MOZA Racing

Founded in 2012 by a team of automotive engineers and simulation enthusiasts, MOZA Racing has grown into a global leader in sim racing and flight simulation hardware. Driven by innovation, performance, and a passion for realism, MOZA offers a wide range of products including direct drive wheelbases, steering wheels, pedals, flight controls, and truck sim gear. MOZA proudly partners with world-renowned names such as Automobili Lamborghini, Porsche, Mercedes-Benz, and MotoGP. Learn more about MOZA: www.mozaracing.com

So what do you think my car is worth?

In the ever-evolving world of collector cars, few voices carry the weight of experience and insight like David Neyens. Known for his meticulous catalog writing and deep auction expertise, Neyens has now launched Motorcopia.com – a data-driven platform designed to bring clarity and confidence to car collectors and investors navigating the marketplace.

We recently sat down with David on the Break/Fix podcast, alongside returning co-hosts Don Weberg (Garage Style Magazine) and William Ross (Exotic Car Marketplace), to explore how Motorcopia is redefining how we understand collector car value.

Tune in everywhere you stream, download or listen!

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Think of Motorcopia as a Bloomberg Terminal for the collector car world. It’s not an auction site or a photo gallery – it’s an intelligence platform built for decision-makers. Whether you’re a high-net-worth investor, a seasoned collector, or a professional advisor, Motorcopia offers:

  • Buy/Sell/Hold signals for specific models
  • Forecasting across short-, medium-, and long-term horizons
  • Deep dives into market liquidity, cultural relevance, and ownership costs
  • A concise, easy-to-navigate interface that avoids data overload

As William Ross put it: “It’s very straightforward… especially if it’s your car and you want to know where it’s sitting in the market right now.”

Spotlight

Synopsis

In this episode of Break/Fix podcast, the hosts explore the captivating world of collector cars and automotive journalism with special guest David Neyens. Known for his expertise in classic and exotic automobiles, David shares his journey from a career in financial services to becoming a trusted voice in auction catalogs. He introduces Motorcopia, a unique platform offering data-driven insights into the global collector car market, assisting enthusiasts, collectors, and investors in making informed decisions. The discussion delves into how Motorcopia’s detailed reports and data analyses help users determine whether to buy, sell, or hold specific car models. David emphasizes the importance of balancing passion with practicality and the role of elements such as preservation class and restoration in determining a car’s value. Additionally, the episode features returning co-hosts Don Weberg and William Ross, who contribute their expertise and insights into the intricacies of the automotive world.

  • David, you’ve had a long history in the collector car world—what inspired you to launch Motorcopia.com, and how does it build on your past experiences?
  • For those unfamiliar, how would you describe Motorcopia and the kind of information it provides to collectors and enthusiasts?
  • What types of data or insights do you find enthusiasts are most eager to explore when it comes to auctions and collector cars?
  • How do you see Motorcopia serving both seasoned collectors and those who are just beginning their journey into classic and exotic cars? 
  • With so many digital platforms emerging, what sets Motorcopia apart in terms of both its content and its mission?
  • If you look ahead five to ten years, how do you think data-driven insights will continue to influence the collector car industry?

Transcript

Crew Chief Brad: [00:00:00] Break Fix podcast is all about capturing the living history of people from all over the autos sphere, from wrench, turners, and racers to artists, authors, designers, and everything in between. Our goal is to inspire a new generation of Petrolhead that wonder. How did they get that job or become that person?

The road to success is paved by all of us because everyone has a story.

Crew Chief Eric: Tonight we are joined by a familiar name in the world of collector cars and automotive journalism. David Neyens known for his deep expertise in classic and exotic automobiles, has long been a trusted voice in auction catalogs and in the pages of enthusiast publications. Now he’s bringing that wealth of knowledge with Motorcopia.com, a unique platform dedicated to the intelligence and insights of the global collector car market

Don Weberg: from auction analysis and pricing trends to the fascinating stories behind the cars themselves.

Motorcopia is redefining [00:01:00] how enthusiast, collectors and investors understand the marketplace. In this episode, we’ll dive into David’s journey, the vision behind Motorcopia, and how data and passion are merging to shape the future of the car world.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s right, and joining us tonight are returning co-hosts Don Weiberg from Garage Style Magazine.

And William Ross from the Ferrari Marketplace, not just personalities on the Motoring Podcast network, but our car auction subject matter experts. So welcome back Don and William.

Don Weberg: Thank you.

Crew Chief Eric: This is gonna be fun. And with that, let’s welcome David to break fix.

David Neyens: Hello David. Hello everybody. Nice to meet you.

Crew Chief Eric: Like all good break, fix stories. Everyone has a superhero origin. Let’s talk about your long history in the collector car world. And what inspired you to launch Motorcopia.com and how does that build on all your past experiences?

David Neyens: Ever since I was just a little guy, I was always just obsessed with automobiles in general.

After a about 10 year stint in financial [00:02:00] services and banking was able to get into riding for a nearby collector car, auction house, and writing their catalogs. After a few visits, one of the tour guides, uh, mentioned he thought that I should give catalog writing a try, and that there might be, uh, an opportunity there.

So I purchased prior auction catalogs and just went over them just like I would a magazine or a book just kind of modeled their format and their style. Back in 2007, uh, unboxing day, I had the opportunity, I saw an ad actually where they were looking for catalog writers. The deal was you submit a test piece, pick a car of your choosing and give it a try, and if they.

Liked it. Then there was the possibility of an interview and a job working in the writing cataloging department there. As it happened very quickly, I was told they liked what I submitted. They were super busy with private collection sales and scheduled auctions. Asked if I’d be willing to interview, and they brought me on board pretty fast.

So that’s how I got my first few years in the business. After that went on my own in 2012 and, uh, with some help from a very good friend, uh, in the PR [00:03:00] industry in in California, Cindy Mele, she helped me to launch my next phase as a, as a freelance catalog writer and just became extremely busy. It’s been really rewarding.

I’ve met a lot of great people, uh, made a lot of great contacts with people and just continue that journey right to the present. And as far as Motorcopia goes, uh, as a new venture. That started back in May and June. I finished a major project for a customer, submitted my invoice and I’d been feeling a little bit tired, and then realized by then that I’d caught a terrible cold that put me on my back for about a month.

During that time, I thought, well, what can I do in addition to writing catalogs on my own where I can continue in the car field and, uh, try to do something different? And so the idea for Motorcopia came about. A lot of content creators do a better job of putting out great photography, great videos, online content.

That’s their space. With me being so deep in the market for so long, I decided to take data associated with collector car sales, process it, and [00:04:00] turn it into something that’s actionable for collectors and high net worth investors. People in, uh, their professional advisors as well, where I can give a buy seller a hold signal and also drill it down to specific models of cars, even.

Again, it was just simply because I was trying to find something different, something a new niche that no one else is really pursuing.

Don Weberg: Can you tell us exactly what is Motor

David Neyens: Copia? I was kind of inspired by, uh, there’s a fellow in, in the States. You’re all in the states. I’m in Canada. He, he writes, um, a newsletter that’s all about farming and agricultural commodities, investment strategies for farmers so that they can hedge their bets or get their crops to market at the right time.

Or maybe they hold onto them in a facility and they then sell them when the conditions are more favorable. That’s his business. He, and it’s just a no bones about it. He was a Chicago Board of Exchange trader at one time and just loved it. And he came from a farm and that’s what he did. So for me, it’s being able to take my love of cars.

Well, I love them all, but [00:05:00] you know, there’s some that are more electrifying than others or that are in more demand than others, and they actually apply a bit of a financial method to helping people to make decisions.

Don Weberg: But is it an auction platform? Form what? What are we looking at here?

David Neyens: What it is, it’s an information platform.

Think of it as kinda like a Bloomberg terminal setup for investors in the collector car market, or people that have high end collections and they want to know whether they need to buy, sell, or hold certain cars. Also, there’s the Motorcopia newsletter that works right from the website and with that I send out like a financial newsletter, but it’s geared completely to the collector car market and there’s a lot of crossover with the financial markets.

It’s a real hardcore nuts and bolts analysis. If you’re looking for good content and great pictures and stuff like that. I try to deliver that. The emphasis is on helping people to buy, sell, or hold and make those decisions with clarity.

William Ross: My opinion, you don’t need to worry about the pictures and that stuff because what you provide to someone is.

Basically the data and analytics down to specific models, which is fantastic for someone that’s [00:06:00] a very numbers driven Oh,

David Neyens: oh, right on.

William Ross: For those who have not gone on the website, you need to go on there. And what’s great about it too, it’s not like it’s crazy where it’s like, you know, you get some of these data driven sites, you get all this data so that you really, it’s kind of hard to make all It is so nice and concise.

It’s very straightforward and you can understand exactly what you need to find. To your point, buy, sell, hold. Just history of car, especially if maybe it’s just your car you’ve had for a long time. Hey, where’s my car sitting at in the market right now and what’s it been doing the past five years? If you haven’t been on site, you guys gotta go on the site ’cause it is really, really cool.

Don Weberg: Thank you. If I’m understanding correctly, if you go on the site, do you go back five years and show what those cars have been doing on the market, going up, going down, doing whatever? Is that what we’re kind of getting at?

David Neyens: Yeah, I’ve done two reports, really deep dives into the four GT Heritage Edition, the oh six four GT version.

Where that sits in that relationship, is it if it’s a buy, sell or a hold, the report breaks it down into immediate the next 30 days, one month to three months for short term, three months to 12 [00:07:00] months for a medium term, and then beyond that for a longer term view, sometimes a vehicle can be. An immediate term hold, but give it a year and it’s a buy depending on our forecasting, so we can drill right down and make forecasts.

And then I try to back test as well after certain auctions take place. Like at Monterey, I believe there are five or six of that four GT Heritage Edition that were offered and or sold. So I could look back and see, okay, was reserve too high on this offering? Was it priced right? What did they solve for and what does that mean for the future for those cars?

Because they were heading on a trajectory for a million plus dollars and really the sweet spot’s somewhere around 700, 750 right now for those cars. That’s borne out by auction experience and sales experience, online auctions, and also if there’s any private sale data that’s known.

Don Weberg: You picked on specifically the GT heritage.

Why that car? How do you choose the cars that are on the system? How many cars are on the system

David Neyens: Right now, I’m doing it more on a [00:08:00] demand basis, and I’m also picking and choosing bellwether type cars. That would be like a blue chip in the market. Something that’s got a certain amount of confirmed sales.

It’s got some interesting dynamics in the market as far as pricing, and this one was heading higher and now with the airs come back out, it’s still in high demand, rare limited edition. That’s how I picked that. It’s a bellwether. I’ve got another analysis, two different methods on the, uh, first generation of the Ferrari tester.

84, 85 to 91. The same idea. It’s a solid hold right now, but there’s upside potential still. The tester had almost 7,200 built. 71, 77 I think was the bill number. At least what’s accepted. The idea is, okay, there’s enough of them built where there probably are enough sales and enough attempted sales that I could find lots of records for the past five years online that.

Don Weberg: Would

David Neyens: help me to build that model as to why it’s a hold right now and it, it’s approaching a buy actually, and I believe one of my reports was [00:09:00] calling for a median of about $160,000 for a number two example, which is an excellent car, but not a Concord queen. Not a driver. So that’s sort of the standard baseline I go by is an excellent conditioned car, unless the customer tells me what the condition of the car is.

So I’m using haggerty’s one to four scale for condition. So that’s kind of one of the criteria. I’m using. Two things I do. One’s called the buy, sell, hold index, and that one’s a weighted average system. I get a score out of 10, I’m looking at 16 data points. One would be recent sales trends. The other one is, uh, market liquidity.

How frequently is this year, make, model or type of car appearing on, on auctions and auction websites and live and online. I’m also looking at how these cars are selling at auction. Do is what’s the sell through rate for them? Community, sentiment and buzz. So I’m also looking at what’s going on online and in print.

How often are these cars discussed or talked about? Is there a lot of nostalgic tailwinds to them to spur them on a little bit more? Was there TV use, like say [00:10:00] Magnum, pi, Ferrari? You know, that sort of burned into my memory bank and probably judging from the four of us, that might be something that we identified with as young folks.

Ownership costs and how complex they are to service, how costly they are to service, or how cheap they are to service. I like the test. I gave it a three out of 10 for ownership costs and maintenance costs. But you know, you could take an 84, 85 to 93, uh, Fox Body Mustang five liter, and you’d probably be looking at eight or nine for a score because their parts are available readily and they’re relatively inexpensive.

The other thing is, again, cultural and historical significance. Was there a competition history or like, say a copo Camaro from 69 ruled the drag strips. They were, uh, burned in everybody’s memory. Banks. That’s, you know, anybody up to around Gen X and millennial. That gives a good tailwind as well. Is there export and import demand?

Are there a. Cars crossing the border, say from Canada to the US or Europe to the us I’m also looking at regulatory and legal pressures depending on what the jurisdiction is. So, as you know, in [00:11:00] England it’s ultra low emission zones and uh, you can’t park anywhere. Whereas here in Canada, it’s uh, electric vehicles are getting pushed like crazy here and we’re being sort of coerced into that space.

Despite my opinions about that, how rare or how common are the cars, things like that. So again, there’s 16 data points that I’m going over with that. But you want something that’s got some action. So these are just sort of test cases where I’m publishing them myself right now to show people what I do.

William Ross: Because it is interesting with the tester because as I was leading and I kind of chuckle myself. Some years ago, the flying mirror cars, I either the Monte spec or however you wanna pronounce it, were not the car anyone wanted. They wanted the two mirror only that, but now it’s gone the other way. Now people want the flying mirror.

Yeah. So it’s got a little more value to and stuff, and it was just, it makes me chuckle towards the end. Then you got the TRS and you got the five 12 M. So it’s got those variants in there where those variables are there. But it really can kind of say like, pinpointing is like going to your customer, saying, okay.

What are you looking to buy? What are you trying to achieve with it?

David Neyens: Yes.

William Ross: It’s like, well you could have this low build towards the end production, final tweaks, [00:12:00] beginning, build, flying mirror, you know, you need this da da da and that kind of stuff. But you know, you have everything going across it, which I thought was really neat too.

’cause you usually don’t see that is not only did you have the sell, but auction ones, you know ones that didn’t. And I mean, someone that’s looking into buying up test row potentially. Don and it’s great information to really make an educated purchase because you can see where it’s at. Exactly. Now what I tell my people is like, look, you know, if you’re buying this as an investment and think you’re gonna make money, that’s not the way to buy a car.

But if you wanna, you got the data that’s backing up, which is fantastic ’cause you can really see where things go and that, that was a great example. You know, I mean, you nailed it. It’s a great bellwether in regards to putting information out there. One, there are enough of them built, but also enough variations of it technically.

Okay, what are you looking to do? Or where would you wanna be at? And because it, it’s an awesome site.

David Neyens: Thank you. It’s fantastic. And to get that some granularity to what value and sort of what the, uh, the recommendation is. So it’s kinda like on CNBC or whatever, they’re saying, this is a buyer or a sell, or I recommend this kind of thing.

It’s a bit of a dangerous thing. So I have to [00:13:00] say, here’s the data to support what I’m saying. You’re an adult and you’re a decision maker. This is meant to guide you and your advisors and to help you to make those decisions yourself.

William Ross: Yeah.

David Neyens: But yeah, there’s so many variables. And the other thing is classic and collector cars is such a passion driven field and it’s only exploded over the last 10, 15 years.

And I did a report on the, uh, 1989 to 94 Ferrari apocalypse. I called. There were a lot of enthusiasts, but there was a lot of speculation, a lot of Japanese money that was in the market. And a lot of those cars have since been repatriated over here to North America again. But I remember that very, very well, uh, as a student because always had a love for classic cars and collector cars.

But getting the analysts take on and in the financial papers was kind of eye opening for me. I think we’re in a much broader market. There’s a much more solid base to work from in the market today, and a lot of the online auctions and a lot of the live auctions with the cars that they’ve expanded into.

Enthusiast cars, Japanese cars, [00:14:00] BMWs, A MG, Mercedes, stuff like that. Where people are really getting into it and very fiercely loyal. It’s just made everything better for everybody, a lot better base to work from. It’s not as peaky as it used to be or as focused on one mark or one type of car.

William Ross: Do you see AI playing some type of role in this in regards to the data and everything like that?

David Neyens: You have to be extremely careful with AI as it stands right now, and it’s never. Something you can rely on 110%. You have to really question everything. I think it actually demands as much diligence as being an expert in a certain field and doing your own research. You still have to question everything.

You still have to double check everything. Even if you use it. It’s a tool. It’s a help. It doesn’t replace what people are already doing. No, I agree. Yeah, it, it’s just one of those things that if harnessed properly can be powerful and helpful, but if used lackadaisically, it’s going to show. As such.

Definitely.

William Ross: When someone comes to you for a report, what’s their number one compared to their number five in regards to, this is what I’m looking for to get out of this [00:15:00] report? What are they really trying to delve into and get out of it?

David Neyens: Ever since I’ve gotten into the business as a catalog writer, you’re in contact with owners all the time, unless you’re told not to contact somebody.

I’ve had so many conversations with so many great people and and the number one thing is, Dave, what do you think my car’s worth?

William Ross: Yep. How much can I get?

David Neyens: Yeah. Well, I’m not a qualified appraiser. Right. You have to be so diplomatic when you’re dealing with people. ’cause it’s also a very emotional thing. A lot of people are very attached to this type of thing, more so than other luxury items.

Like I call them alternative assets. I mean, you know, some people are really turned on by the wines they have in their cellar. Okay, great. But it seems like the passion component or the emotional aspect of ownership really attaches to collector cars. Very much so. But what do you think my car is worth?

And I have to kind of steer the conversation away. Yeah. Because it’s outside my pay grade or here’s what the reserve is. Do you think that’s right? And everybody’s always looking for a sounding board. They’re always wanting to know that they’re making a sound decision. Oh

Don Weberg: yeah.

David Neyens: Yeah. The other thing is auction estimates.

Always problematic. That [00:16:00] takes a lot of handholding as well. So that’s one of the things I do in one of my reports is, uh, help out with suggested reserve prices and suggested estimate ranges as well. And, and the other thing, an appraisal is a snapshot at a specific moment in time and things can change.

So I have people that would come to me and they’d give me an appraisal report that’s four or five years old and I’d have to gently tell them it’s way outta date. And yeah, you need to have another one. I recommend you get another one. And I have a list of people. That you may wanna choose from, but this is sort of a tool that can help with that process.

They generate comparables, which really helps as well. I’ve seen some appraisal reports, not everywhere, but I’ve seen them where it just says, this is the type of car that does very well at certain options. And there you go. So you have to have the due diligence, you have to have comparables, you have to have a methodology as well.

So that’s baked into those reports as well

William Ross: as, you know. An auction sale number can a lot of times not really indicate true value of that car. ’cause who knows the two people buying us like that. But then you also have, okay, like retail sales, you know, market out [00:17:00] there price. That was fantastic too. ’cause you know exactly why that thing sold for that because so and so and so and so were bidding over so it went $500,000 over the high, that kind of stuff.

Whereas, okay, here’s reality. ’cause again, like a client comes to you, they have a car. What can I get or what’s my car worth? Well, it’s like, well, here, let’s look at the numbers. But then it’s also, well, we gotta look at your car too. ’cause this is what there’re, but we gotta see where your car’s placed at.

Exactly. You have all those different pit points that you can kind of say, say, look, here’s an auction thing. Here’s privacy, here’s retail. You know, here’s what it got bid to. It didn’t sell. Say on bring a trailer. You have those numbers too. Well, it can really give. Someone for like me going to someone with their car wanting to sell it, they’ll go like, here, you know?

Right there, it’s straightforward. It’s giving you exactly what you’re looking for, where you wanna be at, and give yourself a good, educated decision. You know, obviously when it boils down to it, you can give all the details, info you want to the owner or whoever, but they’re gonna make their own choice.

Don Weberg: Yeah,

William Ross: that’s right. You know, you don’t want them to burn themselves out there and go, oh, I think my car’s worth 2 million when it’s worth one. You know, that kind of stuff. Oh, yeah. You know, [00:18:00] because then the car’s done.

David Neyens: That’s right.

Crew Chief Eric: As I’ve been listening to you guys talk about the valuation system of the vehicles and how the metrics are put together and how the data is analyzed, there’s a very important undercurrent here that I think we need to address head on, which is worth versus value, and they are not the same thing, although people think they are synonymous.

But I just wanna understand where the high watermark is because if I was an investor looking at, let’s say, the Testa roaster report. I’m not seeing the appraised value, which for me is the high watermark of what the vehicle could sell for based on what I’ve been told by an official in the market versus to Williams’ point, what the auctions are saying because the auctions are subjective.

If I got into a bidding war with you and that car is suddenly $500,000 over, if I’m a data analyst, that to me is an extreme that gets taken out of the equation.

David Neyens: Yeah, it’s an outlier.

Crew Chief Eric: It skews the data set. What is the tester Rosa actually worth? Based on what the appraisers are saying versus when the gavel [00:19:00] drops.

That’s why I want a little bit of better understanding, and I have a feeling the audience is sort of wondering, how does your math work when you come up with these valuations?

David Neyens: I use, uh, number one, the number four condition grades for specific vehicles and mileage. Mileage would go into the equation to colors, even colors.

Some are far more rare than others that help influence the market value. As far as appraisals go, I, I wholeheartedly agree, someone needs to actually see the vehicle needs to take a look at what I’m doing, but they need to look at the vehicle itself, of course, and that can be different than what’s been selling in the marketplace, where the numbers are coming from.

I’ve seen many times where an appraisal comes in. 10 to 40% higher than than what an actual market value is. Depends on how recent it is as well. It’s the same thing as with a real estate appraisal. When I was in banking, you’d have a, a market value estimate from the appraiser, but you’d also have a replacement value for the physical item.

You know, what it would take to replace it. And those are always two different things as well. Mine is based more on market and momentum. If there’s good buying activity or [00:20:00] selling activity, if there’s any kind of like a velocity in the market where cars are moving or not moving, it would pick up on that as well.

Crew Chief Eric: But doesn’t that fall victim to the same adage in housing, which is your house is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. At the end of the day, regardless of what the numbers say in the house buying process, the appraisal is over what it’s selling for or it’s under what it’s selling for. So we’re in that same game.

So the car is worth what someone is willing to pay for it at the end of the day, right?

David Neyens: Yeah. You need willing buyer and a willing seller and a, and a reasonable. Timeframe. Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: So going back to the data to establish trend. Mm-hmm. You still need a, like in science, you need a constant to test against, in your case, for your data set, what is your constant?

Is it mecu M’S value? Is it Sotheby’s value? Is it an a private appraisal value? ’cause you have to have something across the vehicles to make it consistent.

David Neyens: Oh, for sure. Where I get my numbers, I make a weighted average to get my score that I score a car at out of 10. So. Let’s look at the tester example here.

Sure. Let’s stay with that. I’m looking at not only the different auction houses online and a and [00:21:00] live, one of the biggest tools I use is actually classic.com, if you’ve seen that, where it has a rolling five year, uh, scatterplot of all the sales that have taken place and listings, even if it’s unsold. So that’s a huge tool to use.

So I’m going back as far as I can through that. I use, again, a condition multiplier. My assumptions are based on whether or not a car, unless I’m told otherwise, is an excellent number two condition. If it’s a Concor quality car, it’s gonna have a 20% multiplier. If it’s a driver, number three, we’re gonna take the baseline down by 20%.

So I’m looking at sales trend. For the value scope that I did for the test aero, I’m looking at rarity or commonality. So the score will be higher or lower for cultural significance. So the, the test aerosa gets a bump, it’s like a nine outta 10 as far as its, uh, pop culture status cost. I also look at maintenance costs and service costs.

The higher, the worse it is. So I’m not a mechanic, but I think you need an engine out just to do the timing belt. So that’s weighed into this as well. Demographics, which generations are, are into these cars or not, and whether or not [00:22:00] these cars are steady at the auctions. Definitely this is meant to supplement or assist in the process.

I always tell people to get an proper appraisal, get a recent, a fresh one, so you know also what you’re dealing with in terms of condition and comparables. With this, I’m coming up with 160,000 US for that generation of tester, Rosa, if you’re looking for a sale, and as far as reserve prices, so if you’re taking one to auction,

Crew Chief Eric: just don’t want listeners to think that, well, this is the Kelley Blue Book for classic cars.

’cause it’s not.

David Neyens: Gosh, no, no.

Crew Chief Eric: Because if you think about the things that you’re describing and the one to five scale and take into account mileage and the options and the color and that. Mm-hmm. Kelly does the same thing for pedestrian cars. Yep. We wanna make sure that we differentiate when we’re talking about this.

Maybe this is a future capability. Say I’m going the other direction and William and I have these conversations all the time. I got 200,000 to spend. So tester Rosas on the list, but how does this compare to maybe a car that’s older of more significance or a car that’s newer that might not have all these mechanical issues like you talked about engine out to do timing [00:23:00] belts.

Chain driven Ferrari where I can spend 200 grand and still have a V 12 or whatever it is. So, comparables across vehicles or is that yet to come?

David Neyens: That’s something I’m gonna be rolling out a bit more as I, as I evolve things. The biggest thing is if you’ve got a more rare car. It’s going to score higher in my scoring matrix.

If it’s easier to maintain, that’ll have a better score too. So you could take a car that’s less exotic, but perhaps more rare in terms of build numbers. It’ll have its own scores and weightings that’ll help us to determine value, but it also ties into what auction and online, offline, and dealers are selling for.

But there might be a chance to identify through this system, a car that might break out to the buy side. Or one that’s already been loved in the market and it might be time for a pause or a break in selling or, or value. So it just depends on the individual, you’re make and model kind of thing. And it, it’s individual attributes Above all, you know, this should be something that would be considered to help with selling, marketing, and auction set up for a [00:24:00] car like this.

Always have an appraisal though from a, an accredited appraiser in combination, I figure that more information is better than less. Of course.

Don Weberg: David, are you primarily focusing on the exotics on the Ferraris and Lamborghinis of Porsches, or are you gonna grow this out to. As Eric always has more pedestrian type cars.

I mean, for example, the IROC Camaro Yeah. Is absolutely going crazy right now. They are, and that to me has always been, I mean, I don’t wanna say surprising. I’ve always liked that car. Always knew it would be somewhere I don’t think I knew it would be this. Somewhere. So is that a car that’s on your site?

Are we looking at oddballs like for a name? Taurus, SHO. Yeah. That car is slowly starting to percolate or are you sticking to that narrowed? We love exotics. Where, where are we going with this?

David Neyens: Yeah. The starting point was just me doing some test cases and then illustrating the methods that I’m using to get my numbers.

If it was anything, like you said, uh, an IROC from the eighties and there’s a couple of different flavors of them, enough [00:25:00] that you can break that down into more granular. Types of cars inside of them? Like are you looking at the five liter or the 5.7? Are you looking at the one L?

William Ross: Yeah, it’s got the compact.

David Neyens: Yeah. I’d love to tackle those because there’s a huge amount of sales data on those and the good cars, like the really nice unadulterated original cars are so rare in that space. It’s like fox Mustangs. But I think what I would do is I’d have to break it down like you said, and thank you for that. You said the iroc, so that gives me more certainty with what I’m dealing with.

The only difference would be powertrain colors and condition and mileage. That’d be an interesting test case. So if someone wanted me to do that, I, I, I’d be happy to run one and, and just so they see it, because that’s a, a more mainstream car right now. It’s like second generation F bodies are starting to kind of make a nice breakout.

They were everywhere and people just kind of went, we like ’em, but we don’t know why. They’re not really doing much in the market, and you can buy much more powerful cars or this, that, or the other thing. But they were very special for their time. And now [00:26:00] people like me, I had a 10th anniversary, uh, TransAm back in the eighties that I saved up for with farm money and lawn mowing and hay baling money and tobacco picking money.

And that was my first car. And, and I absolutely adored it. But now second Gen F. Bodies are starting to get their due a little bit in the market. So I’m appreciating seeing those kind of cars that were produced in larger numbers, having attention now with enthusiast. Yeah, absolutely. I’d love to see what fits a buy seller.

A hold over my four time periods.

Don Weberg: I brought up the Camaro ’cause it’s a common, and it’s certainly not in the, uh, in the ballpark of pastor or tta or any of those guys.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s not necessarily true, Don. And that this adds another use case. To the equation here in that you have cars crossing the block in Mecu at Barrett Jackson at other auction houses where you have a modified Camaro or a Resto Modd Camaro, or something that is, you know, is a SEMA quality car, which is beyond concourses level.

Is that being taken to account here? Because those will sell for $200,000 all day long,

Don Weberg: right? Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: David, how are you absorbing those [00:27:00] modified versions instead of the original purist cars?

David Neyens: I think that the modified cars, especially F Bodies and Corvettes, especially second generation Corvettes, there’s just so many of them that are built to that standard that are restomod, couple of orders of magnitude better than the original car in terms of what it’s like to drive or operate.

What I would do in those cases is separate that out, you know, look at the modified cars more in isolation that are done to a show standard as opposed to something that’s more original.

Crew Chief Eric: It changes your metrics again, because those cars need to be considered, let’s say they’re numbers matching. Even though they’re modified, they still are in the same category as a numbers matching stock car.

Why would we take them out? It gets a little gray really fast.

David Neyens: Well, if the car that the customer’s asking me about is a stock or a modified car, then that’s where I’m gonna have to like break that out. So I’m comparing apples to apples instead of apples to oranges. That’s why I started out with four GT Heritage.

That’s a very uniform car. Unless it’s been modified and there are a few out there,

Crew Chief Eric: like you were [00:28:00] saying before, what’s my car worth? And somebody says, no, David, that’s not what it’s worth. I just saw a Copo Xma car go across the block and it’s 250,000. Why isn’t my Camaro 250,000? Right? So now you get into this tug of war again of worth versus value.

So I wanna make sure that we establish that so people really understand what the intrinsic value is versus what it’s worth. So one is more subjective than the other. I know I keep harping on this, but I think it’s important for the first time collector to understand that you just don’t walk up to an auction, go, I want that one, or I’m gonna sell mine because I saw that one.

Right? It’s not a monkey see, monkey do situation.

David Neyens: Now I’ve seen people do that actually walk right up to me at an auction and just say, how much is that car? I wanna buy it right now. I didn’t buy it last night. There are people out there that are like that. Again. Yeah. I’d have to parse out is the car modified?

Is it standard? Is it, you know, rest a monitor? Is it just lightly modified? I mean, headers and duals don’t make anything too much of an outlier. In this case. It’s gonna be a little bit of a custom job.

William Ross: I always like that there’s expectation. There’s reality [00:29:00] that I always like, ’cause people have this expectation.

But then here’s reality.

David Neyens: Here’s where I found the gap is widest is dealing with. An enthusiast type car that someone’s owned for a while and they have a bit of an emotional bond with, there’s a, an older couple, a few years ago they had a 56 Ford Fairlane, crown Victoria. They’d owned it for 30, 35 years.

They loved it. They went cruising with it, but it’s a driver. They were so attached to it that, again, when you’re talking about value versus worth. They had 30 years with it of fun cruising and showing they bought it when it was not worth comparatively as much as it is now. And certainly inflation also figures into the numbers that people are expecting to get from a car.

A million dollars today was a hundred thousand dollars about 15 years ago, or 20 years ago. I’m exaggerating a little bit, but there’s a big gulf based on inflation. So I said to the pe, the lady I said. What do you have in mind for a value? She told me and I said, now, just so that you know, in this market right now, that’s a bit on the high side, and you know, does the car owe you [00:30:00] anything?

Do you owe money on it? Was there a huge expense that you’ve had over the last few years that’s going to affect your decision? And often a lot of people. When they’ve made a big investment in a vehicle after buying it, they feel they need to recoup that last dollar they put into it. And that’s another thing.

But I’ve seen the gulf between market value and personal value or worth is huge on the more mainstream side of cars. A lot of people on the higher end of the market are kind of dialed in and they want to do the best when they’re selling and they wanna do, do the best when they’re buying and get the lowest price.

But I’ve seen it more on the sub $50,000 car market where there’s that kind of golf cars can even, like, depending on where they come from. I’m not drilling down into that aspect of it right now, but there’s certain markets or certain locations where cars are just uniformly of better quality. Especially in the mainstream side or the enthusiast side.

William Ross: Obviously you know, you’re doing these for a customer or client, you know, so it’s obviously model specific, but what is driving you to put ones onto your site for general consumption? Yeah. How are you picking what to put on your site then? Because obviously the tester was a great [00:31:00] example. I think the four GT one’s a great one too, because you know it’s a very popular car, but how are you going about picking those, what you’re gonna put on the website for just general consumption?

David Neyens: For those that are like test cases that I’m publishing proactively, there’s a finite bill number. Now the tester is not particularly rare with over 7,000 built, but it’s far more rare than a lot of other exotics and uh, high performance cars despite that many being built. The tester is styling the cultural status of it.

You know, having been on Miami Vice and that whole thing. I think that just is a good test case because that’s something that a lot of people, whether or not they own one or plan to own one, they can at least identify with to some extent. The four GT on the other hand is that Heritage Edition is just.

Really rare. There’s no question as to whether or not they’re real or faked. That’s the other thing. Unlike some vehicles that out there that have that potential, both of ’em. I mean, I’ve only seen a few modified gts, let alone a heritage that’s been modified and tester roses. I don’t see them being modified very often at all.

No, you don’t. So it’s a nice case because they’re fairly uniform [00:32:00] in that subset of cars. Or the models that their manufacturer made. So I thought I’d try those because I think there’s some rarity to them. There’s some visual impact. The performance aspect is interesting and they’re just interesting cars all around that.

People, I think, would gravitate to just to throw that out there just to show what my different tools, if I run a certain year, make model through those filters. Is it a buy? Is it a sell? Is it a hold? What are the timeframes for those things?

William Ross: It’s a good example for, I would say a sales tool for you in regards to getting clients.

Yeah. They see that. They’re like, oh, okay. It’s a good basis to work from for somebody to get the idea of what you’re capable of doing. That’s what I took from that. I was like, wow, this is great. If someone sees it, Hey, I want an individual report, that the right thing. It’s like, there you go. It says it all right there.

So that was fantastic.

David Neyens: Sort of just a couple of test cases. I’m gonna keep rolling them out and also the market changes. From auction to auction or there’s trends definitely. But the idea is eventually, uh, those reports will need to be freshened up a little bit and to see how they compare. So maybe a year from now I go back and just have a look at how do my calls hold up.

And the idea is if they [00:33:00] hold up or maybe there’s some tweaks that need to be made or maybe something happened in the market in general that’s, uh, affecting market values in that space. Say the 250,000 and over, or the a hundred thousand and over market segments.

William Ross: Yeah. How are you going to make. That decision to go back and revisit something to adjust it to your 0.6 months or a year, I mean, or you just go, oh, the market seems to be gone a different way.

I had just done that, so I better go back and do it. I mean, you could have a set time maybe, or just gonna say what the market does, if it necessitates it to do it.

David Neyens: I was doing a forward market index looking ahead the next 30 days in the market, and then to get a score as to just the market in general, its health.

And whether it’s bear neutral or or a bull market, kind of like in financial terms. What I’ve done now is I’ve changed that to weekly. So I’m doing weekly forecasts. Right now. I’m only getting them published Tuesdays or Wednesdays, but it’s for the week ahead. Then afterwards, when this week is over on Monday, I’m gonna run a report and that’s the market pulse and that’s my Fear Andre Index.

And I’m gonna say, [00:34:00] how did my forecast hold up against reality? I’ve done a couple of posts now that show that both the weekly forecast and then the look. Back the retroactive look. Those are both now pretty closely aligned. So it’s, it’s showing that the methodology is jiving. When I make a forecast using my system, when I look back the next week, they’re almost in line with each other perfectly.

So, yeah, I, what I’d probably want to do is maybe a month to three months out at the end of the year, say, how did my report on the test Aerosa workout? Did that logic hold up? Did my call on the four gts? How did that hold up over this period of time? You just do a little bit of back testing like that just to show that it’s working.

William Ross: I like how you’re, you’re referencing t how did I do? Yeah, in regards to forecast, which is great ’cause a lot of people would bury it ’cause they don’t wanna look like they prove it wrong or had no idea. But anyone that knows this industry and business, you never know. I mean, you can use all the numbers you don’t know, but I really like that too.

Yeah. I was like, look, here’s how it went

David Neyens: and I don’t have anything to hide. I’m just putting this out there. This is my method. Does it hold up? Okay, great. It did hold up. So I’ve [00:35:00] had two one week periods where the, uh, forward look and the look back were in line with each other. They almost had the same scores, you know, so the look back is the reality and the look forward is the forecast.

Of course, that seems to be working. One of the things I’ve worked in is sort of geopolitics a little bit too. You know, how’s the news? Is it bad or is it stable? Or is it good? You know, or is everybody getting along now? In this week’s newsletter once I get it out. Finally, the first post is I’m breaking a golden cardinal rule here.

I’m actually discussing politics. One of the things I should be talking about, but here’s a buffet of seven potential black swans that could land anytime. I don’t wanna throw cold water and everything. The market’s been good. The market has breadth. There’s a wide market. There’s a huge number of types of cars, classifications of cars, enthusiasts to investor grade and everything in between.

So it’s not like the narrow Ferrari market of 35 years ago, and that’s it, where it’s very risky and speculative. Also, the last 25 to 30 years, there’s a just a [00:36:00] massive amount of money in the system, despite the news you hear. There’s people that are getting huge bonuses and they have to put it somewhere.

There’s only so much real estate you can buy. There’s only so much fine wine, cigars, time pieces you can buy. So, so that’s where the, our market’s, uh, really been getting an uplift as well. There’s a chart, I’ve got a report on showing insider buying and selling of stocks, but with one or two brief. Moments since 1998, company insiders have been selling stocks and freeing up capital and buying cars among other things as well

William Ross: can be a lot more prevalent.

I mean, you’ve seen it now where they got the investor goose, whatnot, buy a chair for $20 and whatever, you know?

David Neyens: Oh, yeah. Like the fractional ownership. Yeah. Yeah. I’ve only just recently seen four or five of them where there were one of them that’s kind of cropping up right now. It’d be interesting to see how that goes.

I mean, what I’d like to do is actually build a list where there’s a specific set of, say, 20 different year make and model of cars that have the most potential to be good to purchase. They’re not overpriced right now. They’re emerging as collectibles, and someone could put a fund [00:37:00] together or put a group together or for themselves and use those reports as guidance.

To build a garage full of great cars and hopefully enjoy them. It’s not all about the money. Drive ’em. Absolutely. It’s a major consideration for people getting into purchase or getting into the market. But for me, it’s the love of them. I see stuff on marketplace every day. There’s beautiful cars being sold for less than 10,000 Canadian dollars that have less than 50,000 miles on them, and they’re fun and interesting.

You don’t have to spend a huge amount of money on something like this. It can be a really fun hobby. I think the biggest thing is, for me, it was just simply. There’s other content creators out there that are doing that job so well and building their niche so well. I have rudimentary skills with a camera.

Forget video. There’s other people that have bigger followings or they know how to work the algorithms to get the right response they want. For me, it was simply, I’d like to see if I can add some value to people where you can take a look at these reports or you can order a report from me and I can build it.

And then that gives you some [00:38:00] confidence as to what you’re doing. Or maybe it’s a confidence in something you’re not doing. Maybe it’s saying, I better just hold onto this for another year. If it’s not costing me money, if it’s not hurting me, maybe I just hang onto it.

William Ross: This has been interesting. In the past few years, there’s been an explosion in regards to value in classic race car.

They’ve been going to the roof and you have log samples going across the board. You know, we had X collection go for 650 million. I mean, that was an incredible thing, but. Would you be able to do a report on someone that’s looking at, Hey, I’m looking at this XY, ZX formula, the one car from 1969, or you know, old Lamont’s car.

Is that something you could potentially do as well for an old race car?

Crew Chief Eric: And I want to dovetail off that, William, because I think now when David takes that into account, he needs to invert his scale because a concourses quality race car never raced. Yeah. Right. You want the one that’s the driver with the miles.

Yeah. That won a championship. So you actually have to skew your data set opposite for this. Yeah.

David Neyens: For a competition car. Exactly. Yeah, because you, you have to have some earmarks of actual use in [00:39:00] combat or in anger. There’s a Jaguar D type once a few years back. I think it brought over $20 million at auction in Monterey.

That was achieved, even though that card had been beaten up so much that the chassis tag was the only thing, and the, and a stamp on, on one of the frame rails was all that was left of it that actually crossed the finish line At Lamont, there’s a lot of Ferrari that have been re bodied or whatever, and it’s part of the story.

The one of the coolest ones for me is that two 50 GT uh, bread wagon. I used to know the fellow that owned it one or two owners ago, and he raced it in vintage races.

Crew Chief Eric: We saw it this summer at Lamont Classic.

David Neyens: Yeah. Yeah. And it’s driven, right?

Crew Chief Eric: Oh yeah. It was raced at full tilt this summer. Yeah. Yeah. And it’s, and the thing

David Neyens: about it though is, okay, so a lot of body panels, it got stuffed a couple times and it’s mostly there.

And you know, some expert redid the body, I mean. As authentic as it can possibly be, but the car was reburied back in the day, so does it really matter? You know, that car’s raced and it’s been in combat kind of thing, and to me that just makes that car even cooler and more [00:40:00] desirable than a lot of others.

Crew Chief Eric: Let’s take that back to our Testa. Yeah, use case or our Camaros and everything we’ve been talking about so far. Can you touch upon your feeling as it applies to the data when you start getting into the age old, debate preservation versus restoration? ’cause if I look at those five categories, yeah. As we move down to the driver, you know, the negatives to get applied to the value of the car.

You could also say that a preservation car lives there because it’s never been serviced. It’s been driven. It’s ori. Yeah. But a lot of people pay top dollar for a preservation class car versus a restoration concourse.

David Neyens: Well, yeah, and that was a completely opposite, flipped 20, 30 years ago, where everything had to be like jewelry.

Crew Chief Eric: What I

David Neyens: can do is, the nice thing is if I have logic, I can just change some of the scoring around a little bit to recognize the fact that a preservation class car is actually worth more Now in certain, certain circumstances, like it’s an unrestored classic Enzo. V 12 Ferrari, and if it’s presentable and it’s got a great story, [00:41:00] then there’s something to be said for that.

So I think there’s adjustments that can be made, just like when you’re adjusting comps on an appraisal,

William Ross: like with Ferrari, Jaguar, Mercedes, you know, you’re seeing the manufacturer come up with their own class, each department, and restoring these cars. How much value is that adding to it compared to going to an expert store that’s been doing it for 30, 40 years?

I mean, they’ve won Pebble Beach, they’ve won all this stuff, you know, it’s great. But how much does the manufacturer trump someone like that? Percentage wise, or is it really kind of a wash? Does it matter?

David Neyens: A classic department restoration from the factory. Versus an expert level restoration or a Conor level restoration externally by a specialist.

There’s times where I’ve seen value bumps, and you’ve seen them too, where if a known re restorer with a great reputation and a great crew hold off a concor winning restoration, or a multiple award. Restoration, I would think that that would actually enhance value. But I’ve also seen in the market where that has not enhanced value at an auction or a sale situation.

Because 30 years ago, a jewelry level restoration that [00:42:00] removed all the patina was worth more than preservation car. And now we’ve seen it flip, see in V 12 Ferrari, as you know, in matters to me, uh, and to a lot of people I’ve worked with. If a noted specialist who was still alive at the time did the, the engine rebuild, for example, that trumps a no name.

Even though they did good work, you know, sadly, I mean, there’s a name that’s built for a good reason and that’s because they’ve done good work. Then I think that helps with the value. There’s a lot of subjective factors though.

William Ross: Well, I get it. In my world, Hey, so and so did the register. That’s who you want.

Does it have it Red Book? You know, has it gone through class sheet? It’s like, okay, yeah, it’s got this redwood, but doesn’t always kind of really bugged me a little bit. That’s what everyone wants, and now it’s getting more prevalent in newer cars, so to speak. It’s creeping up into your nineties, early 2000 cars, depending on what it is model wise.

That’s the thing that’s like number one to have right off the bat if you’re selling a fry’s.

David Neyens: I think you touched on something really important here and, and that’s in auction work and catalog writing. What kind of paperwork does this car have? Is it a Carfax that only picks up history, uh, [00:43:00] starting in the, in the late nineties or early two thousands?

And the car’s 40 years old. You see a lot of things. But like the classic K book is awesome. It makes my job easier. FIA paperwork, if it’s a, a race car or homologated car. But I’ve also seen, there was a Chaparral mark, one they made, two of them. I might might have made more, I’m not sure. But it’s the one car that’s not in the, uh, Midland, Texas, uh, oil museum, Jim Hall’s place.

It’s the only one I think that’s out in the wild somewhere. And, uh. That car had an amazing amount of paperwork, and it was extremely confusing, but when you get into it, there were things that were known in the pre-internet era, and there were things that were believed to be true because someone saw a car like it somewhere.

It turns out they didn’t have them separated out properly, and histories get confused. So I actually had to take original shipping documents, copies of those, and the car went through several forms throughout its lifetime until it was restored as faithfully as possible. It was a lister, excuse me, it was a Lister Chevrolet.

Okay. Sorry. It was something from that [00:44:00] period though. And the point was there was a, a mass of paperwork and then there were letters based on what someone truly, honestly believed. They weren’t fabricating anything. It was just. This is in the eighties vintage race cars were starting to be appreciated and collected and sold, and then it really became important to get the story straight.

And so there was quite a lengthy process to get through it all. So despite the volume of paperwork, that was just the beginning. That was like put a banker’s box in front of you and then you go through that for two weeks and try not to go crazy. Then there’s other things that are far more cut and dry.

There’s, you know, the. Manufacturer statement of origin, like Alpha Romeo say, or Maserati. There’s, uh, copies of factory documents, so you know exactly how that thing left the factory. It’s, it’s funny because sometimes there’s a massive paperwork or massive documentation that is less of a help than you would think.

And then there’s others that are very much more direct. And you’ve seen that too, probably. Oh, yeah. And Don, you’ve seen that too. I mean, and you know, as a writer there’s more research, the more documents you have, but that’s always one of the biggest things is how well is the car documented? You know? Is anybody [00:45:00] still with us that I’ve interviewed people like.

There was a All American Racers, IndyCar, about seven or eight years ago that I had to do a writeup for, for an auction, and I was able to call Dan Gurney’s all American racers when he was still alive. His administrative assistant, Kathy was right there and she said, oh yeah, yeah, I’ll just go upstairs. I know where the box is, where the paperwork is for it.

And she was able to like that. And they did that once though. And then after that it was kind of like a bit more reluctance to do it. I don’t know why, but it just created work. She was willing to do it. God bless her. I mean, it was funny and she gave me like the original invoice to whoever it was that raced the car.

It was bang, bang, bang that this is it. Here’s who did any, any work to it and you know, and it didn’t get destroyed in back in the day. So

William Ross: yeah, there’s a couple of ’em. We have a gentleman that we’re all good friends with. He has the online database, storage of documents for your classic car, digitize, everything like that, that way, and then it can transfer over and how it’s encrypted or whatever.

You’re

Crew Chief Eric: talking about Julio at

David Neyens: the motor chain? Yes. So he is probably on blockchain then with it?

William Ross: Yeah,

David Neyens: an immutable record.

William Ross: Yeah. I really think that’s great because [00:46:00] then to your point, oh, it’s not lost. There it is. You know, it’s an actual, tangible asset. Absolutely. I always like what he’s doing with that.

I thought that it’s fantastic

David Neyens: and it lives on, I mean, the thing is. You have the provenance locked in as much as it can be. There it is. And it can be accessed and not messed with after that. Correct. I think that’s fabulous. You always hear about technology’s going to do this and do that, and it’s be worried.

That’s a great use case for technology. Yes. Something like that. And if it lends. Strength to the authenticity of the documents and to the vehicle itself. Well, that’s a win-win.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, on that note, let’s move into our final segment here and just sort of talk about the services that you’re providing, David.

And so you talked about putting these prospectuses together upon request to do the proof of concept to show that the math works. That’s right. To show that the algorithms work and all that kind of stuff. So basically walk us through your business process, meaning somebody say, Hey David, I listened to this podcast.

What’s the process look like? How much does it cost? Are you doing this as a service?

David Neyens: Yeah, it would be done on a fee basis, a [00:47:00] case by case basis on request. I’m still working out what kind of pricing would be appropriate. I don’t wanna undercharge, I don’t wanna overcharge, but it’s, it’s just something I’m gonna have to like, get some feedback from people and I have a sort of a target in mind.

So it’s just pretty early stages here. What I’m doing.

Don Weberg: So David, after going through all this, what’s the next step for you and Motorcopia?

David Neyens: Well, the next step is to keep forging ahead. Actually, it’s kind of exciting. I’m in the beginning of reaching out to lenders, insurers, leasing companies, industry people, and alternative investment managers, family offices.

So that’s the next step, reaching out, introducing myself, and urging people to sign up for the Motorcopia newsletter. I’ve worked really hard on the subject matter, and that’s my expertise. The online marketing is something that I have to work on and something that I need to do to roll things out better, but there’s nothing like a good old fashioned phone call or email.

So that’s the next step is just basically contacting people and urging them to sign up or gimme permission to sign them up for the Motorcopia newsletter. [00:48:00] Take a look at my reports. I’m moving to a, uh, paid model, but again, I’m working on the pricing and the levels, but I want people to see it and talk to me and if there’s, you know, suggestions or ideas about things that can be changed or updated.

Glad I got to get your feedback on the ones on the website because I was afraid that I was going too far with the information. Oh, no. And I’m glad for that. That makes me feel so much better because I don’t wanna write a book. On the other hand, you have to be able to. Defend or justify or promote what you’re saying, that there’s a thought process that goes on.

William Ross: Well, no, it was great delving into it. ’cause you know when you start, you’re going through your, you have your charts and the numbers and what I thought was great ’cause then all of a sudden, you know, I start seeing writing, I’m like gonna go into history and stuff like that, which I really don’t need. But that was just a quick little blurb.

Like a paragraph? Yeah. Maybe I go Perfect. Because I want the numbers and everything like that. I know the history of the car, I know all this stuff, da da da. For sure. What I wanna see is, okay, what’s this thing been doing previous? That’s why I, I thought it was fantastic. ’cause it it given you what you want and it’s not giving you what you don’t need and want.

It’s like, [00:49:00] Hey, this is why came. Yeah. This is what I’m supposed to be getting out of this. You have it set up great in regards to how everything’s laid out.

David Neyens: Well, thank you. I, I’m glad to get that feedback. That’s huge and, and me as a writer, I mean, I, when I’m not restricted to a word character and page count, we can all probably go right to town on it.

But is that what someone needs or wants? And, and that’s the other side of it. You want some information to take action or decide that you’re already in a good place holding or considering buying the best example of a car that you want. My whole thing is, while this is numbers driven and data driven, it’s passion driven at the root.

What I’m doing, and it’s a different approach to what I’ve been doing. So it’s, it’s actually pretty refreshing. I’m trying to get down to a, a reasonable editorial schedule where I’m putting out a newsletter every week with four or five good articles in it that I hope would give somebody either comfort or help them to say, yeah, you know what?

I do need to start considering the next set of options. Yeah, the market’s good or the market’s stable. Yeah, it’s been a great fit and I, and I’m hoping it’s something that’s unique [00:50:00] enough that my target audience will appreciate it or get proper information from, for their own life. I was just thinking I could do another content site.

I could look at doing buyer’s guides or I could do some price, uh, explorations and things like that. And then I. Let’s look at the market. The first thing was the, uh, Motorcopia market pulse index that I set up, and it’s, it’s kinda like a fear and greed kind of index just to tell you if the market is cold, medium, or hot.

It’s kinda like Goldilocks and the three Bears give you an idea of what last week’s market action was like and is the market stable? Our, our dealers filling their, their showrooms still as aggressively as before. Is there good sale activity? Is there a where the sell through is good at the auctions of last week?

Things like that. So, uh, just kind of a bit of a reading between the lines for people too.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, David, we’ve reached that part of the episode where I’d like to invite our guests to share any shout outs, promotions, thank yous, or anything else we haven’t covered thus far.

David Neyens: Two things, if anybody wants to, I have a special report on the collector car market in [00:51:00] 2025, and my forecast through the end of this year, through the end of the fourth quarter, it’s a PDF download.

I’d be happy to send that out to any of your listeners. Would like it. They reach out to me at admin@motorcopia.com and just let me know that they’d like a copy of that report. I will send the PDF over to them and hopefully start a relationship with that and add value to their, uh, car collecting or their world.

Secondly, and most importantly, I’d like to thank probably my best friend in the field who’s been my biggest supporter since I’ve been independent as a writer in 2012. And that’s Cindy Meitle of, uh, car pr USA. She is probably the og, the original gangster of. Collector, car promotion and public relations.

And if you have a worthy event, product or service in the collector car market or collector car field, I urge you wholeheartedly to reach out to Cindy at CAR PR USA and you’ll get the best support possible to get the word out.

Don Weberg: Motorcopia is a digital platform and publication founded by automotive writer and auction expert David Neyens.[00:52:00]

It caters to collector cars, enthusiasts, investors, dealers, and anyone interested in the market dynamics of classic, exotic and special interest vehicles. The focus isn’t just on car culture, it’s driven by data. Motorcopia offers tools, analysis, and reports to help people make informed decisions about buying, selling, holding, or investing in collector cars.

Crew Chief Eric: And David, I can’t thank you enough for coming on Break Fix and sharing your story with us and educating us on data-driven decision making when it comes to collector car buying, selling, and holding. It’s obvious in the way you talk, your passion, your expertise, all of it is there, and I wish you the best of luck on your latest endeavor and we will see where this goes.

Maybe the next 30, 60, 90, 12 months from now. Right? There you go. Yeah, as you say on the website. So thank you for doing this.

David Neyens: Thanks very much for having me, guys, and it’s been a pleasure. Appreciate it.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah.

David Neyens: Good to meet you, David. Thank you. Thanks

Crew Chief Eric: again to Don and William as well.

Don Weberg: Thanks

Crew Chief Eric: for having me.

Don Weberg: All the best.

You too.[00:53:00]

Since 2007, garage Style Magazine has been the definitive source for car collectors continually delivering information about Automobilia Petroliana events and more. To learn more about the annual publication and its new website, be sure to follow them on social media at Garage Style Magazine or log onto www.garagestylemagazine.com because after all, what doesn’t belong in your garage.

ECM PROMO: For everything from Ferrari and Porsche, Lamborghini and Konig seg, visit exotic car marketplace.com. If you’re into anything with wheels and a motor, log onto to the Motoring Podcast network and check out our family of podcasts@motoringpodcast.net. This is the place to find your favorite news show. Next up a shout out to David Beatie and his team at Slot Mods who custom build some of the coolest slot car tracks in the world@slotmods.com.[00:54:00]

Let your imagination run wild. And finally, grand touring motorsports covering all aspects of auto racing and motorsports history. Check out their ezine@gtmotorsports.org. All the links for our sponsors are in the description.

Crew Chief Eric: We hope you enjoyed another awesome episode of Break Fix Podcasts, brought to you by Grand Tour Motorsports.

If you’d like to be a guest on the show or get involved, be sure to follow us on all social media platforms at Grand Touring Motorsports. And if you’d like to learn more about the content of this episode, be sure to check out the follow on article@gtmotorsports.org. We remain a commercial free and no annual fees organization through our sponsors, but also through the generous support of our fans, families, and friends through Patreon.

For as little as $2 and 50 cents a month, you can get access to more behind the scenes action, additional pit stop, minisodes and other VIP goodies, as well as keeping our team of creators. [00:55:00] Fed on their strict diet of fig Newton’s, Gumby bears, and monster. So consider signing up for Patreon today at www.patreon.com/gt motorsports.

And remember, without you, none of this would be possible.

Highlights

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00 Meet David Neyens
  • 01:37 David’s Journey into Automotive Journalism
  • 03:15 The Birth of Motorcopia.com
  • 04:20 Understanding Motorcopia’s Unique Platform
  • 06:41 Deep Dive into Car Valuation Methods & Challenges in Car Valuation
  • 18:01 Worth vs. Value in Car Appraisals
  • 24:08 Expanding Motorcopia’s Scope
  • 28:41 Understanding Car Modifications
  • 29:04 Emotional Value vs Market Value
  • 33:28 Weekly Market Forecasts
  • 40:06 Preservation vs Restoration Debate
  • 42:50 Documenting Car History
  • 46:31 Motorcopia’s Business Model
  • 50:47 Final Thoughts and Promotions

Learn More

There's more to this story!

Be sure to check out the behind the scenes for this episode, filled with extras, bloopers, and other great moments not found in the final version. Become a Break/Fix VIP today by joining our Patreon.

All of our BEHIND THE SCENES (BTS) Break/Fix episodes are raw and unedited, and expressly shared with the permission and consent of our guests.

How It Works: The Motorcopia Method

Motorcopia delivers proprietary market indices – including the Market Pulse™, Forward Index™, Buy/Sell/Hold Index™, and ValueScope™ – alongside auction coverage, investment insights, and collector-vehicle analysis. With a focus on serving high-net-worth collectors, advisors, and industry professionals, combining deep cataloguing expertise with data-driven reporting to spotlight actionable trends, opportunities, and results across the global collector-car market.

David’s approach blends financial modeling with enthusiast insight. Each report scores a car out of 10 using 16 weighted data points, including but not limited to:

  • Recent sales trends and auction sell-through rates
  • Market liquidity and frequency of listings
  • Ownership costs and service complexity
  • Cultural significance and nostalgic tailwinds
  • Rarity, regulatory pressures, and generational appeal
Courtesy David Neyes, Motorcopia.com

For example, the Ferrari Testarossa – a car with over 7,000 units built – was analyzed as a “solid hold” with upside potential. Using Hagerty’s 1–5 condition scale, David forecasted a median value of $160,000 for a #2 condition car, factoring in auction results, private sales, and even pop culture relevance (yes, Miami Vice matters).

Courtesy David Neyes, Motorcopia.com

One of the most compelling parts of the conversation was the distinction between “worth” and “value.” We noted, appraised value might represent a high watermark, but actual market value is shaped by momentum, liquidity, and buyer sentiment. And David’s reports aim to bridge that gap – not by replacing appraisals, but by supplementing them with actionable market intelligence. “More information is better than less,” he emphasized. “This is meant to guide you and your advisors.”


Beyond Exotics: What’s Next?

While early reports focus on blue-chip models like the Ford GT Heritage Edition and Ferrari Testarossa, David is expanding Motorcopia to include enthusiast favorites, suggestions like the IROC Camaro and even oddballs like the Taurus SHO; both of which are gaining favor in the market right now, could be part of future reports.

Why? – Because these cars have passionate followings, rich sales data, and – when unmodified and original – can be surprisingly rare. “The good cars are so rare in that space,” David said. “It’s like Fox-body Mustangs.”

David was candid about AI’s potential and pitfalls, as part of an expansion of Motorcopia’s algorithm. “It’s a tool. It doesn’t replace what people are already doing,” he said. While AI can assist with data processing, it demands diligence and human oversight – especially in a field as emotionally charged and nuanced as collector cars.

Motorcopia isn’t just another valuation tool – it’s a strategic resource for anyone serious about understanding the collector car market. Whether you’re buying, selling, or holding, David Neyens is offering something rare: clarity in a world driven by passion.

As the collector car space continues to broaden – embracing Japanese classics, AMG Mercedes, and more – Motorcopia.com is poised to become an indispensable guide for the next generation of petrolhead investors.


Guest Co-Host: Don Weberg

In case you missed it... be sure to check out the Break/Fix episode with our co-host.
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Guest Co-Host: William Ross

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This content has been brought to you in-part by sponsorship through...

Motoring Podcast Network

Holiday Shopping Guide, 2025

0

In this 62nd episode of Break/Fix’s Drive Thru News, titled ‘The Ultimate Holiday Shopping Guide for the Petrolheads,’ hosts Crew Chief Eric and Brad pivot from their usual automotive news recap to present a special holiday shopping guide. The episode incorporates a playful ‘Automotive Dating Game,’ where executive producer Tania, the episode’s star, questions three panelists about their mystery cars to select one as a potential Christmas gift. Additionally, the episode features holiday gift suggestions for car enthusiasts, including a racing sim rig, LEGO car sets, retro cologne, art prints, and 1/64 diorama display sets. Sponsors are highlighted through various ad breaks, and the episode wraps up with a heartfelt acknowledgment of the fans and patrons who support the show.

Tune in everywhere you stream, download or listen!

Listen on Apple
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Showcase: Holiday Shopping Guide ’25

So what do you get for the enthusiast that already has all their toys?  – want to add to the list? Comment below! Below are all the articles, links and videos we talk about in this episode.

Get a custom SIM Rig designed by MIE Racing

Tania's first recommendation "for her" was a Racing Sim Rig. Consult with B/F guest David Middleton for you custom Sim Rig! ... [READ MORE]

LEGO Speed Champions "Formula 1" Series

Ready, set, go! LEGO® Speed Champions puts race car lovers in the driver's seat with realistic vehicle models from familiar racing competitors.  ... [READ MORE]

Socks are the new tie!

In the world of motorsports, passion often finds its way into unexpected places – like your sock drawer. For fans of fast cars and bold fashion, Portugal-based Heel Tread has become a cult favorite, transforming iconic liveries and legendary vehicles into wearable art.  ... [READ MORE]

Autel Scanner MaxiCheck MX808S

MaxiCheck MX808S bidirectional scanner is the m.ost competitive automotive diagnostic tool to date. With Rockchip RK3566 4-core CPU, 4GB RAM and 64GB ROM, built based on Android 11 platform, Autel MX808S provides 5X faster service speed than the old MK808/ MX808 and any other brand diagnostic tools which are built on the out-dated Android 4, no more slow and delayed feedback, it's time to update your garage with the 2025 new-est MX808S! ... [READ MORE]

Porcelain or Neon Garage Signs

Manufactured by Federal Electric, this original double-sided badge-style Phillips 66 sign presents gorgeously. The reddish-orange and black finish are accented by red and green neon. When Route 66 was being constructed in the 1920s, people were excited at the prospect of a single highway leading from Chicago to Los Angeles. The Phillips 66 sign debuted in 1930, just 3-years after the company opened up, and was inspired by a 66 MPH test run on a stretch of Route 66 in Oklahoma. The Phillips 66 sign combines the shape of the US highway sign with the 66 MPH speed of the test run. ... [READ MORE]

Custom Slot Car Track!

 ... [READ MORE]

THE AUTOMOTIVE WIRING MANUAL FOR BEGINNERS

A Complete Practical guide to Automotive Electrical Systems and Repair From basics to Advanced Wiring Projects and Solutions to Unusual Problems ... [READ MORE]

AAA Membership

Brad continues urge everyone to make sure they have constant coverage in case of emergency; get yourself some road-side assistance! ... [READ MORE]

Bendpak QuickJack

The QuickJack 6000TL portable car lift delivers an upgraded 6,000 lbs. lifting capacity with a reliable 24-inch lift height. Enhanced structural rigidity and a new hydraulic power unit give you faster, safer access to your vehicle’s undercarriage, perfect for your home garage or track day. ... [READ MORE]

The BlockZone: Audi Rally Quattro Group B 1984 3886pcs

Unleash the spirit of rally’s wildest era with the Audi Rally Quattro Group B 1984, a 1:8 scale masterpiece crafted from 3886 high-precision pieces. ... [READ MORE]

Grazie Alitalia, Best Of Edition

1/200 Best of Edition Every copy signed and numbered by the artist, Ricardo Santos. Cars highlighted with raised varnish printing for a beautifully striking and premium finish. Size 50 x 70 cm / 19.7 x 27.5 in. Unframed ... [READ MORE]

Aventi Designs Porsche Dealership - 1/64 LED Diorama - Hot Wheels Display

Experience the thrill of precision engineering with the Aventi Designs Porsche Dealership Diorama, a detailed 1/64 scale setup crafted for enthusiasts who appreciate performance, luxury, and design excellence. Whether you collect 911s, Caymans, or vintage Porsches, this battery-powered LED diorama is the perfect backdrop for showcasing your favorite models in a refined, showroom-style environment. ... [READ MORE]

1965 SHELBY/FORD Quilted Team Jacket

Officially Licensed by Ford Motor Company and Carroll Shelby Licensing, an exact replica of the Navy version of the iconic Carroll Shelby quilted team jacket! These were worn by the Shelby American team, and representatives of Ford Of France, at Le Mans and historic races through the 1965 racing season. ... [READ MORE]

Get away with Smoky Mountain Drives!

At Smoky Mountain Drives we organize driving adventures where like minded car enthusiasts can drive through the gorgeous scenery and amazing roads of the Great Smoky Mountains, all while enjoying great company! The roads of Eastern Tennessee and Western North Carolina are destination drives where people travel from all over the world to explore this region. All of the major exotic car rallies have made this area their drive destination, as well as iconic manufacturers such as Lamborghini, Porsche and even Pagani. Being local to these Great Smoky Mountains allow us to provide value packed events where car enthusiasts from a variety of backgrounds are treated to driving events that are second to none! On our drives, there is nothing else to think about. We have done the planning, the route selection, the driving notes, identified fuel stops, found fantastic hotels and eating spots! All you need to do is show up and be prepared to drive!. ... [READ MORE]

24 Hours of Le Mans Cologne Set

Born from the meeting of leather sophistication and the demands of the automotive world, Le Style embodies a distinctive fragrance, crafted for those who love to combine elegance, confidence, and passion. This set, created in collaboration with Corania, a renowned French perfumery house, includes the Le Style Eau de Parfum and its car fragrance diffuser. ... [READ MORE]

Porsche-inspired "FINNED" Mugs

Cylinder Mugs, inspired by iconic air-cooled engines, Finned blends design precision and passion, and is built for those who love coffee as much as cars. ... [READ MORE]

The Ferrari 250 GTO Spotting Guide A Definitive New Book for the World’s Most Iconic Car

Exclusive Kickstarter launch brings Ferrari’s most legendary model to life with more than 770 illustrations and detailed coverage of every chassis. ... [READ MORE]

**All photos come from the original article; click on the image to be taken to the original article. GTM makes no claims to this material and is not responsible for any claims made by the original authors or their sponsoring organizations. All rights to original content remain with authors/publishers.

Here are some other gift ideas from the GTM Team and Garage Style Magazine!

Check out some other gifts ideas and extra special bonuses that go with this episode!

Honorable Mentions

Garage Style Magazine

Check out even more gift ideas over at Garage Style Magazine!

Garage Style Magazine (GSM) is what’s been missing. A publication devoted entirely to garages and collections – we cover collectibles such as automobilia, petroliana, neon, porcelain, and more; we also bring to you the ideas that make a garage work, such as tools, cabinets and storage solutions, car covers, lifts, and doors to name a few; and, of course, we work in a few lifestyle bits – electronics such as stereos, televisions, and other entertainment must haves, and some luxury products such as watches, briefcases, handbags, travel ideas and personal items.

Guest Co-Host: Don Weberg

In case you missed it... be sure to check out the Break/Fix episode with our co-host.
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Shoutouts

You’ve probably heard us say many times that you can sign up for our Patreon for FREE! There’s lots of great extras and bonuses for you to enjoy. But there are folks in our community, friends of the show, and sponsors that have gone the extra mile and donated to help support the MPN and we want to acknowledge those folks personally: 

  • Edward Hughes III
  • Laurie
  • Preston Lerner
  • Jim Manley
  • Dougie Kite
  • Bill
  • Jordan DaCosta
  • Mark Steigerwald
  • Mike Smith
  • David Beattie
  • Lia Lamela
  • BL
  • Mwenya Chewe
  • DeeAnn Hopings
  • Miamimiami47
  • Austin Belzer
  • Ruben Sanchez
  • w215 Motorsports
  • Marissa Cannon
  • Andrew Mulrean
  • Romano Conti
  • Mike Arrigo
  • Max Sonderby 
  • Ashley McAnelly
  • Robert Barr
  • Mark Shank
  • Marc Huete
  • Bob Gillespie
  • Janet & Brian Worstell 
  • Brett Sonderby
  • andrew voudouris  (voo-doo-ree)
  • Brian Young
  • David Scherpf
  • John Caffese
  • B.J. Harrington
  • Sean Roberts
  • Harry Brill
  • Rebecca Griffith
  • Ryan Compton
  • John Richter
  • Dr. Gordon Bell
  • Ron Shurie 
  • and Mike & Chrissy Crutchfield

Additionally, We’d like to thank all of our sponsors who helped us kick butt this season, (ROUND ROBIN)

Rich People Thangs!

TRANSCRIPT

Executive Producer Tania: [00:00:00] Welcome to Break Fixes, drive-through News, your monthly recap for everything fast, fascinating, and usually four wheels. We’re serving up a fresh batch of automotive headlines, motorsports madness, and car adjacent curiosities. All with zero wait time and maximum flavor from Formula One. Drama to Concept Car debuts with garage built.

To the quirkiest stories rolling out of the state of Florida, we’ve got your fix. So grab your coffee, buckle up, and let’s cruise through the latest in the world of wheels with a side of entertainment and just a dash of tire smoke.

Crew Chief Brad: Ho ho. Welcome to drive through episode number 62, but instead of our regularly scheduled ranting and raving, we’re back with the ultimate holiday shopping guide for the petrol heads in your life that might not have everything yet.

So let’s pull up the window, number one for some gift ideas.

Crew Chief Eric: I mean, that sounds like the same thing we’ve done every year, doesn’t it, pinky?

Crew Chief Brad: It does bring,

Crew Chief Eric: how about we do something different this year? How [00:01:00] about instead of our standard holiday shopping guide, we dip into the waters of what should I buy with a special version of the automotive dating game?

Him.

And with that, I’m your host crew, chief Eric here to bring you laughs, surprises, and maybe even a little bit of buying advice. So just like the classic show from the Groovy 1970s, we’ve got three mystery cars waiting behind the curtain, ready to charm their way to the heart of our lucky collector. What do you think, Brad?

Crew Chief Brad: I think we’re ready to go. I think this is a fantastic idea. I think our motors are revved. We’re ready to go

Crew Chief Eric: first. Let’s meet the star of today’s show. She’s fun. She’s adventurous and ready to find a new ride that can keep up with her existing collection of collective cars. Please welcome our very own executive producer Tanya.

Executive Producer Tania: Hi everyone.

Crew Chief Eric: Hi, Tanya. I’m not sure I wanna take that. Looking for a new ride?[00:02:00]

All right, Tanya. Just like the classic 1970s game, the rules are simple. You’ll be asking questions to our panel of Petrolhead about the car they’ve selected for you. Remember, you can’t see the cars. You’ll get to know them by our panelists answers, and at the end, you’ll choose the car you’d like to take as your Christmas gift.

Alright, I’m ready. Well, now let’s meet our three panelists. Well, sort of again, their cars are hidden away, but I’ll give you a little teaser about each one. Contestant number one claims his car can launch off the line faster than an Apollo era rocket from Pennsylvania. Let’s welcome Max Zenman.

Max Kaiserman: Good afternoon, evening, and good night.

If I don’t see you later. Contestant number two is a world

Crew Chief Eric: traveler who claims they’ve never run out of fuel yet from the place the young kids call mid. Let’s welcome William. Big money Ross. Good

William Ross: evening

Crew Chief Eric: and contestant number three. He’s a foodie who believes pineapple absolutely belongs on pizza. All the [00:03:00] way from that great southern state of Virginia.

It’s crew Chief Brad,

Crew Chief Brad: we’re gonna find

Crew Chief Eric: out

Executive Producer Tania: as the youngins say in the mid, we’re gonna fho six seven.

Max Kaiserman: Oh geez, my son’s five. He doesn’t get these things yet. Thank God. It’ll be worse

Crew Chief Eric: then. But with that, let’s give a big round of applause for our contestants. But before we dive into the question round, let’s take a quick break for some holiday messages.

REVS PROMO: Explore the beauty of automotive history@revsphotos.com, the official source for fine art prints from Revs Institute’s digital library. Each image is carefully curated from the institute’s world renowned archive, capturing rare moments in motorsport and design history. Every photograph is digitally restored and available in premium print finishes perfect for collectors.

Enthusiasts and anyone who appreciates the art of the automobile. Visit revs photos.com to own an authentic piece of automotive heritage curated by [00:04:00] Revs Institute.

Crew Chief Eric: Alright folks, it’s time to play Tanya. The stage is yours. Time to ask away.

Executive Producer Tania: Are we ready for this? I am not, but let’s get into it. This is a question for all the Garage Queens, future Garage Queens, garage Queen Number one.

Would you consider yourself a summer or a winter?

William Ross: I believe I’d consider myself a summer.

Executive Producer Tania: Same question number two.

William Ross: Oh, I’m definitely summer ’cause I really enjoy going topless.

Executive Producer Tania: And number three,

Crew Chief Brad: I think I was designed and built in the summer, but I’m very much a winter vehicle.

Executive Producer Tania: All right. Which feature contestant number two would you add to

William Ross: yourself?

What I would add to myself, I don’t know. I’m pretty complete package, but the only thing I could think of that I would need to add would be maybe some fuzzy dice hanging off the rear view mirror. Oh geez. Garage queen number three

Crew Chief Brad: the same. Oh, what would I [00:05:00] like to myself? Yeah. I want the

William Ross: same question

Executive Producer Tania: on this.

Ooh,

Crew Chief Brad: he’s, he’s being sultry, being suspense, sultry. I’m doing this. The, the shatner. I would add something. I’m not sure yet. I don’t know that I would need to add anything. Maybe a bumper sticker that says I love Italia.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh, we’ll throw this one at garage Queen number one as well.

Max Kaiserman: I think I would add space for my moon boots and helmet and possibly.

A little bit of extra fuel for 250,000 miles.

Executive Producer Tania: All right, you’re losing me here, but, uh,

then here we go. Garage queen number one. Since we’re going 250,000 miles worth of fuel, if we were going on this long road trip, what’s one thing you’d make sure was in the trunk?

Max Kaiserman: Uh, I don’t have a trunk to put any junk in. If I did. The luggage rack would have two [00:06:00] sparkling glasses of champagne for the two of us.

No, uh, don’t drink and drive kids. I think a luggage rack for my, um, moon rocks.

Executive Producer Tania: Okay. Continue with the space theme. Do you think we’d make it on this long extended road trip?

Max Kaiserman: Oh yeah. You, me and a third guy. Actually, I think there’s three of us.

Executive Producer Tania: All right.

Max Kaiserman: Only see two. So someone’s sitting on someone’s lap.

Executive Producer Tania: We’re not gonna break down. We’re gonna make it.

Max Kaiserman: No breaking down, no nothing but good old parts made in, um, America.

Executive Producer Tania: America. All right, crash queen number three. What song would be playing on the radio?

Crew Chief Brad: I’m not sure. I like a big pizza Viol some more.

Executive Producer Tania: I’m gonna ask this question to everybody. Garage Queen two.

What songs playing on the radio

William Ross: wouldn’t be specific. One song, but would be a specific artist and that would be Bob Seger.

Executive Producer Tania: Okay. Number one,

William Ross: fly Me

Max Kaiserman: to the Moon. Let me play Among the Star. [00:07:00] Well, Frank Sinatra for y’all.

Executive Producer Tania: Alright, which is more important? Number two. Speed, style or utility?

William Ross: Oh, definitely style.

Definitely style.

Executive Producer Tania: We got those fuzzy dice. I don’t know if they were pink, but they were fuzzy dice in the mirror. Oh, they could be pink, definitely. Why not? I think I know the answer to number ones would also be style. ’cause we’re going to the moon. But maybe it’d be utility also. ’cause we can go to the moon.

Max Kaiserman: No speed. Baby Speed.

Executive Producer Tania: Speed. What about you? Number three? I can’t leave you out.

Crew Chief Brad: Please don’t leave me out. Definitely the style. And utility are the most important.

Executive Producer Tania: Oil and utility. All right. What is your least favorite trait about yourself? Number one.

Max Kaiserman: Hmm. I work too hard. I look great for my age, and I look great with the top up or tops off.

So, wait, that didn’t really answer your question, did it? [00:08:00]

Executive Producer Tania: So you love yourself. Okay.

Max Kaiserman: Since 1954.

Executive Producer Tania: Number two, same question. I want to hear from everyone. Least favorite trait. What could you change about yourself?

William Ross: Uh, I have a tendency to get a little hot pretty quickly.

Executive Producer Tania: Uh oh. Gonna overheat. All right. So we wouldn’t make it on a long road trip.

Well, the tops off. You could, that would cool

William Ross: everything down. Oh, okay.

Executive Producer Tania: Things in

William Ross: check.

Executive Producer Tania: All right. And number three,

Crew Chief Brad: I would say the thing I like least about me is that there just aren’t more of me around.

Executive Producer Tania: All right. Limited productions. And number three, there’s not many of you around. How do you feel about weather?

Crew Chief Brad: Oh, baby, I can handle any weather you need.

Executive Producer Tania: All right, all weather, all terrain. Maybe number two. If you were gonna star in a movie, what genre movie, or you can name a movie, however you feel like answering that.

William Ross: Oh, I would fit perfectly into Cannonball Run too.

Executive Producer Tania: All right. That would

William Ross: be ideal.

Executive Producer Tania: What about you?

Number [00:09:00] one,

Max Kaiserman: movies starring Tom Hanks, where he may or may not be stranded on an island with a coconut. Not on an island, but far away.

Executive Producer Tania: Okay, Tom Hanks movie. Horse gone.

Same question number three

Crew Chief Brad: was to star in a movie, TV show or whatever.

Executive Producer Tania: Sure. Or genre of film, comedy, romance, action.

Crew Chief Brad: I would be in a romantic comedy. But I wouldn’t be the star. I’d be in the background. Something that only Eric would see for a split second while watching the movie.

Executive Producer Tania: Did you see that? He’d pause. Take a screenshot and then share with all of us, and

Crew Chief Brad: then he would ask Daniel to look it up in the database.

Executive Producer Tania: I’m gonna circle back real quick to number two, Cannonball Run. Who in that movie would you most associate yourself [00:10:00] with? Bert Dom, Dee, Jackie Chan. Shirley McClain.

William Ross: Oh, no.

This would definitely be Mr. Burt Reynolds all over it.

Executive Producer Tania: Okay.

William Ross: And a newer version. I guess you would say

Crew Chief Eric: noon. Improved bird.

William Ross: Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, but not dead one.

William Ross: Not a dead one. One. Still able to walk. But definitely I think a cowboy hat would go very well with this car.

Executive Producer Tania: Ooh, I’m getting some vibes. All right. What is your most worn out part or a part that you can’t obtain for yourself?

The elusive unobtainium part. Number three, what am I going to the mechanic for right away?

Crew Chief Brad: Definitely my wiring and my fuses. And my relays. Anything that is needed to make me actually run. I think you’re gonna need a mechanic garage. Queen number

Executive Producer Tania: one,

Crew Chief Brad: the

Max Kaiserman: brakes. ’cause we ain’t stopping.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh man. Number two, same [00:11:00] question.

William Ross: It would definitely have to be my front end ’cause it’s a very, very expensive park. They got pills for that now. Yeah, that might come in handy. Definitely to lift it up. You would definitely need something like that.

Executive Producer Tania: See, these are the vibes I was getting. All right, so those only

Crew Chief Brad: last four hours though.

Executive Producer Tania: Quite

William Ross: overheat.

Executive Producer Tania: Garage Queen number two. With that, are we getting into, or are we getting out of

William Ross: mischief? Oh, getting into mischief. Totally. Lots of smoke, lots of noise. Lots. Screeching and squealing.

Executive Producer Tania: All right. Garage queen number one. If you could race on any track, which track would it be?

Max Kaiserman: Probably a big, long runway someplace, my God.

But, uh, Lamont wasn’t too bad either for us.

Executive Producer Tania: Mm. Okay. All right. Number two, could you make it around a track?

Crew Chief Brad: Long as it wasn’t too long?

William Ross: Number

Executive Producer Tania: three,

Crew Chief Brad: Pikes Peak before it was paved.

Executive Producer Tania: That’s an intriguing [00:12:00] answer. Huh.

Crew Chief Eric: Oh no, that sounds signals. We’ve reached the end of our questioning. Tanya, you get one more opportunity to get some clues about your future car before we go into our decision round.

Executive Producer Tania: I will end it on a fun note.

Crew Chief Eric: This hasn’t all been fun.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh, it has all been fun. We’ll add whimsy to it.

Crew Chief Brad: Ooh.

Executive Producer Tania: Which superhero would drive you?

All around. Starting in reverse number three,

Crew Chief Brad: which superhero would drive me? Clark Kent, but not Superman.

Executive Producer Tania: Clark Kent, but not Superman. Okay. So we’re a star in a reasonably priced vehicle. Got it. Number two.

William Ross: Oh, this would have Captain America written all over it. Wow.

Executive Producer Tania: Number one,

William Ross: since

Max Kaiserman: they actually did comics for it, it would be Neil Armstrong.

Crew Chief Eric: [00:13:00] Well, Tanya, are you satisfied with your round of questioning? Do you have enough information to base your decision on

Executive Producer Tania: eating meaty miny mo?

Crew Chief Eric: Well, before we go in for the big reveal, how about a word from our sponsors?

Max Kaiserman: Geral the best thing since sliced bread. Geral. Get it now. Mostly opium, www.geral.com.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m so leading that in.

Rick Schad: I don’t know if it’s real website. I usually post all my models on LinkedIn. That’s kind of where I got my start. My first commissions came, believe it or not, from LinkedIn. And I build anything. It doesn’t have to be cars, I build anything, planes, boats, tanks, it doesn’t matter. So if you’re interested in having something really special, go to at the pope of plastic on TikTok at the Pope of Plastic on TikTok, also on Instagram at the popa plastic on, on uh, LinkedIn.

You can always. Find me at Rick Shad, [00:14:00] R-I-C-K-S-C-H-A-D-I post. You know, please reach out to me. You can also email me at Rick Shad, SCHA d@gmail.com, or you can email me at the popa plastic@gmail.com. We’d love to have you all come and visit me if you come and watch me at TikTok live. Just tell. Saw me, you know, on the internet or whatever, and I’d love to say hi.

And don’t be scared of TikTok for crying out loud. Don’t believe all the hype and feel free to ask me any questions.

Crew Chief Eric: Alright, Tanya, you’ve heard from all three panelists about their cars. Now comes the big moment. You have 60 seconds in which to decide which car it’ll be. Is it Max’s? Williams or Brad

and your choice is,[00:15:00]

Executive Producer Tania: well, this is a really hard decision, honestly. I’m pretty sure I probably want. Garage Queen number three, but I don’t know what garage queen number one is at all, and I’m compelled to go with that. Garage Queen number two scares me and I feel like it’s outside my vibe zone. It’s probably on the opposite spectrum of your vibe zone,

Max Kaiserman: but don’t fear the unknown.

Embrace it. Embrace the unknown.

Executive Producer Tania: And I think I’m going to, as it was said, eclectic collection. The number one would definitely be adding to an eclectic collection. So we’ll go with garage queen number one,

Crew Chief Eric: flash down, and for our fabulous new couple, that’s Tanya and the car, we’ve arranged this. Special garage meetup for you, but first Max has to get that car run through the car wash. So we’ll talk about the cars you didn’t choose. So let’s see what [00:16:00] Tanya passed up, taking home to her garage tonight.

Panelist number three. Brad, what was your car?

Crew Chief Brad: Tanya’s going to be very upset that she passed on is a 2005 Alpha Romeo 1 56 Cross Wagon Q4 Turbo Diesel manual. Geez.

William Ross: I was to link to that bad boy. I was thinking you were going for a La Forza when you started saying utility. Driving it. Honestly. I was like, okay, that’s about Brad’s thing getting way out there. I think of La Forza.

Crew Chief Brad: It’s got utility. It’s all wheel drive. It’s a wagon manual. Turbo diesel. It’s the better Fiat Panda.

Max Kaiserman: I thought it was a Jeep that someone left in Italy for some reason. You know?

Crew Chief Eric: And I know we had a $50,000 budget. What did this car sell for Brad?

Executive Producer Tania: 49,009. Nine nine.

Crew Chief Brad: Look at the link.

Executive Producer Tania: Oh my God. What? How much was this?

Crew Chief Brad: 4,100 [00:17:00]

Executive Producer Tania: you say four grand. 4,100.

Crew Chief Brad: We’ve got $46,000 to have fun with on our date.

MUSIC: Oh,

Max Kaiserman: you could get it rewired and spend the rest of the time looking at each other longingly in the, in the lobby of, of the, of the service station.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah. We’ve got $46,000 for AAA membership.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, we heard from panelist number three with the Alpha Romeo. How about panelist number two? William, what did you bring to the party?

William Ross: Oh, we could go second Gen Dodge Viper. Mm.

Crew Chief Eric: What? Really, I, I could have sworn

William Ross: yours was a Cadillac.

Crew Chief Eric: I was thinking the same thing actually. Like an

Max Kaiserman: xts or something like that.

Crew Chief Brad: Thought he had to hook him. Horns on the front,

Max Kaiserman: eh?

Executive Producer Tania: Oh man. He threw me. When you’re talking about,

William Ross: well, when I said the Cannonball rundown, I was like, I wanna be show. That was the genre. Not so much fixing the movie and then, yeah, yeah. A newer version of Bert. So like an updated type. I thought [00:18:00] maybe the cowboy hat would do it.

Thinking Carol Shelby ish. You know, like

Executive Producer Tania: you threw me when it, you started talking about lifting it and dice. I thought it was gonna be some like squatted out

Crew Chief Eric: amino or something. Well, it’s a dodge. Yeah. Well, gentlemen, as a consolation prize for being the unlucky panelist, Tanya did not choose your cars.

You don’t go home empty handed. Tonight, we’ve registered you for the upcoming Mecu auction in beautiful Kissimmee, Florida. You’re on the hook for all the expenses, but don’t forget.

Don Weberg: Nobody sells more than Mecu nobody. Mecu Auctions is the world’s leader of collector car vintage and antique motorcycle and road art sales hosting auctions throughout the United States.

The company has specialized in the sale of collector cars for more than 35 years now, offering more than 22,000 lots per year and averaging more than one auction per month. Mecom Auctions is headquartered in Walworth, Wisconsin, and since 2011 had [00:19:00] been ranked number one in the world with the number of collective cars offered at auction, and its host to the world’s largest collective car auction held annually in.

Kissimmee Florida, as well as the largest motorcycle auction held annually in Las Vegas, Nevada Mecca’s Road a and Mecca on Time. Divisions offer a wide variety of collectibles for live and online auctions. You can learn more and follow Mecu and their upcoming events at www dot mecca. Dot com or you can follow them on social at mecom Auction on Facebook, at Mecom Auctions, on Instagram, at mecom, on Twitter, and at Mecom Auction on YouTube.

Crew Chief Eric: Nobody sells more than Mecu. Nobody. Alright, Tanya, this is it. Let’s meet the lucky winner.

Executive Producer Tania: I’m scared. Yeah. I wanna know what this is. I’m scared. This is gonna be something that’s like the equivalent of the Oscar Meyer Wienermobile or [00:20:00] something, but a space shuttle. All

Crew Chief Eric: right, max,

show her what you brought to the party. What has Tanya selected to take home to her garage today?

Max Kaiserman: As a representative of the, uh, historic Space Program, we are talking about a 1970 1,454 LS, five Corvette,

MUSIC: not too shatter.

Max Kaiserman: This one’s the convertible for more than what we talked about, but the T top in 71 was equally as nice.

Top on or top off, and no trunk.

Crew Chief Eric: So if you’re a female Corvette owner, do you still get the Jorts and the new balances? Does it come with it? No

Executive Producer Tania: big sunglasses and a scarf.

Max Kaiserman: Seventies glasses.

Executive Producer Tania: Audrey Hepburn, a scarf around and then big glasses.

Max Kaiserman: Yeah.

Executive Producer Tania: Hair blowing in the wind or, yeah. Wrapped up. Alright. All right.

I was scared. This wasn’t too bad.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, [00:21:00] folks, that’s all for today’s special holiday. What should I buy? Episode of the Automotive Dating Game. Thanks for joining us. And remember, your next ride might just be one question away, but stay tuned before, after the break for our next event, something we’re calling three Wise Bolts that.

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Crew Chief Eric: And we’re back to quote our friend Steve and Izzy. Those were just the most amazing ads that ever added in the history of adding.

So up next we have three wise vols where we’re gonna do a quick round robin of gift ideas for the Petrolhead in your life. This can go one of two ways are lovely. Panelists are gonna suggest gifts that they would have bought for themselves, gifts that they would buy for their best car bestie, and something you must buy.

Or are traditional for you, for your ride or for your garage?

Executive Producer Tania: Well, mine will be lame, so I can start.

Crew Chief Eric: [00:23:00] Well, with that positive endorsement, let’s go with Tanya.

Crew Chief Brad: Please sell a 72 Corvette.

Executive Producer Tania: Yeah,

Crew Chief Brad: I

Executive Producer Tania: don’t need anything anymore. I’m good.

Max Kaiserman: It does your hair for you. You don’t have to, you never have to get a hair dryer again.

Executive Producer Tania: Exactly. I scratched that off my holiday wishlist this year. But I will need a good brush ’cause it’s gonna be a rat’s nest. Buy for myself. A racing sim rig. Oh, buy for a car bestie. Any of the Formula one Lego sets. All right. And a must buy. Any car themed apparel is a must buy for any car enthusiast.

Check out Blip Shift for custom design t-shirts, or even heel tread for custom livery inspired socks both short and tall.

Max Kaiserman: And on your way there. Don’t forget to check out lunar replicas.com for your official Ford and Shelby Apparel. Shameless. Sorry. Sorry, I had to throw that in.

William Ross: William, how about you?

What have you got for [00:24:00] me? I’m gonna buy, I obviously seem like we’re not really worried about price here. Since our contestant went over there and went with a sim rig. I would get a, a shoe marker helmet, full size, you know, real legit, raised, worn helmet. Signed by him would be. And then for, uh, my garage, I would definitely buy a legit like golf sign or some sort of nice sign or like a old neon one, something along those lines.

They could hang on the wall and the other route I’d go. Then for the one would just be, I mean, a nice remote control. Type, either a Porsche or Ferrari or something along the line, just so someone can play with that. That would be lots of fun. Can race it around the Christmas tree.

Crew Chief Eric: Nice. Brad, what about your gift ideas?

What do you suggest for the car enthusiast that has everything in their life?

Crew Chief Brad: So I’m going to go out of order a little bit here for my bestie, who’s sitting in screen number five here. I’m getting you a book. It is the Automotive Wiring and Electrical System Guide for beginners.

Crew Chief Eric: Is it for an Alpha [00:25:00] 1 56 sports station wagon?

It is

Crew Chief Brad: not. It is not, but it is. It is in large print, and it was printed in September 27th, 2025. Large print. It’ll help you a lot with your nine 14.

Crew Chief Eric: Or somebody else’s GTI

Crew Chief Brad: or somebody else’s GTI for the must buy for anybody really that operates in automobile. I said it before, I’ll say it again. AAA membership I think is very important.

Executive Producer Tania: That’s about as just as exciting as diagnostic tool I was gonna suggest.

Crew Chief Brad: Exactly. Exactly. Now for the real prize for myself, I see every Christmas season these car commercials with the big red bow in the hood. And you know what nothing says. I love you quite like a 9 9 1 Porsche nine 11 GT three Rs. So that’s what I would buy myself,

Crew Chief Eric: max.

You could empathize there, can’t you?

Max Kaiserman: Yeah, that was my gift to myself [00:26:00] recently. So well, nine nine a 9 9 1 4 SII don’t need the GT four rss.

Crew Chief Eric: Nobody needs the gt. Oh, I I definitely want it a

Max Kaiserman: four s with a cob tune. I’m making 450 horsepower. Nobody needs that car either. Exactly. Exactly.

Crew Chief Eric: Max, you’re behind the mic.

What are your gifts suggestions for the 2025 season?

Max Kaiserman: For my car bestie, who happens to be my my wife? We recently upgraded from her 2014 Cross Trek to a 2021 or 22, I forget, uh, Forester. So a Subaru Forester certified pre-owned. It was an excellent bargain and they gave her a really good deal on the, uh, trade-in value on the cross trek.

So that was quite an upgrade. Excellent car despite the CVT. Anyway, the uh, um, so the gift to, uh, to myself. I recently bought a 1961 Corvette, which is the last truly good year of [00:27:00] the, uh, no, no, I’m sorry. 62 is a great year for a C one, but just the perfect styling. It’s, it’s a C two from the back and a C one from all other angles.

It is the perfect Corvette and a gift for the garage or for anybody’s garage. I highly recommend if you wrench or if you do. Work yourself. The Ben Pack. Quick jacks. What an awesome, awesome, awesome addition to a garage. I just got mine the other day and it has instantly changed the way I work in the garage.

So Ben Pack, quick Jacks and I got the new one, the 6,000 tl, the whatever the regular one is, but the 6,000 pound one. Which has some like added safeties and stuff like that. It can do everything in my collection. I mean, all the way up to a a ca. I have a Porsche Cayenne as well. It can pull the cayenne up.

Incredibly well made and I recommend everybody get one. If they can’t put a regular set of lifts in their garage, get a quick jack and they go on sale this time of year too. Actually. There’s lots of sales. I think Costco used to sell them. Discount codes or anything. [00:28:00] Discount code 1, 2, 3. No, I, I don’t know.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s the Facebook marketplace code. Yeah. So Max, while we still got you, do you wanna promote any of the wares you have on lunar replicas?

Max Kaiserman: Absolutely. Yeah. So, uh, I’m wearing, I’m wearing one of my wares right now, two of my wares. If you’re a Shelby fan, if you’re a classic car fan, if you’re a Ford versus Ferrari fan.

We are the original uniform supplier to Shelby and Ford teams in the 1960s, and we’re bringing them back out for the public. So you can get our team shirts from 19 64 65, and we’ll be releasing the 66 team shirts and jackets this winter. You can also get the, the historic 1965. Team jackets and shirts.

That was the team that sent seven cars to Laman in 1965 into the historic Daytona coup, the GT 40, mark two, the Cobras, everything. The Ford teams that year were really amazing and the Shelby team itself really made a name for itself and they wore our uniforms there and you can [00:29:00] get them yourself. Some great pictures of the guys wearing them when it rained terribly at Sebring in 65.

The pits were four feet of water and the, uh, chaparrals were literally like submarines in there. Yet somehow they still won. Who knew? In any case, we make the uniforms. They’re exactly the right thing to wear in your Cobra Mustang GT 40 Daytona coop, and they do keep you warm. The jacket is actually quite warm and it has a hood.

We are coming out with a helmet bag as well, so it’s sort of an overnight bag. We’re looking at expanding our line into driving gloves and some other, so sort of the gentleman racer kind of vibe, but very 1960s, possibly a set of driving shoes in the future. Maybe even an affordable watch for you watch fans out there.

Crew Chief Eric: Now it’s time for my picks, so I generally like to. I give a little bit of myself when I give a gift to someone else, right? So something that when they look at it or they use it, or you know, whatever, it reminds them of me. ’cause you know, hey, that’s important, right? So for [00:30:00] my bestie, then there’s multiples.

But for my bestie, I would get them from the block zone. The 3,886 piece Audi Quatro Group B Rally Car. They can assemble it over those cold winter months in front of the fireplace, and at the end have a one eighth scale model that they put together themselves. That reminds them of me every time they look at it.

I love the stuff that the block zone is putting together. There’s some very, very cool models. This one obviously speaks to me in very profound ways, but check out the block zone.com for some great Christmas. Ideas for the motorist in your life.

Max Kaiserman: It’s only 260 bucks too. Wow. Look at that. Yeah, it’s really cool.

Executive Producer Tania: And Black Friday sales are live, so get it at a discount.

Crew Chief Eric: Fire up the Quattro. All right. For myself, there’s a ton of artists that either demonstrate or put their wares. On social media all the time. We’ve interviewed a bunch of them. Folks like Samantha Zimmerman and Chris Dunlop, and you know, you go on down the line, but there’s a new bunch of [00:31:00] artists out there that are putting out some really epic, very pointed prints and limited numbers that I really, really enjoy.

And the first one that came out, and this comes from ricardo car artwork.com. Was the Alitalia inspired generational list of all the Lancias that wore the Alitalia livery. I think this looks super cool to include the airplane, and then they’ve branched off and they’ve included things like the Audis.

They’ve done Porsches, they have this whole chronology series of limited run prints. They’re signed by the artists and I think they’re just absolutely fabulous. So for me, this is something I wanna put in the hallway. People come over and go, that’s super cool. What is that? And so if you’re into, you know, the group B era, you’re into the group C cars, that kind of thing, that’s your style.

This is where it’s at.

Crew Chief Brad: I just found my new art piece, the Ferrari two 50 GTO.

Max Kaiserman: They’ve got the Quatro version and the CIA martini.

Crew Chief Brad: Those are killer.

Max Kaiserman: Yeah, they’re really [00:32:00] cool.

William Ross: What’s the tariff on that stuff? Changes every day, right?

Crew Chief Eric: Unfortunately. Despite the tariffs, they’re priced pretty reasonably too. If I remember correctly, they’re somewhere around 80 euros, which they are roughly a hundred bucks. That’s not bad. Even if you didn’t buy it for yourself, you bought it for the enthusiast in your life that you know, really likes that generation of car.

These are where it’s at, and these are new as of this year, so super, super cool. And finally, a must buy as an AVID one 64th scale model collector. I present you with Thei designs. Diorama display sets for your one 64th cars. You’ve probably seen these also floating around the internet. They’re these really cool, highly detailed dioramas that are like Porsche dealership.

There’s a seven 11 back behind the ramen shop and you know, all these kinds of things where you can park your themed 1 64 scale models and have a really cool display. They even sell display cases for the dioramas so you can [00:33:00] build it out into a wall and have these really cool scenes. They’re LED backlit, I mean, just.

Absolutely fabulous. Incredibly detailed. Not too, too expensive, but to me, as a collector, these are a must buy. They’re also on sale now. Yeah. Price better at all, man. Those are pretty cool.

Max Kaiserman: 94, 42 down from 1 44 95.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s a bargain. So those are my three gifts.

Max Kaiserman: I got my wife a forester, but this is actually cooler.

That’s, oh man, I, I’m amazed. Anything Porsche is less than like 500 bucks. Actually, that’s,

Crew Chief Eric: it’s funny you should say that, max, because what would a drive through holiday special be without some rich people? Thanks. Totally

Max Kaiserman: Unrelated to cars.

Crew Chief Eric: Okay.

Max Kaiserman: I recently went to DC for a meeting and I had some spare time.

I went to museum called the uh, people’s House, which is about the White House, and it was, uh, open just about a year ago by the White House Historic Commission. It tells a [00:34:00] lot about the White House and stuff like that, but any case, the gift shop there has some really cool little things, and one of them was.

Colognes made by the same companies that made colognes for US Presidents current president excluded, but John F. Kennedy apparently wore Caswell masses’, jockey club cologne, and aftershave. And I gotta tell you, for a guy that doesn’t wear cologne, I got it for the novelty. I, I live in the 1960s basically, so I got it for the novelty.

It is the nicest smelling cologne I’ve ever come across. It’s just unbelievable. Marilyn Monroe liked it. I hear he had a, uh, tennis instructor that was a fan and get it now before

William Ross: the White House is turned into a pink Mar-a-Lago. Yeah, right. Get it, get them now.

Max Kaiserman: No kidding. I mean, I’m really not a Cologne person, but this has been transformative.

I feel it’s vintage, it’s historic. They actually were the same company that provided colognes for George Washington. They’ve been in business. It’s a British company. They’ve been around since Stonehenge or something. Yeah, [00:35:00] the Druid smelled great. Are you

MUSIC: sure about? That

Max Kaiserman: was best. You know, they were working with what they got.

You smelled like a donkey. It was an improvement. Anyway, so Caswell Massey. Jockey Club. Seriously, I was blown away by this, and now I get the appeal of John F. Kennedy. It really makes sense.

Crew Chief Eric: Max, I’m glad you went here because normally under rich people things we would talk about watches and so we’d never really talked about colognes, although we’ve chatted about it on Discord before.

And so you open the door, you open Pandora’s box a little bit. So I wanna mention, as many folks might know, I actually wear Ferrari cologne and they have different versions. They have the carbon, they have the Russell. I actually wear the black ’cause I think it smells the best. They had a jello for a while, but you order it from Ferrari, you can actually get it on Amazon.

You can get a bunch of different places. It’s not that expensive. It makes a great gift. And again, try the sense out. The Black seems to be the most neutral. But it’s kind of funny, the number of car manufacturers that actually have colognes. Cadillac, Jaguar, Ferrari. [00:36:00] There’s Porsche design stuff.

Max Kaiserman: Yeah, the Pure, I think it is.

Yeah, I think they have them in the stores and stuff. Or if you go to the Porsche, boutiques in

Crew Chief Eric: malls and things. But more importantly, tying all this back to cars and racing. This summer when we were at Lamont’s Classic, William and I actually got the sample. The red, the white and blue colognes, the official 24 hour of Lama colognes that you can buy from the boutique.

You can also buy online@boutique.lama.org.

Max Kaiserman: Well, it’s not red, white, and blue. It’d be blue, white, and

Crew Chief Eric: red. Yes, yes, that’s true. Blue, white, and red. You’re right. My point is though, another inexpensive gift that says, Hey, I understand you as a car enthusiast. Here’s something you may or may not have. You pick up the bottle and go, Hey, that reminds me of the person that gave it to me.

Max Kaiserman: Does it smell like cigarettes, coffee and gasoline? That’s

Crew Chief Eric: red, white cigarettes, coffee and urine and baguettes. I mean, how did you guess Check out all the car inspired colognes that are out there, especially if you’re watch shopping or trying to put together a package for the car enthusiast in your life.

Max Kaiserman: One more honorable mention along with that [00:37:00] Omega. Has the Omega Aqua Terra cologne, which is phenomenal. It is the only other cologne that I have ever liked personally. I haven’t tried the Porsche or the Ferrari colognes yet. But the uh, omega aqua is really lovely and it’s been the same. They don’t have five or six of them, they just have one, and it’s sold in boutiques alongside watches.

William Ross: Well, speaking of the watches. Aaron, Shelby showed us his at lama. Is it Fossil bva? Yeah.

Max Kaiserman: Yeah, it was bva. I, I’m not sure about Fossil. Bva and Breitling were the two that had them for a little bit.

William Ross: Great line, great price. Yeah. They came out with some awesome watches that are, uh, Shelby themed.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, William, as we wrap out this rich people thing, segment, do you wanna talk about the new Ferrari two 50 GTO book that came out?

William Ross: This gentleman, this is his first shot at doing this, but he delves into. Every single chassis number of the two 50 GTOs and gets into their history. You wanna talk about thorough. If you’re a big fan of the Ferrari two 50 GTO, I mean, this is an outstanding book to get. It’s a limited [00:38:00] edition. He’s only doing a few hundred of them.

It gets into. Minute details, great stories about each specific chassis. It’s a great coffee table book if you wanna have something that’s a good, great conversation piece. Uh, and there’s some really cool stories about it in there as well. And he said it is on our website. I know he was taking deposits for it.

I’m not sure where it’s that. I haven’t checked on that lately. I know I put a deposit down

Crew Chief Eric: and the name of the book is the Ferrari two 50 GTO Spotting Guide. And it even has sections in the book where you can write when you’ve. Seen A GTO like at Pebble Beach Notes or at another car show. So you can annotate the times you’ve seen it and it’s almost like the Auto Bond Society birdwatching type of book, but for cars.

Yeah, it’s really interesting.

William Ross: You know, I like what he did with it, like doing that. I guess it’s something where you look at it once and you set it down and it starts collecting dust. It’s something you can always go back to and look at it like to your point is make notes in there about where you see and everything like that.

So I don’t wanna say interactive to an extent.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, it’s a

William Ross: great book. The guy’s a super nice guy too. I

Crew Chief Eric: talk

William Ross: to him.

Crew Chief Eric: I’ll add to that as we wrap this out. And these are Porsche priced. If you haven’t seen [00:39:00] them, look up the find mugs. They are replicas of the air cooled nine 11 cylinders, or what they call the jugs, and they’re made into coffee mugs.

They look really cool. They’re made out of. God knows what am

Max Kaiserman: and what happens when you put it in the microwave. Bad things happen. When you put it

Crew Chief Eric: in. The microwave takes off. It’ll f on your Ken do. Yeah, so probably magnesium, like the real things, but they are really, really slick. So check out, fend for the Unmistakably Iconic nine 11 inspired coffee mugs.

William Ross: Or if you want. We’ll custom make hoodies for you with the MPN logo on ’em, on the sleeves, 65 on the back, everything like that. So if you want something really unique, let us know. We’ll get ’em custom made for you.

Crew Chief Eric: Three easy payments of

William Ross: X

ECM PROMO: 85

William Ross: for

ECM PROMO: 24

Crew Chief Eric: months. Put that on layaway.

ECM PROMO: For everything from Ferrari and Porsche, Lamborghini and Konig seg.

Visit exotic car marketplace.com if you’re into anything with wheels and a motor. Log onto the Motoring Podcast [00:40:00] network. And check out our family of podcasts@motoringpodcast.net. This is the place to find your favorite new show. Next up a shout out to David Beatie and his team at Slot Mods who custom build some of the coolest slot car tracks in the world@slotmods.com.

Let your imagination run wild. And finally, grand touring motorsports covering all aspects of auto racing and motorsports history. Check out their ine@gtmotorsports.org. All the links for our sponsors are in the description.

Crew Chief Eric: And much like the classic 1970s National Lampoons movie, what would a Christmas holiday be without a Griswold Family Road trip?

Max Kaiserman: This part of the program I kind of wanted to talk about one of the easy. Car related vacations you can take, and that is [00:41:00] finding the roads near you that are the coolest to drive on. Whether it’s a scenic route, a route that takes you to the most impressive diners or drive-ins, or dives or switchbacks that will make your car spin on a dime.

Where would you travel stateside Europe. Where would you like the best roads to travel to if you’re traveling even on a budget,

Crew Chief Eric: it’s not the road from Paris to Lamont, right? Will you? God no. That’s going. You just drive to, from Indiana,

William Ross: get the same thing. Just close your eyes and say I’m in France. You know what?

I wanna go check it out. I had heard about it before, but then kind of escaped my mind and maybe one of you guys, maybe a driven, not max, my Brad, maybe you have, but have you ever heard or driven on the triple nickel down here in southern Ohio?

Max Kaiserman: Tencent. Shy of a quarter.

William Ross: Yeah. Where is that? No, look it up.

It’s like a 60 mile stretch, Southeastern Ohio, just southeast of Columbus, going down to Hocking Hills and that stuff over down to about Athens areas. My understanding, it’s supposed to be incredible in [00:42:00] Ohio, almost like a tail of the dragon type situa. I mean, not that tight and twisty, but just glass, smooth roads, everything like that.

Yeah, so I just came across this the other day, the triple nickel they call it.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m gonna ask again. In Ohio?

William Ross: Yeah, in Ohio. I mean, I was shocked too. Now, many, many moons ago, I was driving to this little rink town in Kentucky that was right across the river from Ohio Covington. And I had to get off 71 and I was going down these roads and I literally, I stopped at this intersection.

’cause I was out in the middle of, this does not seem right, ’cause all of a sudden the road is telling me to go down. Was like fresh asphalt. So I started driving it and it was gorgeous. It went along a river, a stream, and it was just glass smoothly. It just paved, it, hilly, everything like that. Middle of nowhere.

And then all of a sudden you pop out onto the one highway that goes along the Ohio River. ’cause then other side’s, Kentucky. I’m just like outta nowhere. Look up the triple nickel. ’cause we’re gonna have to maybe do that one day. ’cause it, it looks awesome

Crew Chief Eric: again. I’m gonna ask Ohio,

William Ross: Zanesville, Ohio, apparently due east of Columbus.

She got it. It looks like it’s Route [00:43:00] 7 63 in southern Ohio. Here’s a fun thing though. If you wanna deviate off it, you could hit suck, run road just for shits and giggles. I think it’s it’s West Fork Road you hit and then it dumps you into 7 63, which takes you straight down, basically right to dead ends into the Ohio River.

Right across is from Maysville, Kentucky. Which is a really cool little town to Max’s point, you know, there’s so many, especially the Appalachia area and everything like that. Southern Ohio, West Virginia, Kentucky, and stuff like that. I mean, there are so many cool little towns. They have all the historical things, everything.

It’s, it’s a lot of fun. They’re really cool things to go do. Gainesville’s right off 70, so if you take 70 over, you pass through that part. Road Track does a lot of stuff on it. Bringing our cars down there, especially when they’re up in Detroit.

Max Kaiserman: The one that I want to talk about, especially now that my 9 9 1 has its winter tires on because below 50 degrees, summer tires on that thing are a little spicy.

Pennsylvania. Route 32 takes you through Bucks County, Pennsylvania, through [00:44:00] the town of New Hope. It goes along the Delaware River and in fall time it’s absolutely gorgeous. So in the wintertime it just looks like. Marshmallow town. I mean, it is, it’s one of the nicest drives. It is a Pennsylvania roots, so they do clear it regularly if it snows.

Executive Producer Tania: Wait a second. You said it looks like a field of marshmallows. This is in Pennsylvania. You didn’t mean a pumpkin patch. Orange cones everywhere. It’s

Max Kaiserman: okay. I assume this episode’s coming out in December, so it might have snowed once by then.

Executive Producer Tania: He, he missed a construction joke. Yeah. Yeah.

Max Kaiserman: Oh, oh, yeah. Well, you know, when there’s snow on the ground, you can’t tell where the potholes are.

It makes it more interesting

Crew Chief Eric: trying to say something about Pennsylvania roads.

Max Kaiserman: You know, we have a thing about Pennsylvania roads. If you’re going straight down the road, you get pulled over for drunk driving.

Crew Chief Eric: That’s awesome.

Max Kaiserman: Philadelphia’s pothole, city man. But it’s one of the nicest drives and it’s just 20, 30 minutes outside downtown Philadelphia. So that’s something that you [00:45:00] can find. There’s actually a number of websites and stuff that you can look up, you know, best drive in my town or in the state that you live in.

Crew Chief Eric: Speaking of organized drives. William, you joined up with Mike from ESC Carbon Wheels and you did one of the Tail of the Dragon runs with them, right? One of the Porsche runs or something like that. I

William Ross: went there and met up with them when they were doing it. I took my X five and I whipped that thing around on the tail of the dragon.

You know, Josh, who puts those together, does an awesome job.

Crew Chief Eric: And that’s Smokey Mountain Drives, if I remember correctly. That’s the parent organization. There you go. Of all those different organized rides that they do.

William Ross: And he owns actually, um, it was a building, but he’s got a little restaurant and everything there too.

Like the one end of it. It’s a meeting point. And I said he know he’s doing a heck of a job organizing driving this. So, I mean, it’s a great little, uh, setup he’s got now. I know me. I mean, you’ve had many conversations about paying for going on a public road and everything like that, but if you’ve never been to Tail of Dragon, it’s kind of like one of those must see things.

Hey, if you’re a car person, you gotta go drive it. It’s just a lot of fun. But giving someone $300, it’s a public road. Just go whenever you want and [00:46:00] drive it. I dunno, I guess it’s a camaraderie group and they’re getting, you know, two, 300 people to go on this. So, I mean, they got a couple hundred cars and he’s not just doing Porsche, he does Corvette, he does air cooled only, stuff like that.

So, I mean, he, he’s really got something there in regards to. That crowd and just getting together and there’s a resort, you know, they got cabins, everything right, but they’re really nice. Like basically little houses got a main area of where the big gathering, everything like that. It’s a lot of fun. I mean, it’s really cool and not only just being part of that group, but all the other people you’re gonna meet there.

There’s just tons and tons of people that go there. Now you’re gonna have your morons and everything like that too. There are just hundreds and hundreds of youngsters running around on those little a d CCC or whatever the heck you call ’em, one twenty five CCC with the small wheels, whatever, you know, whatever you wanna call ’em, little monkey bikes, whatever, just whipping all over the place on that.

But I will say they do look out for everyone because they do that universal thing. If there’s a cop ahead, they tap their head. So if you’re going the opposite way, you’ll kind of give you a heads up. That’s really cool. That’s definitely a [00:47:00] must do for someone. That’s the road that’s known now here, say in the eastern United States to hit and you got angels Crest on the West coast.

It’s really cool too. If you never did that, definitely go do that as well. And again, public road, don’t have to pay anyone to go

Crew Chief Eric: on it. To close out that thought. If you’re thinking about this as a holiday gift for the car enthusiast in your life, check out the different car clubs. Because they oftentimes organize cover bridges, tours, or these like back road, you know, road rallies and stuff where they do these destination, what they call drive and dines and things like that.

And you don’t have to look too much further than clubs like SCCA. The Porsche Club, the Audi Club, BMW, doesn’t matter really what kind of car you drive, they’ll welcome anybody. But they do organize these types of trips and they’re low cost, low risk, high fun type of gift that you can give. And you can do it together.

You can do it as a family. Max, you’re talking, you have a cayenne, why not pack the whole family in and go for a road trip?

Max Kaiserman: Yeah. The best also is you’ll find some really interesting [00:48:00] stores and shops and restaurants. Along those roots, some of them that have been there for a long time. I, I’m a huge fan of the Hole in the Wall diner.

And, uh, you know, my family always made a point that we’d never go to like a Red Robin or something. If you’re in somebody’s town, try the local flavor. I gotta tell you, now that I’ve been, I’ve been driving my 61 Corvette quite a bit. I got it about a month ago, and I drive it a lot until it started getting cold out.

Park that in front of a restaurant and take a picture and put it up on Instagram or something like that. It’s actually, it’s a good hit for that restaurant. You’d be amazed what is alongside these historic roads, not on the highway. You know, like these are little state route and things like that.

Crew Chief Eric: Your question’s kind of tough.

Because immediately you get all the top gear, roads that come to mind, Stelvio Pass, and to your point, tail of the Dragon, I mean, you know all these famous roads, but it’s those roads in your area that maybe you don’t think about so much and maybe some of them you just take for granted. You’re like, Hey, it’s a bunch of, you know, hilly roads.

Max Kaiserman: Lincoln Drive in Philadelphia and Owens around is awesome. [00:49:00] I’d never recommend it. Obviously if it’s busy, it’s stop and go and there’s a lot of blind turns. But I did it the other night at about 11, and my license plate number is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Pennsylvania State Police in the 9 9 1 at like 11 or one o’clock in the morning or so.

Lincoln Drive is incredible. There’s also, there’s like West River Drive and stuff, which is beautiful and it’s also, they just reopened West River Drive, which bypasses I 76. The Schuell Expressway down the Schull River, and it’s one of the nicest, you know, and you come right up at the art museum. So like, there are these great little moments that you can have, even if you live in a city.

I’m just, I’m just talking about Philadelphia, New York. Uh, I almost got into a fender bender on the Bronx Expressway on Wednesday. But like, there’s little places that you can find anywhere if you wanna take your car out, whether it’s fast or not. I mean, it really, it can be a scenic drive. There’s lovely places around dc.

There’s places obviously in LA and stuff. You wanna have a weekend in Las Vegas. That ride from LA to Vegas is a lot of [00:50:00] fun. It’s a lot of straightaways through the desert, through Barstow and stuff.

Executive Producer Tania: And if you are in that DC metro area, to your point of a scenic ride, the Blue Ridge or Skyline Drive, that whole area is only a couple hours outside the city.

And. Obviously in the fall time it’s a very popular destination to see all the colors changing and the trees. It’s not going to be a high speed road trip because it’s definitely governed, ’cause you’re entering Shenandoah National Park. But it is definitely worth it if you are in the area and you’ve never been before.

Crew Chief Eric: You know, and Tanya brings up a good point. I was thinking, how do I not talk about something like Blue Ridge Parkway or Skyline Drive? Even out west things like, you know, the Canyon Roads, Mulholland and Angela’s crests and all those types of places like that. And the one that actually popped into my head, which is a really great driving road, which you’re not supposed to do with a truck and trailer, a big one.

But when you’re hauling a race car, that’s a different story. It’s actually the Taconic State Parkway on the way to Limerock the whole way up [00:51:00] through New York to Connecticut to go to Limerock. That is a heck of a drive. It’s beautiful old New England, tight, windy roads all the way up. From the city to the racetrack.

It’s kinda like a double destination. You wanna drive the road to Limerock so you can get to Limerock and drive Limerock. You might as well double down. So to me, that’s the kind of great escape road that I would take, especially as an automotive enthusiast. I think that would be a lot of fun.

Max Kaiserman: I got one route, nine N.

From Lake George to Ty Kon Rogan, New York. It’s spring, summer, fall. It’s amazing. In the wintertime, you think you’re gonna die, but the uh, route nine end alongside on the west side of Lake George going north or coming back down is absolutely incredible and so much so that they have built. Four or five lookout points where you just have to pull over and take a picture.

That’s a lot of fun. I did that in the Cayenne actually recently. We, we were at a show up in Tay Kon rug in New York and stayed in Lake George and went up and down every day for this thing, and that was a lot of fun too.

Crew Chief Eric: Good [00:52:00] Call Max. I like that. That’s a good holiday gift.

Max Kaiserman: Quick, easy vacation you can take with your car and with special someone or by yourself.

It’s something cost nothing but a tank of gas.

Crew Chief Eric: Well, Brad, I guess it’s time we bring this holiday episode to a close.

Crew Chief Brad: Did you know that you can buy track days or gift cards to track events for the petrolhead in your life? Organizations like Hooked on Driving Chen Track Days, David Murray Track Days, and many others offer you the ability to buy track time for others.

Heck out their websites for more information.

JUST TRACK IT PROMO: Want to get on track next season, then you need to just track it. Save 10% off any 2026 event registration with the coupon code BF 2026. To use the coupon register for the event on club registration.net and in the payment screen, use BF 2 0 2 6. In the promo code field, coupon code will be active from November 27th to 30.

The 2026 [00:53:00] calendar of events for Just Track. It is already available with exciting venues like Barber Motorsports Park Road, Atlanta Robing Road, Atlanta Motorsports Park, and Carolina Motorsports Park all on the roster for next season. In addition, just track it is expanding its ladies only program, which kicked off in 2025, featuring half day events at locations like Barbara and Road Atlanta with three on tracks.

Sessions that include an in-car instructor classroom training on the fundamentals of high performance driving and a rental helmet all at a discounted price. And the best part, the run group is Ladies only for more information on Just track it and their HPDE programs look no further than just track it.net and be sure use that BF 2026 coupon code at checkout.

Crew Chief Brad: As a reminder, you can find tons of upcoming local shows and events for the holiday season at the Ultimate reference for Car Enthusiast. Collector car guy.net

Don Weberg: oh oh oh. Merry Christmas since 2007, garage Style Magazine [00:54:00] has been the definitive source for car collectors continually delivering information about Automobilia Petroliana events and more.

To learn more about the annual publication and its new website, be sure to follow them on social media at Garage Style Magazine or log onto www.garagestylemagazine.com because after all, what doesn’t belong in your garage? Merry Christmas, a filthy animal and a happy new year.

Executive Producer Tania: It is been an amazing year for our team, and to date, we’ve already beat our goal for the year, producing over 100 episodes in a season on the Motoring Podcast Network, which includes shows like Break Fix, the Motoring historian, the Ferrari Marketplace, evening with a legend.

What should I buy? Screen to speed, and of course, the drive-through don’t go away. There’s still tons more to come as season six concludes in February, and then we’ll head into all sorts of new and exciting [00:55:00] programming for the 2026 season. So stay tuned to Break Fix Podcast. And our digital magazine@gtmotorsports.org for more details.

Crew Chief Eric: Folks, you’ve probably heard Brad say many times that you can sign up for Patreon for free, and there are lots of great extras and bonuses for you to enjoy, but there are folks in our community, friends of the show and sponsors that have gone the extra mile and donated to help support the Motoring Podcast network and shows like Break Fix and the drive through.

And we wanna acknowledge those folks personally.

Crew Chief Brad: Edward Hughes ii.

Crew Chief Eric: Lori Preston Lerner. Jim Manley, Dougie Kite Bill

Crew Chief Brad: Jordan DeCosta.

Crew Chief Eric: Mark Steigerwald. Mike Smith,

Crew Chief Brad: David Beatie.

Crew Chief Eric: Ella. BL

Crew Chief Brad: Meya Chu,

Crew Chief Eric: Deanne Hops, Miami. Miami 47.

Crew Chief Brad: Austin Belzer,

Crew Chief Eric: Ruben Sanchez, W2 one 15 Motorsport,

Crew Chief Brad: Marissa Cannon,

Crew Chief Eric: Andrew, Maureen Romano Conte,

Crew Chief Brad: Mike Rigo,

Crew Chief Eric: max [00:56:00] Derby, Ashley Macelli, Robert Barr, mark Shank, Mark Hewitt, Bob Gillespie, Janet and Brian Wartell.

Brett Derby, Andrew Re, Brian Young. David Scherf, run Kei, BJ Harrington, Sean Roberts. Story

Crew Chief Brad: Brill,

Crew Chief Eric: Rebecca Griffith, Ryan Compton,

Crew Chief Brad: Ron Richter, Dr. Gordon Bell, Ron Shery, and Mike and Chrissy Crutchfield.

Crew Chief Eric: Additionally, we’d like to thank all of our sponsors who helped us kick butt this season.

Crew Chief Brad: William Ross in the Exotic Car Marketplace.

Executive Producer Tania: Don Weiberg from Garage Style Magazine.

Crew Chief Brad: The

Crew Chief Eric: motoring historian John Summers. David Middleton from MIE Racing

Executive Producer Tania: Steffi Bow and the team at In it eSports.

Crew Chief Eric: Allison Kreitzer from the Eastern Museum of Motor Racing, David Lowe and the A-C-O-U-S-A Team.

Executive Producer Tania: Rob parr@collectorcarguide.net,

Crew Chief Eric: the International Motor Racing Research Center in

Crew Chief Brad: Project Motoring

Executive Producer Tania: and with special thanks to many, many others.

Crew Chief Brad: A thank you to our co-host and [00:57:00] executive producer Tanya, and all the fans, friends and family who support GTM. Without you, none of this would be possible. Happy holidays everyone. Ho, ho, ho.

Woo dishes go. If I sell that shit, maybe, maybe I should turn that shit off then. Alright, real quick, we’ll make some be

Crew Chief Eric: technical difficulties. This is where the color pattern and the Indian head comes in. Why did

Crew Chief Brad: I even fucking turn that on?

Executive Producer Tania: This is a test of the emergency broadcast system. Oh my goodness.

In the event of a real emergency, you

Crew Chief Brad: should

Executive Producer Tania: have used the actual microphone.

Crew Chief Brad: Well, I’m not home. Yeah, I know you’re not home.

Executive Producer Tania: He’s using a 1970s microphone. So tracks.

Max Kaiserman: Hey guys, on that note, I gotta go. Alright Max, we’ll see you. Thank you. Thanks for you. Alright,

William Ross: cool. Yeah, that should be a good one too.[00:58:00]

Executive Producer Tania: The drive-through is our monthly news episode and is sponsored in part by organizations like Collector Car guide.net Project, motoring Garage Style Magazine, the Exotic Car Marketplace, and many others. If you’re interested in becoming a sponsor of the drive through, look no further than www.motoringpodcast.net.

Click about and then advertising. Thank you again to everyone that supports the Motoring Podcast Network, grand Touring Motorsports, our podcast, break Fix, and all the other services we provide.

Highlights

Skip ahead if you must… Here’s the highlights from this episode you might be most interested in and their corresponding time stamps.

  • 00:00 Holiday Shopping Guide for Petrolheads
  • 01:15 The Automotive Dating Game Begins
  • 02:05 Question Round: Getting to Know the Cars
  • 12:06 Final Questions and Decision Time
  • 13:10 Revealing the Cars!
  • 22:31 Three Wise Volks: Gift Ideas for Petrolheads
  • 28:06 Luna Replicas: Classic Car Apparel
  • 29:45 More Gift Ideas for Car Enthusiasts
  • 33:33 Rich People Thangs: Colognes and Watches
  • 40:51 Car-Related Vacations and Scenic Drives
  • 52:11 Track Days and Car Clubs
  • 54:33 Thank You and Acknowledgements

Ghosts of Holiday Specials Past

Behind the Scenes

Guest Co-Host: William Ross

In case you missed it... be sure to check out the Break/Fix episode with our co-host.
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Guest Co-Host: Max Kaiserman

In case you missed it... be sure to check out the Break/Fix episode with our co-host.
Listen on Apple
Listen on YouTube
Listen on Spotify

Reading List

Don't miss out on great book like this one, or other titles we've read and covered as part of the GTM Bookclub on Break/Fix Podcast.
My Travels On Racer Road: Can-Am and Formula 1 in their golden age
DeLorean: The Rise, Fall and Second Acts of the DeLorean Motor Company
A French Kiss with Death
Driving to the Future: Living life following Formula One racing
Tales From the Garage
Geared for Life: Making the Shift Into Your Full Potential
Ultimate Garages
Fenders, Fins & Friends: Confessions of a Car Guy
Racing While Black: How an African-American Stock Car Team Made Its Mark on NASCAR
The Last Lap: The Mysterious Demise of Pete Kreis at The Indianapolis 500
James Dean: On The Road To Salinas
Performance Thinking: Mental Skills for the Competitive World...and for Life!
The Other Side of the Fence: Six Decades of Motorsport Photography
Racing with Rich Energy
Little Anton: A Historical Novel Complete Series
Lone Rider: The First British Woman to Motorcycle Around the World
Iacocca: An Autobiography
Colin Chapman: The Man and His Cars: The Authorized Biography by Gerard Crombac
Paved Paradise: How Parking Explains the World
Shipwrecked and Rescued: Cars and Crew: The


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